What if the Ottoman Empire never fell?

[CodeforFood]

Only HE is Ba'ki, everything and everyone else is Fa'ni...

The Ottoman Empire had to taste death. It doesn't mean another Muslim power, even much more powerful than the Ottomans, won't rise up from the ashes....

Well put bro!
Besides the ottomans were a diminishing force by the time and there was nothing in sight that would change that. That force may come back with different faces and power dynamics in future, but for that it needed at the time.

 

[nahtanbob]

oil money tho...oil money...it fix everything.

Has it fixed Saudi society ?

 

[Kompromat]

Turks should have invaded India in 1857 to help us defeat the English. Their inaction cost us two empires lost and a century of colonial rule.

 

[PakFactor]

Turks should have invaded India in 1857 to help us defeat the English. Their inaction cost us two empires lost and a century of colonial rule.

One thing I’ve found in my research among empires and especially Islamic Empires once they start getting into humanities and art they lose focus and drop their guard. They pay less attention to math and science and weapons R&D; and the shock they experience they never recovered. They get into stupid mahal building, concubines gathering, useless poetry and dancing tranny’s.

 

[Titanium100]

One thing I’ve found in my research among empires and especially Islamic Empires once they start getting into humanities and art they lose focus and drop their guard. They pay less attention to math and science and weapons R&D; and the shock they experience they never recovered. They get into stupid mahal building, concubines gathering, useless poetry and dancing tranny’s.

For the first time we don't have a caliphate for 100 years precisely. There have been other Islamic dynasties with similar stages like you said and it mostly happens when a dynasty has ruled for a long time and kinda fizzles out like a burned out candle light.

Let me give you some good examples: The Spanish islamic dynasty of Al-Andalus they held that area for 700 years and they were slowly and slowly entering art even before the 700 year mark and all the fitna began with the concubines, women, art, poetry and other entertainment elements got in the way and another thing is that they slowly forgot about who they were as time went on.

The Mughal empire is another example and probably one of the wealthiest dynasty to ever exist and major reason why Christoffer Columbus found the Americas it was because of the Mughal dynasty. The wealth of the Mughal empire was well know back in the 13th, 14th and 15th centuries and once Isabella came to power the first thing he did was search for the Mughal empire because they knew about their ridiculous amount of treasures and wealth they sailed towards India but they ended up in the Americas finding the new world and that is why they called the natives indians. The elite of Europe admired the Mughal empire for their wealth and they knew that via Al-andaldus. They lasted way to longer then they needed approx. 331 years with only one family lineage and they got into all the mahal buildings, poetry, dancing etc etc.

Same thing happened to other long lasting muslim dynasties like Mamlukis, Abbasids, Ayyubids, Delhi Sultanate, Seljuks, Umayyad Caliphate and even the Ghaznavids (Iranian Sunni dynasty and in fact all of the Iranian dynasties were Sunni until recently they were forced to convert to shia by the safavid and the Safavid dynasty itself were Sunni until the time of the conversion)

The Ottoman empire of All empires that lasted longest 600++ years fell not only to worldly desires but the rise of sufism and around 1800s and 1900s the biggest problem in the muslim world was sufism not only in Turkey but everywhere specifically in India, Pakistan, Iraq, Sham, East Africa and worst of all North Africa and at this point the true creed of Islam had become washed up in the generations that existed in 1800s and 1900s they really forgot about everything and themselves.

 

[Khanate]

The unforgivable mistake Mughals and Ottomans made was ignoring the development of their naval fleets. Mughals and Ottamans could have been the first to discover the New World. Pakistan repeated the same mistake of ignoring its naval fleet and that cost us East Pakistan. We have learned nothing from our history.

Now a space race is upon us. As usual, we have ignored space exploration altogether despite a head start. The future generations will not forgive us for these oversights.

 

[INS_Vikrant]

Turks should have invaded India in 1857 to help us defeat the English. Their inaction cost us two empires lost and a century of colonial rule.

For that first they had to first invade persia, then Russian territories in Central Asia, then afghanistan then if anyone is still left in their army could think of invading british india. Joke aside the power gap between ottomans and British Empire in 1800s was huge and also they were sort of allies as British saved their asses against Napoleon in Egypt and against Russians in Crimean war.

 

[313ghazi]

There is not a single day that goes by that i dont think of it.. the pain of disunity and suffering, the injustice in this world wants the usmania sorta khilafa to come back

Forget about it.

Now think of how we can re-establish a similar entity.

 

[313ghazi]

For the first time we don't have a caliphate for 100 years precisely. There have been other Islamic dynasties with similar stages like you said and it mostly happens when a dynasty has ruled for a long time and kinda fizzles out like a burned out candle light.

Let me give you some good examples: The Spanish islamic dynasty of Al-Andalus they held that area for 700 years and they were slowly and slowly entering art even before the 700 year mark and all the fitna began with the concubines, women, art, poetry and other entertainment elements got in the way and another thing is that they slowly forgot about who they were as time went on.

The Mughal empire is another example and probably one of the wealthiest dynasty to ever exist and major reason why Christoffer Columbus found the Americas it was because of the Mughal dynasty. The wealth of the Mughal empire was well know back in the 13th, 14th and 15th centuries and once Isabella came to power the first thing he did was search for the Mughal empire because they knew about their ridiculous amount of treasures and wealth they sailed towards India but they ended up in the Americas finding the new world and that is why they called the natives indians. The elite of Europe admired the Mughal empire for their wealth and they knew that via Al-andaldus. They lasted way to longer then they needed approx. 331 years with only one family lineage and they got into all the mahal buildings, poetry, dancing etc etc.

Same thing happened to other long lasting muslim dynasties like Mamlukis, Abbasids, Ayyubids, Delhi Sultanate, Seljuks, Umayyad Caliphate and even the Ghaznavids (Iranian Sunni dynasty and in fact all of the Iranian dynasties were Sunni until recently they were forced to convert to shia by the safavid and the Safavid dynasty itself were Sunni until the time of the conversion)

The Ottoman empire of All empires that lasted longest 600++ years fell not only to worldly desires but the rise of sufism and around 1800s and 1900s the biggest problem in the muslim world was sufism not only in Turkey but everywhere specifically in India, Pakistan, Iraq, Sham, East Africa and worst of all North Africa and at this point the true creed of Islam had become washed up in the generations that existed in 1800s and 1900s they really forgot about everything and themselves.

What utter bakwas. It was sufis who turned the ancestors of the Turks to Islam. It was sufis who turned your ancestor's to Islam. Sufism and the idea of tassawuf is central to Islam since day 1.

The fall of all Islamic empires came when they stopped becoming warriors and instead became royalty. When the focus was on matters of the emporers courts rather than the boundaries of the empire.

 

[313ghazi]

Travel along the Silk Road and you will see madaris established by the awliya. They were centres of learning, places key to the cities they were established in. Its not the fault of those who passed that thier future generations have practically become misguided.

To look at what has become at Ajmer Sharif or other such places saddens me. Centres of learning, places the deen spread from as beacons of light in darkness - today reduced to shirk, politics and money making.

 

[Titanium100]

What utter bakwas. It was sufis who turned the ancestors of the Turks to Islam. It was sufis who turned your ancestor's to Islam. Sufism and the idea of tassawuf is central to Islam since day 1.

The fall of all Islamic empires came when they stopped becoming warriors and instead became royalty. When the focus was on matters of the emporers courts rather than the boundaries of the empire.

All these dynasties had one thing in common and that is they were all Classical muslims and something close to today's Salafists while most didn't call themselves that but they were similar to that creed to begin with until they deteriorated as time went on and the Sufis started to pick up around the 1500s and pretty much became an unfortunate trend and overwhelmed them all by 1800s and 1900s. Sufism was an invasive doctrine alien to these generations until it emerged and started trending upwards but they started out as classical muslims which is mostly similar to today's salafi creed who practice the origin form of Islam from the Sahaba

 

[313ghazi]

All these dynasties had one thing in common and that is they were all Classical muslims and something close to today's Salafists while most didn't call themselves that but they were similar to that creed to begin with until they deteriorated as time went on and the Sufis started to pick up around the 1500s and pretty much became an unfortunate trend and overwhelmed them all by 1800s and 1900s. Sufism was an invasive doctrine alien to these generations until it emerged and started trending upwards but they started out as classical muslims which is mostly similar to today's salafi creed who practice the origin form of Islam from the Sahaba

Bro, you don't know what you're talking about. Rumi is revered in Turkey. He was born in 1207. He was a sufi.

Ibn Arabi was a sufi - born 1165.

The founders of the Ottoman Empire were sufi.

The Mughal were bought to Islam by Sufism. Islam was bought to our ancestors by the sufis. Before Muhammad Bin Qasim there was Islam in the region. It was bought by the sufis.

The mistake you are making is by equating the jaali pirs of today with sufism. The halwa eaters, dope smokers and money spinners that we see today are not sufis. They malign the deen and the peoples who's names and reputations they abuse to achieve this today would have put these people to the sword.

These men whom you'll know about from recent Muslim history were all Sufis.

Imam Shamil - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Emir Abdelkader - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Omar al-Mukhtar - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The Forgotten Sufi Warriors

BENGALURU: Most Bangaloreans believe that our city doesn’t have much history to be proud of like Delhi, Mumbai or Hyderabad does. But do we care enough to learn

www.newindianexpress.com

Sufi's had the key role in all Islamic dynasties, it is a key component of mainstrem islam. What we see incorrectly passed as sufism in the subcontinent today is a result of corruption due to a lack of islamic leadership with colonialism provided in our region.

To suggest some of these jaali pirs are representatives of the Ahle sunnah, is to suggest the Mullah Diesel is a representative of Deoband. They all use religion in the same way. There are still many scholars and Awliya around the world, including in Pakistan who practise sufism correctly. You will find them by observing how strictly they stick to Shariah. If someone is doing something outside the limits of Shariah, they are no teacher of the Deen.