What about Mi-35 Attack Helicopters for Pakistan?

[Materialistic]

If its about attack helis then why not wz-10.

I compared its specs with EuroTiger, Cobra, Apache, Mi-28, ATAK
Its better than others in many aspects and in some apache beats it, but its in the same league. Also, its Chinese, which means there are no hurdles to acquire it if we manage the funds needed.

 

[moxin]

Atak project is built on already developed and proven attack helicopter A-129 from AugustaWestland which also assembles apaches (AH-Mk.1 for the British Army). IMO T-129 is better than Z-10!

 

[Materialistic]

Atak project is built on already developed and proven attack helicopter A-129 from AugustaWestland which also assembles apaches (AH-Mk.1 for the British Army). IMO T-129 is better than Z-10!

Well.. of course T-129 is based on a well proven platform and is developed by a company with more tech and experience. And both the helis are nearly same in specs. But what bothers me is that T-129 is not coming from a source much reliable for future. Turkey is trusted ally but Italy is the primary partner and both the country's can easily come under western influence in worst scenarios. Also, China is not only more reliable but even if we look for, then we can have them with TOT!!

 

[ptldM3]

What the hell...

Are you sure this is true? I knew Hind is heavily armored thats why i called it flying tank but if you said above is true... Wow...

Yes,apart from knowing a Hind pilot there was a source, which i'm trying to find that stated how some Hinds, not all, were able to still make it home after a stinger hit, i will continue to search for it.

are you sure! i have seen a video documentary not available on youtube which shows mi-35 hinds splitting in half by stingers in afghan war...

Yes, i'm sure, i'm also sure i know what video you're talking about and that was not an MI-35, i beleive it was a dummy drone made to look like a Russian helicopter, the three rotor blades are a dead give away because the MI-35 uses five. The landing gear is also inconsistant with an MI-35.

 

[General General]

Initially the Hind did not have much armour, after rebels in the Afghan war began shooting at the helicopters with 12.7 mm, among other guns, did the Soviets modify it and added heavier armour.
Although, I do have to disagree regarding the maneuverability of attack helicopters. Its machine gun can potentially shoot down a heat-seeking missile comming it's way. However, for that it has to position itself very quickly. Often they have to turn around 180 degrees to face the incomming missile, because a hidden enemy will most likely try to aim a heat-seeking missile while the helicopter's back is turned and exposing the exausts of the engine. Inertial physics prevent the Hind from turning as quickly as, say, a small nimble Cobra.

 

[Jigs]

Well.. of course T-129 is based on a well proven platform and is developed by a company with more tech and experience. And both the helis are nearly same in specs. But what bothers me is that T-129 is not coming from a source much reliable for future. Turkey is trusted ally but Italy is the primary partner and both the country's can easily come under western influence in worst scenarios. Also, China is not only more reliable but even if we look for, then we can have them with TOT!!

I see your concern but this is actually not the case for the T-129. Turkey not only has full marketing rights for this variant but also full export rights to 3rd countries (excluding the U.K. and Italy) this is what is in the contract. In fact even if the U.S. tried to block the T-129 it couldn't because every part of it will be made in Turkey by the second batch. That includes the engine/mission computer/helmet system/weapons.

As the prime contractor, TAI will oversee the subcontractors ASELSAN and AgustaWestland and will report to the Turkish Land Forces Command (KKK). The program is scheduled to last nine and a half years, with the first T129 ATAK delivery in the 60th month. As part of the $3 billion project, by 2013 the KKK will start acquiring the “Turkish” version of AgustaWestland’s A129, which will be modified to increase operability in the challenging terrain of south-eastern Turkey where the Turkish army is fighting the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK). The project integrates nationally developed high-tech avionic equipment, hardware and, most surprisingly, local software developed on the basis of the original source codes. Upon completion of the newly configured choppers, the TAI will retain the intellectual property rights to the T129 and to sales of the helicopters worldwide, except in Italy and the UK (TAI Press Bulletins, September 17, 2007, June 24; and Turkish Press, June 24).

This is really important for Pakistan because it means it is up to Turkey as far as tech transfers going to Pakistan.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Yes,apart from knowing a Hind pilot there was a source, which i'm trying to find that stated how some Hinds, not all, were able to still make it home after a stinger hit, i will continue to search for it.



Yes, i'm sure, i'm also sure i know what video you're talking about and that was not an MI-35, i beleive it was a dummy drone made to look like a Russian helicopter, the three rotor blades are a dead give away because the MI-35 uses five. The landing gear is also inconsistant with an MI-35.

Do you happen to know if any country is working on anti-helo weapons that are more effective than stingers (as in capable of penetrating a hind's armor more effectively)?

 

[ptldM3]

Do you happen to know if any country is working on anti-helo weapons that are more effective than stingers (as in capable of penetrating a hind's armor more effectively)?

The stinger has no problem penatrating, the reason why some Hinds were able to survive stinger hits was mostly because of luck. For example, if the stinger hit the cabin side the Hind might return to base, remember the Hind could also double as a troop transport so most of the cabin was empty space, if the same stinger hit the engine than the Hind would not be so lucky, the armour also helped protect vital parts of the helicopter which would otherwise be suseptable to stinger fragments. I would also imagine that the armour would deflect some of the stingers energy as well as dissipate it, atleast to an extent.

It's the same with A-10's and SU-25's, both aircraft have been know to safely return dispite a destroyed engine, parts of the wings missing, and in general being rittled with holes. Other times the aircraft have been shot down, in the end one lucky shot in the right spot can bring down any aircraft.

 

[TOPGUN]

We need super cobars thats it..

 

[Super Falcon]

Apache or if we have to go for russia or ukraine than MI 28 Havoc is the best option for pakistan in my opinion

 

[fatman17]

Mi-35 to Pakistan - have u heard 'fat-chance'

 

[Capt.Popeye]

"Mi-35 to Pakistan - have u heard 'fat-chance' "

fatman17
That was KISS!

 

[Materialistic]

I see your concern but this is actually not the case for the T-129. Turkey not only has full marketing rights for this variant but also full export rights to 3rd countries (excluding the U.K. and Italy) this is what is in the contract. In fact even if the U.S. tried to block the T-129 it couldn't because every part of it will be made in Turkey by the second batch. That includes the engine/mission computer/helmet system/weapons.


This is really important for Pakistan because it means it is up to Turkey as far as tech transfers going to Pakistan.

If that is the case then of course IMO T-129 is the best option for Pakistan, its better in specs with nato standards & lesser chances of failures since its a proven platform.

 

[illuminatidinesh]

Do you happen to know if any country is working on anti-helo weapons that are more effective than stingers (as in capable of penetrating a hind's armor more effectively)?

The personal notes from the pilots say that they were able to withstand the ground fire. During the afghan war they added more armour to the machine, again I read somewhere that most of the Hind kills were while they were in the ground. During the later stages of war the Hind were attached with countermeasures which also helped it seems.
At the end it one of the most feared machines.

 

[Donatello]

Get ToT incase of future sanction we need to be prepared Pakistan should persue this with the next purchase of helicopters

You know what we need to do to secure our future?
We need to rid ourselves of the politicians.

Number 2, we need to strengthen our economy.

Number 3, respect each other.