Watch out for Vietnam, says RI ambassador

[nufix]

In the last 25 years or so only two countries S Korea and Poland were the last ones that reached high income and developed status. Korea suffered a war, the Koreans were as poor as the people in Africa today. Indonesia enjoys a long peace period why have you failed to reach the same level?

Long peace period? You are aware of what happened in late 1990s right? Our economy was less than 200 billion and in 20 years, we are a trillion dollar nation.

Anyway regarding palm oil, nothing bad having palm oil as main export. If everyone starts exporting electronics, the value of electronic appliances will fall down quickly and in time, one unit palm oil commodity may be valued more than one certain electronic device. The only reason why electronic companies start flocking down to Vietnam is because Vietnam is still a factor driven economy with cheap yet fairly skilled labors. Indonesian economy is already in efficiency driven stage and its GDP nominal is almost 1.1 Trillion and 1.18 by next year. Our PPP already beat South Korea tho, which is important to measure actual comparative spending power domestically.

And regarding car productions, Indonesian middle class is already numerous and Indonesia is one of countries that relies more on domestic consuptions which makes Indonesia less vulnerable to global shock. Indonesians consumes what can be produced domestically and import what can't be produced domestically. Although car is not the main export commodity, Indonesia bought 1.1 million cars in 2017 while Vietnam only bought 272k cars.

You dont have to work so hard to portray Vietnam as better and richer and whatever than Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia and whatnot, number talks louder than whatever dreams you have.

 

[Nike]

This ambassador acts like American military higher ups, always worry in what will be happened should they get complacent. Nothing else, he just wishing Indonesian got more intensified their works and strife the best.

@Viet

In the past you said our economy will be weakened greatly after depreciation of Rupiah value against US Dollar, but thats not happened at all, still growing at moderate and good pace of five percentage per year. Our standard of living is keep increasing, our HDI keep increasing and starting to left Vietnam at margin Vietnamese cant keep up albeit at advantage of homougen population and lies at continental area, compared to vast islands conditions of us yours are child play when we talk about administration set up and building proper infrastructure. Neither Vietnam got snow tipped high mountain like us, nor dessert mountain, nor vast large savanna provinces.

 

[pr1v4t33r]

What Indonesia has achieved today, recovering from the 1998 heyday (plunging economy with GDP below $100 Billion, facing multitude of crisis, even pressure of disintegration) and leapfrogging itself into $1 Trillion economy within less than 20 years, is nothing short of a miracle. Indonesia embraces its newfound strength with great zeal to achieve even greater glory and prosperity. And you won't see Indonesia stop progressing anytime soon..

 

[Viva_Viet]

My friend, nothing can be said until TPP is up and running and proven as fruitful for the betterment of VN economy. We shall wait and see first.

.

Yes, true, we need to wait and see what benefit VN can get from TPP. I guess that at least TPP will help VN economy keep raising during this global economy crisis

If that happens (which I doubt will ever be) then TPP nations will lost big markets of (at least) almost 400 million people as Non-TPP nations will retaliate by blocking export from TPPs also.

Actually, VN only have problem in car importing from none TPP nations, so "car war" is OK for us.

And I think exporting car is not your major export, too. So, seem like only Toyota/Honda Motor Thailand want "car war" against VN.

This ambassador acts like American military higher ups, always worry in what will be happened should they get complacent. Nothing else, he just wishing Indonesian got more intensified their works and strife the best.

@Viet

In the past you said our economy will be weakened greatly after depreciation of Rupiah value against US Dollar, but thats not happened at all, still growing at moderate and good pace of five percentage per year. Our standard of living is keep increasing, our HDI keep increasing and starting to left Vietnam at margin Vietnamese cant keep up albeit at advantage of homougen population and lies at continental area, compared to vast islands conditions of us yours are child play when we talk about administration set up and building proper infrastructure. Neither Vietnam got snow tipped high mountain like us, nor dessert mountain, nor vast large savanna provinces.

Ur export relying too much on natural resources, what will happen when they run out or having low price again ??

-------------------
System code, Indonesia’s number one exported product is palm oil followed by coal then petroleum gases.

1. Mineral fuels including oil: US$27.9 billion (19.3% of total exports)
2. Animal/vegetable fats, oils, waxes: $18.2 billion (12.6%)
3. Electrical machinery, equipment: $8.1 billion (5.6%)
4. Gems, precious metals: $6.4 billion (4.4%)
5. Vehicles: $5.9 billion (4.1%)
6. Rubber, rubber articles: $5.7 billion (3.9%)
7. Machinery including computers: $5.5 billion (3.8%)
8. Footwear: $4.6 billion (3.2%)
9. Clothing, accessories (not knit or crochet): $3.9 billion (2.7%)
10. Wood: $3.9 billion (2.7%)

http://www.worldstopexports.com/indonesias-top-10-exports/

 

[Viet]

This ambassador acts like American military higher ups, always worry in what will be happened should they get complacent. Nothing else, he just wishing Indonesian got more intensified their works and strife the best.

@Viet

In the past you said our economy will be weakened greatly after depreciation of Rupiah value against US Dollar, but thats not happened at all, still growing at moderate and good pace of five percentage per year. Our standard of living is keep increasing, our HDI keep increasing and starting to left Vietnam at margin Vietnamese cant keep up albeit at advantage of homougen population and lies at continental area, compared to vast islands conditions of us yours are child play when we talk about administration set up and building proper infrastructure. Neither Vietnam got snow tipped high mountain like us, nor dessert mountain, nor vast large savanna provinces.

Actually I wish you all the best. I wish all of our Southeast neighbors all the best. The more our region progresses the better for all of us. but since I am a realist, I must tell you that darkness is growing over manufacturing sectors in our region. The Chinese with their immense manufacturing and industrial sectors will push all of our factories, from Vietnam, Indonesia and others into bankruptcy, degrading our people into consumers of China only products. We will be degraded to slaves, to primitive exporters of natural resources. Oil, gas, timber, etc. Look around you, look at Russia, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Venezuela and...Philippines.

Germany is currently forming a united bloc to resist chinese expansion into the heart of Europe, while Vietnam does in Southern front. Indonesia is the biggest country it’s good for everyone if you wake up to reality.

Having said that, of course Vietnam and Indonesia compete against each other economically in multiple fronts though. Tourism is such a sector. Interesting sector. News of the day: UK company travelogue will build a giant hotel in the city of Nha Trang within 2 years. I think we will welcome 20 million foreign tourists a year soon.

 

[Nike]

Yes, true, we need to wait and see what benefit VN can get from TPP. I guess that at least TPP will help VN economy keep raising during this global economy crisis
Actually, VN only have problem in car importing from none TPP nations, so "car war" is OK for us.

And I think exporting car is not your major export, too. So, seem like only Toyota/Honda Motor Thailand want "car war" against VN.


Ur export relying too much on natural resources, what will happen when they run out or having low price again ??

-------------------
System code, Indonesia’s number one exported product is palm oil followed by coal then petroleum gases.

1. Mineral fuels including oil: US$27.9 billion (19.3% of total exports)
2. Animal/vegetable fats, oils, waxes: $18.2 billion (12.6%)
3. Electrical machinery, equipment: $8.1 billion (5.6%)
4. Gems, precious metals: $6.4 billion (4.4%)
5. Vehicles: $5.9 billion (4.1%)
6. Rubber, rubber articles: $5.7 billion (3.9%)
7. Machinery including computers: $5.5 billion (3.8%)
8. Footwear: $4.6 billion (3.2%)
9. Clothing, accessories (not knit or crochet): $3.9 billion (2.7%)
10. Wood: $3.9 billion (2.7%)

http://www.worldstopexports.com/indonesias-top-10-exports/

Palm oil is without dispute will be there forever, unlike oil and in which can be running out and left empty or can be replaced with nuclear, water or whatever methods to generate electricity. On other hand, palm oil is necessity for daily life industries like soaps, margarine, butter, noodles products, oil foods, and many other in which Indonesia got many industries working in this sector. The only competitor for palm oil is came from soya bean and sunflower seeds, but they are nothing sort as competitive as palm oil. There is nothing wrong about palm oil and their derivative products.

Actually I wish you all the best. I wish all of our Southeast neighbors all the best. The more our region progresses the better for all of us. but since I am a realist, I must tell you that darkness is growing over manufacturing sectors in our region. The Chinese with their immense manufacturing and industrial sectors will push all of our factories, from Vietnam, Indonesia and others into bankruptcy, degrading our people into consumers of China only products. We will be degraded to slaves, to primitive exporters of natural resources. Oil, gas, timber, etc. Look around you, look at Russia, Pakistan, Sri Lanka, Venezuela and...Philippines.

Germany is currently forming a united bloc to resist chinese expansion into the heart of Europe, while Vietnam does in Southern front. Indonesia is the biggest country it’s good for everyone if you wake up to reality.

Having said that, of course Vietnam and Indonesia compete against each other economically in multiple fronts though. Tourism is such a sector. Interesting sector. News of the day: UK company travelogue will build a giant hotel in the city of Nha Trang within 2 years. I think we will welcome 20 million foreign tourists a year soon.

View attachment 455365

Dont know what are you talking about, China right now facing high emmigration in low industries toward middle tier and high tier industries along with rising up wages and salaries for their worker. Means soon they will follow investment aboard path of South Korean and Japan, China investment in Vietnam is quite large if i recall along with Jp and sk.

 

[Viet]

Palm oil is without dispute will be there forever, unlike oil and in which can be running out and left empty or can be replaced with nuclear, water or whatever methods to generate electricity. On other hand, palm oil is necessity for daily life industries like soaps, margarine, butter, noodles products, oil foods, and many other in which Indonesia got many industries working in this sector. The only competitor for palm oil is came from soya bean and sunflower seeds, but they are nothing sort as competitive as palm oil. There is nothing wrong about palm oil and their derivative products.



Dont know what are you talking about, China right now facing high emmigration in low industries toward middle tier and high tier industries along with rising up wages and salaries for their worker. Means soon they will follow investment aboard path of South Korean and Japan, China investment in Vietnam is quite large if i recall along with Jp and sk.

Nothing wrong with palm oil. the only problematic issue: you burn down forests at large scale and process palm oil to fuel to power cars. Personally I like palm oil. Good taste.

Chinese low end factories moving to low wage countries is a myth. China investment in VN is about $10 billion, about the same size to America. Japan and Korea are top dogs.

Long peace period? You are aware of what happened in late 1990s right? Our economy was less than 200 billion and in 20 years, we are a trillion dollar nation.

Anyway regarding palm oil, nothing bad having palm oil as main export. If everyone starts exporting electronics, the value of electronic appliances will fall down quickly and in time, one unit palm oil commodity may be valued more than one certain electronic device. The only reason why electronic companies start flocking down to Vietnam is because Vietnam is still a factor driven economy with cheap yet fairly skilled labors. Indonesian economy is already in efficiency driven stage and its GDP nominal is almost 1.1 Trillion and 1.18 by next year. Our PPP already beat South Korea tho, which is important to measure actual comparative spending power domestically.

And regarding car productions, Indonesian middle class is already numerous and Indonesia is one of countries that relies more on domestic consuptions which makes Indonesia less vulnerable to global shock. Indonesians consumes what can be produced domestically and import what can't be produced domestically. Although car is not the main export commodity, Indonesia bought 1.1 million cars in 2017 while Vietnam only bought 272k cars.

You dont have to work so hard to portray Vietnam as better and richer and whatever than Malaysia, Thailand, Indonesia and whatnot, number talks louder than whatever dreams you have.

VN follows the policy of Singapore. Car is very expensive in VN. If car costs as low as Indonesia or China, millions cars will overcrowd the streets and everything will come to standstill as you see it every day in your Indonesia or Thailand roads.

 

[Viva_Viet]

Palm oil is without dispute will be there forever, unlike oil and in which can be running out and left empty or can be replaced with nuclear, water or whatever methods to generate electricity. On other hand, palm oil is necessity for daily life industries like soaps, margarine, butter, noodles products, oil foods, and many other in which Indonesia got many industries working in this sector. The only competitor for palm oil is came from soya bean and sunflower seeds, but they are nothing sort as competitive as palm oil. There is nothing wrong about palm oil and their derivative products.

Many customer dislike making palm oil by burn down the forest cos it pollute the world environment.

What happen when customer boycott your plam oil to protest your deforestation ??

 

[Viva_Viet]

Nothing wrong with palm oil. the only problematic issue: you burn down forests at large scale and process palm oil to fuel to power cars. Personally I like palm oil. Good taste.

Big thing going wrong wt palm oil now, ppl are boycotting it cos burning forest is polluting the world environment.

 

[nufix]

Big thing going wrong wt palm oil now, ppl are boycotting it cos burning forest is polluting the world environment.

You do realize that Indonesia just won against EU regarding Palm Oil case right? Eventho normal customers do not like palm oil, palm oil is still useful for industrial productions and palm oil is set to replace fossil diesel with its biodiesel. Palm oil industry is Indonesia's star industry and as an advantage coz nobody else, besides Malaysia, could actually compete against Indonesia.


Anyway, what I find funny from Vietnamese posters here is their lack of understanding of how Indonesian economy is run that they keep on using export data for dick measuring contest. You have to understand that Indonesia is home to 260 million market with the highest number of middle class and consumer class with earning above USD 10k in the region, Indonesia IS the market for many commodities. Post 1998 period saw Indonesia more of a domestic consumption economy rather than an export reliance coountry. It can be seen from the fact that Indonesian manufacturing output is much much much bigger than the rest of ASEAN countries. Despite the majority of Indonesian export is natural resources and processed natural resources, Indonesia manufacture output was valued at USD 181 billion in 2015 which is even bigger than Spain and Russia alone. Vietnam, well it was valued at USD 26.5 billion, even smaller than Bangladesh's USD 33 billion . Reashot is right, you have to start comparing yourself to Bangladeshi...

Current Indicator shows that Indonesias manufacturing output is valued at USD 191 Billion, a 10 billion dollar increase in 3 years. Vietnam only managed to increase its manufacturing output to 29 billion dollars, only 2.5 billion in 3 years. If industrial growth in Vietnam is as massive as you have been preaching here, the statistics may not seem to be in agreement with your claims. https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NV.IND.MANF.CD

Nothing wrong with palm oil. the only problematic issue: you burn down forests at large scale and process palm oil to fuel to power cars. Personally I like palm oil. Good taste.

Chinese low end factories moving to low wage countries is a myth. China investment in VN is about $10 billion, about the same size to America. Japan and Korea are top dogs.


VN follows the policy of Singapore. Car is very expensive in VN. If car costs as low as Indonesia or China, millions cars will overcrowd the streets and everything will come to standstill as you see it every day in your Indonesia or Thailand roads.

Well, I have seen more crazy vietnamese traffic videos than Indonesian ones in the internet, lol.

Anyway, jokes aside, VN car tax is high, but not as high as Singapore. In fact, Indonesia, Thailand, and Vietnam is in the same classification as countris with relatively high car taxes. Thus, the price difference is not that much. It is just the spending power of Indonesians and Thais are much higher than their vietnamese counterparts. http://english.vietnamnet.vn/fms/business/180001/how-expensive-are-cars-in-vietnam-.html

 

[pr1v4t33r]

Nice find, i'll put the graph here for everyone to see. Hope this stats could awake them from their perverted dream.

Go Go Bangladesh!

 

[nufix]

Nice find, i'll put the graph here for everyone to see. Hope this stats could awake them from their perverted dream.

View attachment 455498
Go Go Bangladesh!

They talk about macro economics with no basic understanding of macro economics, lel

 

[Viva_Viet]

You do realize that Indonesia just won against EU regarding Palm Oil case right? Eventho normal customers do not like palm oil, palm oil is still useful for industrial productions and palm oil is set to replace fossil diesel with its biodiesel. Palm oil industry is Indonesia's star industry and as an advantage coz nobody else, besides Malaysia, could actually compete against Indonesia.


Anyway, what I find funny from Vietnamese posters here is their lack of understanding of how Indonesian economy is run that they keep on using export data for dick measuring contest. You have to understand that Indonesia is home to 260 million market with the highest number of middle class and consumer class with earning above USD 10k in the region, Indonesia IS the market for many commodities. Post 1998 period saw Indonesia more of a domestic consumption economy rather than an export reliance coountry. It can be seen from the fact that Indonesian manufacturing output is much much much bigger than the rest of ASEAN countries. Despite the majority of Indonesian export is natural resources and processed natural resources, Indonesia manufacture output was valued at USD 181 billion in 2015 which is even bigger than Spain and Russia alone. Vietnam, well it was valued at USD 26.5 billion, even smaller than Bangladesh's USD 33 billion . Reashot is right, you have to start comparing yourself to Bangladeshi...

Current Indicator shows that Indonesias manufacturing output is valued at USD 191 Billion, a 10 billion dollar increase in 3 years. Vietnam only managed to increase its manufacturing output to 29 billion dollars, only 2.5 billion in 3 years. If industrial growth in Vietnam is as massive as you have been preaching here, the statistics may not seem to be in agreement with your claims. https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NV.IND.MANF.CD



Well, I have seen more crazy vietnamese traffic videos than Indonesian ones in the internet, lol.

Anyway, jokes aside, VN car tax is high, but not as high as Singapore. In fact, Indonesia, Thailand, and Vietnam is in the same classification as countris with relatively high car taxes. Thus, the price difference is not that much. It is just the spending power of Indonesians and Thais are much higher than their vietnamese counterparts. http://english.vietnamnet.vn/fms/business/180001/how-expensive-are-cars-in-vietnam-.html

Let’s take a look at East Nusa Tenggara, the province that famous for it’s giant Komodo dragon. According to 2015 statistics, this province possesses GDP per capita merely around $1,147.34. If we take these numbers literally into account, it means GDP per capita of Jakarta people in one month is higher than annual GDP per capita of East Nusa Tenggara people in one year.

This number is lower than the poorest nation of Southeast Asia, Cambodia, that has slightly higher GDP per capita. Which puts East Nusa Tenggara on-par with countries like Cameroon, Zambia, poorer than Ivory Coast, and slightly richer than Zimbabwe.


Indonesia has 34 states, when one state lives like Czech Republic and another one lives like Zimbabwe, you get the idea on how big is the economic gap.

Of course this number is highly debatable since I don’t take into account other important stuffs like purchasing power parity, human-development index, life expectancy, educational level, and infrastructure development.

https://www.quora.com/Is-Indonesia-rich-or-poor-Why

 

[Viet]

They talk about macro economics with no basic understanding of macro economics, lel

Something doesn’t add up. VN power generation is about 42GW in 2016. Indonesia official GDP is 5 times larger, one could expect your power generation should be more than 200GW. But why yours only 60GW?

 

[Viva_Viet]

They talk about macro economics with no basic understanding of macro economics, lel

Only Jakarta look Ok, many Indonesia's provinces only can compare with Zimbabwe