Was the Bangladeshi MIG 29's necessary?

[DESERT FIGHTER]

Did bangladesh buy used mig 29s?

 

[desioptimist]

As I said earlier we should not be here to poke nose on what weapons our defnse ministry would buy. Only they know what are the good and important weapons. About purchasing of Mig-29s, it seems the decision was far ahead of time.

What India or Burma will do in the future, it is theirs to decide. No one come here and start talking like a Prophet, India will not attack us. People should understand that a weakness is an invitation of an attack. As a sovereign nation we have the right to equip ourselves and fight back with whatever weapons we have if attacked.

And Mig-29s are one of the bests defensive weapon in the sky. This being the reason, we are again thinking of buying one or two new sq. of Mig-SMTs. But, the latest news is our military will prefer SU-30s this time.

Generally speaking:
It is true for many of the decisions of many authorities that we discuss here.In many cases they may have more information and knowledge.
But that does not stop us from commenting on them.( we make assumptions like they are corrupt, sold, greedy or stupid and go on to give our verdict)

It should be a customary disclaimer in any forum which should read "You know better than anybody else. Your view matters. If you decide to write on a topic, assume that you have all the information and mental capability to make the comment"

 

[integra]

Did bangladesh buy used mig 29s?

No.............

 

[Zabaniyah]

1. Mig 29 is an old story. It was needed and not out of the class when acquired. It is best to cease discussing this.

2. BAF is now looking for a new fighter. Obviously they will wait till IAF has decided on its MRCA selection. As explained by posters above, F 18 is the front runner although BAF pilots have been flying F 16 with TuAF for sometime. Russians want to sell their best. MIG 35 is on offer. They are more desperate after being jilted by IAF.

3. BD is not as cash-starved as some may imagine. Def always gets the top priority which may also surprise many. We have the very best fliers in the world. And we will give them the best we can afford. Quality, not quantity matters in air war. BD also does not neglect ground based air def.

4. Now that IAF has almost decided to buy Eurofighter, it will make sense for BAF to go for either F18, which some of its pilots have flown with RSAF, or MIG 35. My bet is that BAF's selected pieces will arrive before the Eurofighters because the Indian def procurement regime is infested with corruption, bureaucratic hurdles and general lethargy of the system.

Well, we should be realistic as far as budget goes. Including both the investment cost and the recurring ones. There will be political issues as well.

The MIG-35 is financially as well as technically more feasible. And a highly capable one at that. It is worth looking into it.

It comes with AESA package coupled with superb aerodynamic capabilities just like the MIG-29. And not only that, it is also a bargain. You can buy two MIG-35s for the price of one EFT.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/113259-iaf-mirage-2000-upgrade-slowed-weapons-2.html

F-18 costs a fortune and there will be strings attached to it.

Regarding American made jets and if I am not mistaken, the US blocked the sale of F-16s to Bangladesh back in the 90s. It is fair to say they would take similar stances today.

Source for US refusal of F-16s to Bangladesh: http://www.f-16.net/news_article188.html

Sorry if I didn't notice this, since I once recommended the F-16 for the BAF.

If BAF want a great jet in the future, the MIG-35 is the one to go for.

And she is one sexy looking bird

 

[fallstuff]

We don't share any border with Pakistan

They can't even deter smugglers, pirates and criminals on the Indo-Bangladesh borders. Those guys are often even better equipped than BGB

And we are talking about submarines and 4G jets? Ha! Funny. eidher kea dae kono kazh nhai naki?

We should focus on defense equipment according to national security requirements, not just showing them off and being of no real application.

Investing in MI-24s (example), data link, communications and sensor equipment on those volatile border regions should be prioritized more. The BGB still use single bolt action rifles of WWII era designs. They can use some more equipment.

The path to enlightenment is a rather difficult one, I shall not falter in assisting you to see the light !!

My point is Pakistan is in the west of Big neighbor ( hereon after called BN ), China is generally located in the N and NE. We don't have to match dollar for dollar. BN will not risk its west, N, and NE fronts as threat perceptions are high on those fronts. Threat perception is low on BD-BN border. They will allocate their limited resources as such.

The Bay is going to see activities in the near future. There are all kinds of litigation at the U.N relating to maritime boundaries. A few subs will serve the cause just fine.

Therefore, we really do not need to spend a ton of money ( we don't have it ) to have reasonable deterrence.

Do we really need these things ? What threat Belgium has ? It is under Nato umbrella, got BN all around them. It is crazy to think that somebody will attack them. Yet they have a formidable military. I doubt our cause is less worthy than that of Belgium, I believe when we are cut, we also bleed.

We can buy these 4g planes and subs easily over time and beef up the numbers.

The rule of poker is 'it is not about the move you make, it is what the other players think about your intentions.' In other words keep them guessing !!

 

[UKBengali]

I would personally prefer around 24 Mig-35 fighters. The reasons are that the cost, around 1 billion dollars, is affordable considering Bangladesh's current budget, and also Bangladesh already has at least some of the infrastructure and training regime in place as it already operates a squadron of the base Mig-29. A force of around 40 upgraded Mig-29/Mig-35 would be real deterrent to any adversary. Bangladesh should also look at augmenting these with around 2-3 AWACS aircraft - either Swedish or Chinese.

 

[desioptimist]

The path to enlightenment is a rather difficult one, I shall not falter in assisting you to see the light !!

Welcome prophet <Enter your name here> (lot of peace to you, your family, girlfriend, your dog etc).
May you have eternal healthy life which will allow you to distribute your unlimited wisdom forever.

 

[Zabaniyah]

The path to enlightenment is a rather difficult one, I shall not falter in assisting you to see the light !!

My point is Pakistan is in the west of Big neighbor ( hereon after called BN ), China is generally located in the N and NE. We don't have to match dollar for dollar. BN will not risk its west, N, and NE fronts as threat perceptions are high on those fronts. They will allocate their limited resources as such. Threat perception is low on BD-BN border. The Bay is going to see activities in the near future. There are all kinds of litigation at the U.N relating to maritime boundaries. A few subs will serve the cause just fine. Therefore, we really do not need to spend a ton of money ( we don't have it ) to have reasonable deterrence.

Do we really need these things ? What threat Belgium has ? It is under Nato umbrella, got BN all around them ? It is crazy to think that somebody will attack them. Yet they have a formidable military. I doubt our cause is less worthy than that of Belgium, I believe when we are cut, we also bleed.

We can buy these 4g planes and subs easily over time and beef up the numbers.

The rule of poker is 'it is not about the move you make, it is what the other players think about your intentions.' In other words keep them guessing !!

mmm...understand your point.

What about the military of Belgium? The Cold War is long over.

Belgium is a NATO member, but it has a very small military. It is still effective. And as long as it is effective it is fine. They don't even operate tanks
Their navy operates two frigates coupled with other patrol boats and support ships (we already have these). But the Belgians certainly make great guns

But definitely yes, overtime, we do need jets (the MIG-35 is an excellent contender) to gradually replace the F-7s and A-5s (both are very old designs). Though, Russian end-user support is very bad.

And maybe some subs, but that might prompt Myanmar to do the same. The Burmese bought their MIGs back in 2009, that is after us. And they have more twice the number of MIGs we have.

Currently, the greatest threat in Bangladesh is political instability. Especially with that vermin in office.

Securing our interests is one thing. As far as India and China is concerned, we need not compete with them, its a waste of time and money. We should rather follow their footsteps since they are and will be far more advanced than Bangladesh. We should support their advances throughout the 21st century. Maintaining good relations with both of them is very important.

 

[fallstuff]

mmm...understand your point.

What about the military of Belgium? The Cold War is long over.

Belgium is a NATO member, but it has a very small military. It is still effective. And as long as it is effective it is fine. They don't even operate tanks
Their navy operates two frigates coupled with other patrol boats and support ships (we already have these). But the Belgians certainly make great guns

But definitely yes, overtime, we do need jets (the MIG-35 is an excellent contender) to gradually replace the F-7s and A-5s (both are very old designs). Though, Russian end-user support is very bad.

And maybe some subs, but that might prompt Myanmar to do the same. The Burmese bought their MIGs back in 2009, that is after us. And they have more twice the number of MIGs we have.

Currently, the greatest threat in Bangladesh is political instability. Especially with that vermin in office.

Securing our interests is one thing. As far as India and China is concerned, we need not compete with them, its a waste of time and money. We should rather follow their footsteps since they are and will be far more advanced than Bangladesh. We should support their advances throughout the 21st century. Maintaining good relations with both of them is very important.

The endeavor goes on !!

The Belgian Army is the national military of Belgium. Since 2002, by a Royal Order issued by Albert II of Belgium the three independent armed forces were merged into one unified structure and organised with four components which consists of about 47,000 active troops. They are structured as follow:

Not bad for a country with 10.5 million people. Agreed they moved away from tanks, but a decent size air force nonetheless.


I agree that political instability is the numero uno issue, but that shouldn't keep us waiting for the other pressing issues.

 

[fallstuff]

Welcome prophet <Enter your name here> (lot of peace to you, your family, girlfriend, your dog etc).
May you have eternal healthy life which will allow you to distribute your unlimited wisdom forever.

Thats not a nice way to show your respects to a Prophet.

 

[desioptimist]

Thats not a nice way to show your respects to a Prophet.

Is there any way I can show more respect to you, do you prefer abbreviated respect like P.U.F.G.D.

 

[eastwatch]

i miss khaled m ali. He was military expert. . .

I read his brilliant posts on weapons systems alongwith photographs in some other forums. I requested him to contribute continuously in PDF because a person can learn so many things from him. In our Sub-forum here we really do not discuss anything brilliant about BD's defence matters.

We need people like Khaled, Raquib and Leon to contribute in the PDF too on whatever defense information we get from different sources. It will make our sub-forum more lively. Hope, Raquib will not leave, and Leon and others will rejoin PDF. We can get good contributions from mujib43, too.

 

[eastwatch]

The path to enlightenment is a rather difficult one, I shall not falter in assisting you to see the light !!

My point is Pakistan is in the west of Big neighbor ( hereon after called BN ), China is generally located in the N and NE. We don't have to match dollar for dollar. BN will not risk its west, N, and NE fronts as threat perceptions are high on those fronts. Threat perception is low on BD-BN border. They will allocate their limited resources as such.

The Bay is going to see activities in the near future. There are all kinds of litigation at the U.N relating to maritime boundaries. A few subs will serve the cause just fine.

Therefore, we really do not need to spend a ton of money ( we don't have it ) to have reasonable deterrence.

Do we really need these things ? What threat Belgium has ? It is under Nato umbrella, got BN all around them. It is crazy to think that somebody will attack them. Yet they have a formidable military. I doubt our cause is less worthy than that of Belgium, I believe when we are cut, we also bleed.

We can buy these 4g planes and subs easily over time and beef up the numbers.

The rule of poker is 'it is not about the move you make, it is what the other players think about your intentions.' In other words keep them guessing !!

1) I do not have the link now, but, only a week ago some Santos executive was saying they would need $25 billion investment to develop the 14 trillion cft of natural gas. I am not sure if he was talking about his company's own blocks (may be two) or the entire BoB.

2) But, consider the point that his company has no right to make comments on other blocks alloted to other oil companies like Phillip Conco. Now, if only Santos has 14 tcf gas in its own blocks, then the entire Bay is holding 100 tcf or more gas.

3) The price of 14 trillion tcf gas is $75 billion. So, the entire Bay may hold gas that can be valued at $500 billion or more. You are a visionery. Many blinds in this Forum will not get the points understood through their too fertile brains and keep on insisting to go against purchase of Migs. For them the issue is not Migs. It is the entire defence purchase they are targetting.

4) But, I must say, you are right that there is going to be a tug of wars among the three contestants in the BoB. India and Burma and even BD may not accept the verdicts given by the UNO arbitration. It will cause a tension and may lead to war.

 

[Zabaniyah]

The endeavor goes on !!

Not bad for a country with 10.5 million people. Agreed they moved away from tanks, but a decent size air force nonetheless.

I agree that political instability is the numero uno issue, but that shouldn't keep us waiting for the other pressing issues.

That is because they have money. Why compare Bangladesh to Belgium anyways?

You still don't explain as to what prompted Dhaka to procure the MIG-29s in the first place, way back in the 90s. Bangladesh is an impoverished country to begin with. In fact, everyone, including the USA and India were surprised at the procurement. And much to the opposition of BNP and others when the AL-led government procured them.

3) The price of 14 trillion tcf gas is $75 billion. So, the entire Bay may hold gas that can be valued at $500 billion or more. You are a visionery. Many blinds in this Forum will not get the points understood through their too fertile brains and keep on insisting to go against purchase of Migs. For them the issue is not Migs. It is the entire defence purchase they are targetting.

Do you mean the ENTIRE defense budget? We never said that. Why are you saying things we never said?

4) But, I must say, you are right that there is going to be a tug of wars among the three contestants in the BoB. India and Burma and even BD may not accept the verdicts given by the UNO arbitration. It will cause a tension and may lead to war.

There isn't going to be any war with India and Myanmar
Bangladesh Army Chief Visits Burma | PRIYO

Do you seriously think China and India would allow a war between Bangladesh and Myanmar? India is one of Myanmar's biggest customers for the natural gas it collects.

Please! Whatever disputes we have with other countries, lets be realistic! And not get lost into fantasies of military adventures.

 

[Raquib]

Well, we should be realistic as far as budget goes. Including both the investment cost and the recurring ones. There will be political issues as well.

The MIG-35 is financially as well as technically more feasible. And a highly capable one at that. It is worth looking into it.

It comes with AESA package coupled with superb aerodynamic capabilities just like the MIG-29. And not only that, it is also a bargain. You can buy two MIG-35s for the price of one EFT.
http://www.defence.pk/forums/india-defence/113259-iaf-mirage-2000-upgrade-slowed-weapons-2.html

F-18 costs a fortune and there will be strings attached to it.

Regarding American made jets and if I am not mistaken, the US blocked the sale of F-16s to Bangladesh back in the 90s. It is fair to say they would take similar stances today.

Source for US refusal of F-16s to Bangladesh: http://www.f-16.net/news_article188.html

Sorry if I didn't notice this, since I once recommended the F-16 for the BAF.

If BAF want a great jet in the future, the MIG-35 is the one to go for.

And she is one sexy looking bird

MiG-35? Don&#8217;t the Indians already have them? Plus I&#8217;d genuinely hate to see Myanmar going for the same fighters after we purchase them. We should consider our neighbors&#8217; strength, the fighter jets they use and go for the ones they don&#8217;t have and are unlikely to acquire in the future. And we should also keep in mind that a fighter&#8217;s look isn&#8217;t going to play any particular role during warfare, its combat efficiency is. In this regard, my first and only choice would be F-18 Super Hornet since our economy is larger and more stable than ever. As you&#8217;ve posted earlier on US refusing to sell F-16 to us back in 1999 I just hope that they don&#8217;t refuse us this time. And I&#8217;m quite optimistic they won&#8217;t, since the US Navy left one F-18 fighter for BAF as a gift, and that&#8217;s a positive sign.