What is Kung Fu

[Brainsucker]

The best martial arts in the world in terms of quickly conditioning anyone into a better fighter than he/she used to be: boxing.

It ain't kung fu, karate, tae kwon do, savate, aikido, judo, or ju-jit-su, but simple plain old boxing. Put a man/woman into a six months boxing regiment and he/she will learn more quickly about self defense than any novice shaolin monk wannabe, karate-ka, judo-ka, aikido-ka, or tkd-ist, in the same time span.

This is simply wrong. There is no best martial art style. There is only a better man / woman who use that technique to fight. People who say that boxing is better than the other technique is simply because that boxer has better physical condition for a real fight than the others.

I learn Wu Zhu Quan since teenager, then learn another style of Chinese Kungfu, before I got introduced to Aiki Jiujitsu, then learn Karate Kyukushin. I have a match with a boxer 18 years ago And I beat him. So I can say that it is not the boxing that better than the other martial art. It is the practitioner physical capability that determine the fight result. In my case, the boxing practitioner were not physically prepared so he lost. He just a boxer practitioner who learn boxing, not a professional who fights for money.

The problem of the martial art practitioners today is that they are not dedicated enough to their martial art. They have to work, etc. And they have less physical activity than people from the ancient time. So their body is not prepared for a real fight. It's different to the boxing. Because boxing is a competitive sport that can be used as a job. Boxer fight for money. So they have prepared their physical condition more than the other martial art practitioners.to get money. That's why they are more capable than the martial art practitioner wannabee in the downtown.

While the other martial art is (specially kungfu)... they lack the experience of real fighting. Even the shifu themselves seldom to use their technique in real fight. That's why their teaching is more of theory than practical use. it happen to me when I learn Wu Zhu Quan. I got many technique from my Shifu. But I haven't got enough "real fight" practice that introduce me to a real fight environment. Even when I did kumite, it was only between fellow students that use the same Wu Zhu Quan. And my shifu disallow us to punch with our real power in the fight. it's only when I joined Kyuukushin that I enjoyed a real fight practice with my fellow students. My senpai even give me the permission to use my Wu Zhu Quan technique in the kumite. So I got a lot of experience when I was there.

 

[Brainsucker]

Kung Fu used to be China 's But now the sport around the world .Here is Tai Chi.

In my eyes, Tai Chi is an advanced level of martial art. You know, it's mean that it's above the other martial art training around. But it doesn't mean that is the strongest in real fight. What I mean that Tai Chi is an advanced form of martial art is that because it require a higher understanding of martial art to master it. Inside Tai Chi, you won't see only the form and technique, but also more of mind tampering. That's why we call Tai Chi "mobile meditation". Because when you practice Tai Chi, it is also the same as you meditate.

Now, let me give an example. Some time ago, I read a novel called "Musashi". A novel that written by Eiji Yoshikawa.

At the beginning of the story, Musashi was fierce. He's strong, and frightening. He's too fierce. His aura make people afraid of him. Some one in the book even said that Musashi simply too strong as a sword man. And he suggest that Musashi should learn to weakened himself a bit.

But this weakening does not mean that Musashi will become weaker in martial art. It simply that he must surpass his current level and going to perfection.

So, in my mind, Tai Chi is martial art that bring us to the martial art perfection. It isn't for a newbie who doesn't know martial art before hand. It is for a martial artist who have learn and understand another martial art and want to level up his / her capability. So Tai Chi is not a martial art for street fighting. It is a martial art for master who want for a perfection.

Plus, martial arts like boxing and karate are means for young people. When they grow old, their physical condition are decreased to an extent that they can't use their martial arts like before. In other word, they become lame. With Tai Chi, they can still enjoy the martial art training even with their advanced age. And they still can practice their previous martial art with Tai Chi principle as the basic. This is what Tai Chi has, that the other martial art doesn't.

People who know martial art but saying that Tai Chi is useless is just the people who consider martial art as a weapon for street fighting, ring match, or as a bouncer. They don't respect their martial art. They just want to punch and kick somebody else.

 

[Brainsucker]

Am not talking about boxing as a controlled sport or even for athletic conditioning. Am talking about boxing as a pure martial arts and in terms of rapidly training anyone on how to use the tools he/she has, boxing is king. And am talking as a 2nd deg tae kwon do stylist. I grew up with judo then moved to TKD. While in the USAF, I learned boxing from a GG, some aikido, some karate, some wing chun, basically, every base I was at, I learned something new for at least one yr. From the GG boxer when I was at Cannon AFB in New Mexico, I learned more about using hands, arms, and elbows in one yr than from all the yrs in TKD.

When you do anything with open palms, you risk having those tools damaged and if any of them is damaged and grappling techniques such as judo is all you know, you are as we Americans say: Shit out of luck. The closed fist is much more structurally sound and more concentrated of power than any fancy open hand/palm techniques from any martial arts. The closed fist is also a much more natural a reflexive action when a person is threatened.

Jason Bourne is a recent fictional character, but I have always taught that if anyone want to fight Bourne-like, take in order: boxing for one yr, wing chun for second yr, then either karate or tkd in the 3rd yr. You can shorten the karate and/or tkd to six months, but the boxing must be at least one yr.

People are impressed with the 'five fingers exploding heart palm' technique. For me, my favorite is the 'three fingers lacerated liver' technique. I want my opponent to die an agonizing slow death.

The bold : This is interesting suggestion. But why you choose Wing Chun as the second year, not Karate, specially Karate Kyokushin? Why not Kyokushin for the second year, and Wing Chun for the third? Karate is more practical than Wing Chun, and they give you the capability of strong kick. Techniques like Mawashi Geri, Gedan Geri, Mai Geri are practical and powerful. After you finish Karate, you can go to Wing Chun.

I myself prefer Karate Kyokushin for the first year, Wu Zhu Quan, then Tai Chi.

Karate Kyokushin has a very discipline method of training that required by all practitioner who want seriously learn Martial Art. Also, Kyokushin technique are simple and powerful. It is also a well rounded Martial Art with powerful punch and kick.

Wu Zhu Quan is an advanced form of boxing. It give you a boost on your physical power, with it's powerful punch that not only use your shoulder, but also your waist. If you have watch old Chinese Kungfu Movie where the punch has sound effect, an advanced Wu Zhu Quan practitioner punch can make a sound like that.

And Tai Chi is more of the perfection of your martial art. It also teach you Cin Na. Chinese Grapling that look like Aikido and Jiujutsu.

After that, what you need is physical capability and experience. You have to conditioning yourself for a real fight. Without that, even a very powerful technique won't help you at all.

 

[gambit]

This is simply wrong. There is no best martial art style. There is only a better man / woman who use that technique to fight. People who say that boxing is better than the other technique is simply because that boxer has better physical condition for a real fight than the others.

I did not said boxing is the best martial art. I said: '...in terms of quickly conditioning anyone into a better fighter than he/she used to be...

Great difference.

The primary purpose is your legs is to support you, not to kick anything. Whereas, evolution made your hands into tools so versatile man have yet to replicate. As far as using limbs as weapons, your arms and hands are much better suit for combat than your legs. Every time any of your feet leave the ground, your balance is immediately severely compromised, your mobility is limited, and your vulnerability increased %100.

In many ways, boxing is a more 'natural' martial art than all, as in using arms and hands for striking comes easier and with less training required. Boxing gets more complex only in terms of tactics, not techniques.

 

[Brainsucker]

I did not said boxing is the best martial art. I said: '...in terms of quickly conditioning anyone into a better fighter than he/she used to be...

Great difference.

The primary purpose is your legs is to support you, not to kick anything. Whereas, evolution made your hands into tools so versatile man have yet to replicate. As far as using limbs as weapons, your arms and hands are much better suit for combat than your legs. Every time any of your feet leave the ground, your balance is immediately severely compromised, your mobility is limited, and your vulnerability increased %100.

In many ways, boxing is a more 'natural' martial art than all, as in using arms and hands for striking comes easier and with less training required. Boxing gets more complex only in terms of tactics, not techniques.

This is what you forget. Many Martial Arts have their own boxing. That's include many kungfu styles and karate. The first technique that you learn is a forward punch. Then followed by other simple punch combination, like jab, hook, uppercut, swing, etc. They have their own stance and style, but the principle is always the same. I can see it from my own experience. Both Wu Zu Quan and Kyokushin consider punch (and their variations) as the basic. So, if you say that only boxing is a more martial arts than all, it's not completely right. The others also have covered this department from the first go.

But that's not important. Technique is essential, but it's not the only drive that make you able to become a good martial artist. And now, about the most important things is that what you write next. Boxing gets more complex only in term of tactics, not technique. yes, you're right. But that's not 100% right. there is another essential factor that make you a combatant. That's physical factor. This physical factor are strength, stamina, endurance, toughness, muscle flexibility, body coordination, etc. This factor is the thing that make you a fighter. And, mind factor. Means resolve, confident, bravery, focus, etc. These two things are the ordinary modern people lack in general.

To learn martial arts, you can't ignore these four principle. Physical training, technique mastery, tactic, and mind (resolve, focus, bravery, etc). Because without four of these, you can't be considered as a fighter.

The problem of many traditional Chinese Martial Arts is that their teaching is too focus on form and theory. The training season lack discipline. Combined with modern people who lack physical capability; it is the same as they only teach you the art; but not make you a fighter. This is different to modern martial arts like boxing, mixed martial arts, etc. They teach you how to fight on the ring. So at least you develop the four martial art principle when you're there.

But it doesn't mean that you're superior as a martial artist. Gym training will only teach you to become a fighter; gladiator. That's why I prefer a discipline traditional approach, like in karate.. Because it will give me the sense of tradition and perfection.

 

[yantong1980]

I doubt only Bodhidharma should get all credit for 'cultivate' martial arts basic in China. There's several foreign Buddhist monk mostly from Indian came to China, some are well-known Nagarjuna. Some unique skills that these monks should have not only religion related only but 'self-defence' skill and medical know how, this is very useful for them during their journey to spread Buddhism. I read that the very first martial arts in China was empty handed combat using only hand that like boxing and wrestling beside military arsenal skills (sword, bow, spears).

 

[Brainsucker]

I doubt only Bodhidharma should get all credit for 'cultivate' martial arts basic in China. There's several foreign Buddhist monk mostly from Indian came to China, some are well-known Nagarjuna. Some unique skills that these monks should have not only religion related only but 'self-defence' skill and medical know how, this is very useful for them during their journey to spread Buddhism. I read that the very first martial arts in China was empty handed combat using only hand that like boxing and wrestling beside military arsenal skills (sword, bow, spears).

Bodhidharma brought Yoga to Shaolin.

While their Wugong was developed over time for centuries. Shaolin was famous for their martial art because (if this is historical fact otherwise it was only a legend) they were not a simple monastery for a time. Their monks fought a war. I think they were even form a military force during Sui or Tang dynasty. That's why they still have the tradition to train their body in discipline manner. Just like soldiers train their body to fight a war.

 

[gambit]

This is what you forget. Many Martial Arts have their own boxing.

No, I did not 'forget'.

True, other than grappling styles, just about all martial arts have punching techniques, but those techniques are companions to other non-hand techniques. Not so with boxing. From day one, you learn how to punch, then refine your own techniques, then how to work your own tactics.

This is why boxing is the easiest to learn and fastest toward self improvement.

 

[Brainsucker]

No, I did not 'forget'.

True, other than grappling styles, just about all martial arts have punching techniques, but those techniques are companions to other non-hand techniques. Not so with boxing. From day one, you learn how to punch, then refine your own techniques, then how to work your own tactics.

This is why boxing is the easiest to learn and fastest toward self improvement.

It's interesting to discuss with you. Ok, I understand what you mean with boxing. It's true that boxing is simple. So you can focus more on refining your technique, self improvement and tactic. you can do that with other martial art; but it means that you have to cut many technique and stick with the basic. it just the same that you learn boxing with different style of punch.