What kept India united after the British left?

[El Sidd]

It would be based more on religious and cultural lines imho. Obv someone from India will be able to tell us more easily and in detail.
@Nilgiri

Ofcourse they will.

Lets see

 

[Indus Pakistan]

The next 50 years for India will decide the fate of largest number of humans on earth. Traditional society tends to be stratified and stable. The upper crust fights, quarrels, rules, wins or loses. The rest of the layers of society just keep living like they always did.

However modern world brings change. It rips and shakes up the stratified order - this causes chaos and internal instability as each seam in the stratum tries to arrive at new order that provides it with political and economic rights. Eventually after much tussle it all reforms into a stable new order. Pakistan right now is going through the internal instability caused by the old stratified order being broken and ripped around in a vortex. Thus the TTP, religious groups, ethnic groups, sectarian groups etc all pushing and shoving. The entire core of society is disturbed until things eventually reform into a new stable order.

India is just now about to enter this phase and next 50 years will decide where she goes. The Naxalites are a harbinger of what is to come. At present over 50% of India is still tied like frozen layers but soon they will begin to shake loose. Imagine for a second 300 million Dalits get mobilized and shake the present order to get a better deal?

Right now whjat you call India is mirror of 30% of the population at the top. Wait till the bottom 30% are freed from the shackles and demand their rights and you will see chaos in India.

Myth number 1:


The upper-caste population is huge. The fair, tall, vegetarian, confident men and women of the priestly Brahmin, warrior Kshatriya and trading Vaishya must be more in number than the dark, short, servile Shudras and the Untouchables. The latter kind, Shudras and the Untouchables, who subsisted on farming, cow-herding and manual labour, whom historians such as Romila Thapar call the original inhabitants of India until the Aryan invasion in 1,500 BCE, are still around as Backward Castes (BCs), Scheduled Castes (SCs) and Scheduled Tribes (STs). But they’re only a few and live afar, in the villages and forests. This myth on the number will be broken with the caste census. We will see the BCs, STs, and SCs forming the majority, somewhere in the range of 70 percent of the population. It’s just that this population is still so servile, and invisible to the national mainstream, that many mistake the visible as the majority. Now, the invisible will make the majority.


Let’s look at this popular misconception of visibility and invisibility another way. If you’re an Indian, or a foreigner who is familiar with India, the chances of you recognising one or many well-known personalities with the following surnames are plenty: Mukherjee, Ganguly, Mishra, Sharma, Iyer, Murthy, Joshi, Rao, Namboothiripad, Kamath, Haksar, Kaul, Goswamy, Tiwari, Vajpayee (Brahmin); Rathore, Raju, Singh, Sisodia, Rana, Bedi, Jadeja, Tanwar, Adhikari (Kshatriya); Mittal, Gupta, Singhal, Goyal, Patel, Khanna, Kapur, Vohra, Shetty (Vaishya). In India’s prevailing hierarchy of social status, men and women with upper caste surnames, like the above, generate an image of confidence, power, social dignity and omnipresence among us—omnipresence, because they’re everywhere from politics to cricket; and even the educated and well-exposed make no attempt not to use their caste names.


Juxtapose those names with the following surnames, or caste names, that don’t come so easy to our tongues, primarily because we don’t hear them in the national mainstream: Adi Karnataka, Shendurnikar, Valluvan, Tirkey, Khakha, Adi Dravida, Paraiyar, Kaibarta, Namasudra (SC); Santal, Paniya, Kurichiya, Oraon, Kumre, Naitam, Bedar, Bhumija, Mala Araya, Bhil, Yerukala (ST); Kamati, Yadav, Maso, Ezhava, Jatab (BC).


The figures that will emerge from Census 2011 can’t be very different from those of 1931. When the British last counted caste, Brahmins accounted for only 6.4 percent of the population, Rajputs 3.7 percent and Banias 2.7 percent. The backward castes, excluding the Dalits and tribal people, came to 43.7 percent. In 2011, as a block, the Shudras and Untouchables could reach 70 percent of the Indian population.

http://www.caravanmagazine.in/perspectives/counting-castes

What does this all mean? Real India is hidden away. Speechless. Not represented in media. It's a shadow, a huge shadow that will begin to make it presence. Whether that bring chaos to India sufficient to rip it apart is to be seen but chaos is around the corner.

 

[Laozi]

You counter you own argument. That means hinduism has no vital role in India being united after British left.

you win

 

[Indus Pakistan]

f you ask Indians, 99% will not know this. Why are you babbling nonsense?

Hahaha ...

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

1.Long anti-colonial struggle at all-india level under one organization.
2.Common dharmic tradition in religion being a majority,and the only sizeable country in the world where these values were eminent.While many don't like to acknowledge this element due to this not being in tune with declared secular credentials,it is a powerful underlying force.
3.Long historical experience,further exposed by historical studies.The understanding that whenever united, india has resisted external threats be it greeks,huns or arabs and whenever divided overrun and the determination to learn from mistakes of history.Especially with 2 dangerous armed neighbours surrounding us.Divided we will fall.
4.Early leadership during formative period whom despite their faults believed in democracy and diversity and invested in them.
5.Modern communications technology and cultural unifiers(cinema,sports,language blocs)
6.Understanding union is for greater economic benefit of all.The states on their own would be small relatively powerless units helpless in the international stage and not self sufficient in raw materials,together they are a formidable force.
7.A definite geographic boundary,bounded by himalayas in north and indian ocean south.Combined with a historical understanding of bharatvarsha ,propounded from times of the ancient epics thousands of years ago and passed down.
8.Wars.
9.Pride in being indian as it increases in power and prosperity as a nation globally.Particularly amongst the diaspora and the elite .

 

[war&peace]

So more slogans for the mob?

how?

 

[El Sidd]

how?

Lol you will find out.

Patience

 

[Pakistani E]

Neither it is united nor its stable to begin with.

The large part belongs to the fact that status quo hasn't changed much in India. Which fought two aggressive wars on your tiny neighbours and the fact you keep them harassed by use of terrorism be it the Tamil Tigers or TTP or Mukti Bahani.

Every time you make a booboo at home your establishment starts a war.

Aptly named hypocrite and mother of all terrorism.

Once a hipsters paradise. Now the rape capital of the world.

Incredible India

A mob masquerading as a nation.

Why is this post negative rated?

WTF? It's legitimate perception from our side.

@Kaptaan @PakSword @The Sandman @war&peace @Zibago @Spring Onion @Awan68 @Moonlight @Kami leone @Sher Shah Awan @Joe Shearer @Well.wisher @HAKIKAT @Hell hound @Zarvan @django

Solve me this puzzle intelligently please.

Hatred for Pakistan.

 

[El Sidd]

Why is this post negative rated?

WTF? It's legitimate perception from our side.

Sadly this perception can be proven and the money traced.

But what do you think unites India?

 

[Indus Pakistan]

india has resisted external threats be it greeks

When exactly did India resist Greeks?

 

[Pakistani E]

Sadly this perception can be proven and the money traced.

But what do you think unites India?

In a little bit more detail, when the partition happened, there was a large nationalist fervour of uniting around the idea of Hindustan and to be not Pakistan. Simply, to not be Pakistan. That's why all their leaders harped on about how Pakistan won't survive. It was what they kept the people fed on, what their establishment told their people, that if you go your own way and disunite from them, you will not succeed.

 

[El Sidd]

In a little bit more detail, when the partition happened, there was a large nationalist fervour of uniting around the idea of Hindustan and to be not Pakistan. Simply, to not be Pakistan. That's why all their leaders harped on about how Pakistan won't survive. It was what they kept the people fed on, what their establishment told their people, that if you go your own way and disunite from them, you will not succeed.

@CHACHA"G" the fear part is here

 

[Indus Pakistan]

In essence , the chaos you are waiting for is already here for last 30 Years. It is the Silent revolution going on.

The trouble is going to come from SC and ST who make almost 25% of India. The Dalits/Shudras and Tribals. Right now they are utterly repressed. Citing one or two "tokens" does not tell the reality. Most are hidden away in the countryside. Let them move into urban areas in large numbers. Let them start really shaking to gain their rights and then see what happens. We are talking about a group that is nearly 300 million strong.

And Modi is not SC or ST. Don't cite a few "token Nigers". Read the article below. Also why was the "caste count" of 2011 kept hush by the government?

http://www.caravanmagazine.in/perspectives/counting-castes

 

[Nilgiri]

It would be based more on religious and cultural lines imho. Obv someone from India will be able to tell us more easily and in detail.
@Nilgiri

Yes appreciation of shared culture, history, language groups, art, music, philosophy, economy...you name it...it varies from person to person how these manifest and prioritise. Also being mindful, tolerant and appreciative of the differences and variations is an important nuanced part of Nationalism (more fundamentally able to compromise and cooperate for a perceived greater good). I can go to a temple in the north and see what practices are the same that I am used to in the South, which ones are different etc... I am sure people do the same for other religions and cultural experiences.....ability to do so makes any nation stronger (i.e having diversity and recognising how to harness that positively).

When this kind of nationalism is not present, then more negative types of nationalism often seep in (i.e nationalism for nationalism sake or nationalism largely focused on other nations/groups etc.). This has also played some role for sure in India's case in her modern history....and it is of course a more global one too. This one often also attracts the most attention because essentially it harnesses the more visceral emotions too. These people are also the ones that tend to be fickle and can be easily manipulated and swayed even to level of becoming what they originally swore to destroy....because simply they are often after the rush of having something to be visceral against rather than logically constructing an identity from within.

There are also those that also have neither the positive or negative nationalism too....simply wanting to exist and get on with their lives (either as part of recognising no true nations exist under larger supernatural entities or newer movements taking their place....or simply just being totally unfeeling to all of it in the first place, or in most cases having no time given the pressing requirement of basic survival) and just through coincidence on their part find national identity around them and have to adapt and manage that. Though in our day and age globally, such people are now rarer and rarer given the polarisation seeping in....and everyone having to pick a clear perceived side on the matter.

 

[Corona]

The next 50 years for India will decide the fate of largest number of humans on earth. Traditional society tends to be stratified and stable. The upper crust fights, quarrels, rules, wins or loses. The rest of the layers of society just keep living like they always did.

However modern world brings change. It rips and shakes up the stratified order - this causes chaos and internal instability as each seam in the stratum tries to arrive at new order that provides it with political and economic rights. Eventually after much tussle it all reforms into a stable new order. Pakistan right now is going through the internal instability caused by the old stratified order being broken and ripped around in a vortex. Thus the TTP, religious groups, ethnic groups, sectarian groups etc all pushing and shoving. The entire core of society is disturbed until things eventually reform into a new stable order.

India is just now about to enter this phase and next 50 years will decide where she goes. The Naxalites are a harbinger of what is to come. At present over 50% of India is still tied like frozen layers but soon they will begin to shake loose. Imagine for a second 300 million Dalits get mobilized and shake the present order to get a better deal?

Right now whjat you call India is mirror of 30% of the population at the top. Wait till the bottom 30% are freed from the shackles and demand their rights and you will see chaos in India.

Myth number 1:


The upper-caste population is huge. The fair, tall, vegetarian, confident men and women of the priestly Brahmin, warrior Kshatriya and trading Vaishya must be more in number than the dark, short, servile Shudras and the Untouchables. The latter kind, Shudras and the Untouchables, who subsisted on farming, cow-herding and manual labour, whom historians such as Romila Thapar call the original inhabitants of India until the Aryan invasion in 1,500 BCE, are still around as Backward Castes (BCs), Scheduled Castes (SCs) and Scheduled Tribes (STs). But they’re only a few and live afar, in the villages and forests. This myth on the number will be broken with the caste census. We will see the BCs, STs, and SCs forming the majority, somewhere in the range of 70 percent of the population. It’s just that this population is still so servile, and invisible to the national mainstream, that many mistake the visible as the majority. Now, the invisible will make the majority.


Let’s look at this popular misconception of visibility and invisibility another way. If you’re an Indian, or a foreigner who is familiar with India, the chances of you recognising one or many well-known personalities with the following surnames are plenty: Mukherjee, Ganguly, Mishra, Sharma, Iyer, Murthy, Joshi, Rao, Namboothiripad, Kamath, Haksar, Kaul, Goswamy, Tiwari, Vajpayee (Brahmin); Rathore, Raju, Singh, Sisodia, Rana, Bedi, Jadeja, Tanwar, Adhikari (Kshatriya); Mittal, Gupta, Singhal, Goyal, Patel, Khanna, Kapur, Vohra, Shetty (Vaishya). In India’s prevailing hierarchy of social status, men and women with upper caste surnames, like the above, generate an image of confidence, power, social dignity and omnipresence among us—omnipresence, because they’re everywhere from politics to cricket; and even the educated and well-exposed make no attempt not to use their caste names.


Juxtapose those names with the following surnames, or caste names, that don’t come so easy to our tongues, primarily because we don’t hear them in the national mainstream: Adi Karnataka, Shendurnikar, Valluvan, Tirkey, Khakha, Adi Dravida, Paraiyar, Kaibarta, Namasudra (SC); Santal, Paniya, Kurichiya, Oraon, Kumre, Naitam, Bedar, Bhumija, Mala Araya, Bhil, Yerukala (ST); Kamati, Yadav, Maso, Ezhava, Jatab (BC).


The figures that will emerge from Census 2011 can’t be very different from those of 1931. When the British last counted caste, Brahmins accounted for only 6.4 percent of the population, Rajputs 3.7 percent and Banias 2.7 percent. The backward castes, excluding the Dalits and tribal people, came to 43.7 percent. In 2011, as a block, the Shudras and Untouchables could reach 70 percent of the Indian population.

http://www.caravanmagazine.in/perspectives/counting-castes

What does this all mean? Real India is hidden away. Speechless. Not represented in media. It's a shadow, a huge shadow that will begin to make it presence. Whether that bring chaos to India sufficient to rip it apart is to be seen but chaos is around the corner.

Can I get the size of your tin foil hat?