What would China be like today if the Nationalists had won the Chinese Civil War?

[gambit]

Most great famine pics in China were actually belonged to the ROC era.

Those haters were really shameless to frame CPC by fabricating those fake evidences.

Sure...And the Cultural Revolution was also a fabrication.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Were the Cultural Revolution and the Great Famine necessary ? Of course they were, speaking from one -- YOU -- who does not have to suffer them.

Putting words in my mouth?

No they were not necessary, they were mistakes and failures.

No...If the KMT won, they would have used that victory to rally the Chinese people, just like how the Communists did, to lead China. There would be no Taiwan, other than as an island province. There would be no Great Famine and no Cultural Revolution. The KMT would not have imported Lysenko-ism but genuine science from the West. China would be greater than she is today.

Your belief is rooted in ideology. When you escaped from South Vietnam it was still the Cold War, but that time has passed.

Ideology is meaningless to me. I'm a Hong Konger who went to an International school, I have no ideology, I only care about what works.

KMT had their chance to restore the power of the Chinese civilization, Hell they can still contribute today. But they don't, instead they work against their own motherland.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

DPP can be a blessing for us pro-China unification groups, as well, in giving the Mainland the perfect excuse to finish it off once and for all.

I can guarantee, there will be people cheering as well as a lot crying. But they will cry like Joshua Wang. So, just b*** slapping will suffice.

The hardcore dark green DPP trolls will try to instigate the tension, but it will give PRC a valid excuse to take Taiwan back.

As for the light green DPP folks are just the normal people by the majority, and CPC will eventually turn them into the normal Chinese citizens once their anti-China mentality got deprogrammed.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Nah,China lost a big part of its territory in KMT period.KMT is a girly coward party.

Not sure. KMT was the party busy fighting the Japs where the communists were recruiting people against the KMT. I do not tell Communist didnt fight the war.
But Large majority agree that it was the KMT which did the large part of fighting against the Japanese. If not for the war, KMT would have won the war.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Not sure. KMT was the party busy fighting the Japs where the communists were recruiting people against the KMT. I do not tell Communist didnt fight the war.
But Large majority agree that it was the KMT which did the large part of fighting against the Japanese. If not for the war, KMT would have won the war.

Check the history books.

Did you know Chiang Kai-shek was kidnapped by his own generals, in order to FORCE him to fight against the Japanese?

His own generals had to kidnap him in order to get him to fight against the Japanese, how disgusting is that.

The KMT preferred to fight their fellow Chinese rather than the foreign invaders, and that is what doomed us.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Putting words in my mouth?

No they were not necessary, they were mistakes and failures.



Your belief is rooted in ideology. When you escaped from South Vietnam it was still the Cold War, but that time has passed.

Ideology is meaningless to me. I'm a Hong Konger who went to an International school, I have no ideology, I only care about what works.

KMT had their chance to restore the power of the Chinese civilization, Hell they can still contribute today. But they don't, instead they work against their own motherland.

Believe me, a military unification with Taiwan will actually cause the minimal casualty, it will also to terrorize China's enemies.

And HK's problems will also be solved once the one country one system policy is applied to Taiwan.

 

[Rajaraja Chola]

Check the history books.

Did you know Chiang Kai-shek was kidnapped by his own generals, in order to FORCE him to fight against the Japanese?

Chiang Kai-shek preferred to fight his fellow Chinese rather than the foreign invaders, and that is what doomed us.

I agree that I do not know the intricate details of the war. My knowledge is from the western publications or from the Japs.
But considering your Point of View, are you telling me Communists were the one who majorly fought the Japanese? Wasnt Nanjing the capital of the KMT, when the Japanese did untellable horrors?

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

I agree that I do not know the intricate details of the war.

You call that an "intricate detail"? Chiang Kai-shek REFUSED to fight the Japanese. His own generals had to kidnap him to force him to do it!

BTW I went to an International School in Hong Kong before the handover, so I learned this from international textbooks. This is mainstream history.

 

[EAsian]

Not sure. KMT was the party busy fighting the Japs where the communists were recruiting people against the KMT. I do not tell Communist didnt fight the war.
But Large majority agree that it was the KMT which did the large part of fighting against the Japanese. If not for the war, KMT would have won the war.

KMT was official ruling party in WWII，while CPC was no more than a guerrilla force.It was ridiculous to compare them at the first place.KMT have tens of times of resource of What CPC had.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

How about if I break your left leg when your right leg was already lame ? Is that a better analogy ?

How did CPC policies make things worse lol? By all objective measures things were better in mainland China in 1959 than they were in 1949. The same can't be said of Taiwan, which at the time was sustaining itself only through American aid and preparing for a megalomaniac dictator's crazy offensive against mainland China (much like Kim Il Sung's North Korea). Meanwhile Taiwan in 1949 had very good infrastructure from Japan but Chiang Kai Shek neglected that to funnel money to the military (and himself).

What, you forgot that Chiang Kai Shek was still a military dictator lol?

 

[Beast]

Not necessarily so. The Emperor of Japan was the one who surrendered , even against the wishes of the Army.

I'm not in favor of labeling people as "capitulationist" or what have you.

All I'm saying is that we should (and you) consider the context and reasoning for actions done.

Its part of a speculative inquiry, this is part of research.




GREAT points, buddy, and please, I'd like to hear your views on Wang Jingwei , Wu Sanghui. Any comparisons?

Wang Jiwei cannot compare to wusangui. At least Qing proved benevolent and treat Chinese decent. The japanese treat Chinese with contempt and killed large number of Chinese. There is reason why Qing can ruled China for 2 hundred over years while japanese occupation of part of China last 8years only. Wang is indeed a traitor to Chinese.

 

[FairAndUnbiased]

Not sure. KMT was the party busy fighting the Japs where the communists were recruiting people against the KMT. I do not tell Communist didnt fight the war.
But Large majority agree that it was the KMT which did the large part of fighting against the Japanese. If not for the war, KMT would have won the war.

KMT had the *DUTY* to fight Japan because they were the government in power. CPC was not in power. They did not command forces of the state. They were legally unable to prosecute a war against Japan because they were not legally authorized to declare war! Only in 1941 did the KMT even declare war against Japan! CPC had absolutely no moral or legal obligation to do anything other than use words against Japan, yet they spent their own money and hundreds of thousands of CPC members died in the war against Japan. It was absolutely irrelevant what the CPC did since as long as they did not engage in operations against the KMT or undermine the KMT economy (they did neither) during the duration of the war, and morally spoke out against the invaders, they had fulfilled all their duties as a party out of power.

You can't equate KMT and CPC of the time. Just as if the PRC was to be at war today, it would be absolutely laughable if the CPC said to KMT - you are a traitor if you don't help. The CPC is the party in power today thus they have the duty to defend the country. The KMT has no legal or moral obligation to physically do anything; they only need offer moral support.

 

[JSCh]

If the nationalist has won? Well, that didn't happen.

After the end of WWII, Chiang has great approval from the Chinese people because it is general recognized that he lead China to a victory against Japanese invader.

But the guy screwed it up beyond all recognition.

I think many are too optimistic about the KMT. Assuming that everything would be great if KMT has maintain power.

For one thing, KMT represent the privileged class in China. There is a very good likelihood of a Chiang family Dynasty. President in ROC is politically/constitutional set up to have near dictatorial power.

The https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_big_families_of_the_Republic_of_China would have maintain their firm grip on the political, financial, commercial and industrial field in China.

It is illogical to assume that it would be smooth sailing after KMT won the civil war. And that the turmoil that China experience under CCP would not have similar or comparable event under KMT.

Remember that the US were bent on the cold war. For KMT to integrate into the western camp, it would have to crack down HARD on communism. Remember the communist purge that happened in say, S. Korea, Indonesia and all the other dictatorial power that US supported. Imagine them happening in China in a grand scale. Because Chinese does have a culturally socialist bend. That would mean that there be sizable communist/socialist in China, there is no guarantee that KMT would managed to have China under control.

The choice would be military dictatorship or you guess it, India.

One major differences between the two. KMT is conservative, CCP is progressive.

CCP might have fail monumentally in some of their experiment. But only CCP could have drag Chinese people, whether they like it or not, into modernity in such a short span of time.

 

[dy1022]

Sure...And the Cultural Revolution was also a fabrication.

China is China today with Cultural Revolution, India is India today without Cultural Revolution!

 

[XiaoYaoZi Backup]

Wang Jiwei cannot compare to wusangui. At least Qing proved benevolent and treat Chinese decent. The japanese treat Chinese with contempt and killed large number of Chinese. There is reason why Qing can ruled China for 2 hundred over years while japanese occupation of part of China last 8years only. Wang is indeed a traitor to Chinese.

When Mongol and Manchu ruled China, they assimilated themselves with Han culture and became Chinese themselves. But Japanese dare to brainwash our people and fabricate the history to try to eliminate our precious culture, the Japan is doomed to elimination.