VIEW: Success lies in secularism —Dr Irfan Zafar

[unicorn]

The suggestion is forwarded by a muslim initially, so in the light of basic definition he was answered in my post.If a non muslim proposes this suggestion of secularism to a muslim then first instead of arguing with him about his suggestion he should be first asked about the basic understandings of Islam and should be asked about what weaknesses he is seeing in it.That is exactly the reason why you asked about non muslims.So making an argument first here with you is not adviseable rather you should take little pain in understanding what Islam is saying about non muslims.

An Islamic state is bound to distinguish (i.e. discriminates) between Muslims and non-Muslims. However the Islamic law "Shari`a" guarantees to non-Muslims "certain specifically stated rights beyond which they are not permitted to meddle in the affairs of the state because they do not subscribe to its ideology." Once they embrace the Islamic faith, they "become equal participants in all matters concerning the state and the government."

“There is no compulsion in religion…” (Quran 2:256)

The Rights of Non-Muslims in Islam (part 1 of 13): An Islamic Basis - The Religion of Islam

 

[Bang Galore]

The suggestion is forwarded by a muslim initially, so in the light of basic definition he was answered in my post.If a non muslim proposes this suggestion of secularism to a muslim then first instead of arguing with him about his suggestion he should be first asked about the basic understandings of Islam and should be asked about what weaknesses he is seeing in it.That is exactly the reason why you asked about non muslims.So making an argument first here with you is not adviseable rather you should take little pain in understanding what Islam is saying about non muslims.

An Islamic state is bound to distinguish (i.e. discriminates) between Muslims and non-Muslims. However the Islamic law "Shari`a" guarantees to non-Muslims "certain specifically stated rights beyond which they are not permitted to meddle in the affairs of the state because they do not subscribe to its ideology." Once they embrace the Islamic faith, they "become equal participants in all matters concerning the state and the government."

“There is no compulsion in religion…” (Quran 2:256)

The Rights of Non-Muslims in Islam (part 1 of 13): An Islamic Basis - The Religion of Islam

Two quick points.

I do not debate any particular religion. Therefore I will not dwell on arguments based on religious strictures.

Second - My point still stands. Until the followers of a majority religion accept that it is unfair to subject those not belonging to their religion to the sayings in the religious strictures of the majority, there is no way secularism, as an idea will take hold. The point is not whether you as a member of your religion feel that your religion gives "fair & just" treatment to those not belonging, it is whether the minorities feel that & agree with your interpretation. It is normally seen that admiration for any particular religious scriptures is limited to the adherents of that faith alone which is why a secular state (one not circumscribed by any one faith) is seen as acceptable & fair to everyone.

 

[Janubaba]

Two quick points.

I do not debate any particular religion. Therefore I will not dwell on arguments based on religious strictures.

Second - My point still stands. Until the followers of a majority religion accept that it is unfair to subject those not belonging to their religion to the sayings in the religious strictures of the majority, there is no way secularism, as an idea will take hold. The point is not whether you as a member of your religion feel that your religion gives "fair & just" treatment to those not belonging, it is whether the minorities feel that & agree with your interpretation. It is normally seen that admiration for any particular religious scriptures is limited to the adherents of that faith alone which is why a secular state (one not circumscribed by any one faith) is seen as acceptable & fair to everyone.

Sir Islam is not just a religion its a whole system

 

[unicorn]

Two quick points.

I do not debate any particular religion. Therefore I will not dwell on arguments based on religious strictures.

Since you are not debating any particular religion but also not helping yourself in giving your views about religion and then asking the other person to not make you understand in the light of religion.Are you sure of your self what you are doing.Well you know That's Ok.I understand

Second - My point still stands. Until the followers of a majority religion accept that it is unfair to subject those not belonging to their religion to the sayings in the religious strictures of the majority, there is no way secularism, as an idea will take hold. The point is not whether you as a member of your religion feel that your religion gives "fair & just" treatment to those not belonging, it is whether the minorities feel that & agree with your interpretation. It is normally seen that admiration for any particular religious scriptures is limited to the adherents of that faith alone which is why a secular state (one not circumscribed by any one faith) is seen as acceptable & fair to everyone.

Completely rheotric and contradicts with your first point.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Sir Islam is not just a religion its a whole system

and system should only be applied to Muslims..not to a whole country which includes many type of people who believes or does not believes in many gods.

 

[jetti]

Islam is the only solution Islam is a complete system Secularism has even started failing in Turkey Islam is the only solution and will be implemented if governments will not do it people on their own will rise up and implement it on their own

Islam has failed already in most places.

 

[jetti]

Sir Islam is not just a religion its a whole system

can a country follow islamic law without being muslim.. eg italy where 100% is christian

 

[Janubaba]

and system should only be applied to Muslims..not to a whole country which includes many type of people who believes or does not believes in many gods.

It is the system for the whole world and it will be implemented in the whole world

 

[Janubaba]

Islam has failed already in most places.

Sir Islam has not failed Secularism has failed because it is a man made system but Islam is from GOD not from a human being

 

[Janubaba]

can a country follow islamic law without being muslim.. eg italy where 100% is christian

Yes they can as a matter of fact they should because Islam will be implemented in the whole world

 

[Black Widow]

Sir Turkey started developing under the government which is known for being Islamist and slowly they are taking their nation back to Islam and Shariah

please read history of turkey, After first world war Ottoman Empire was wiped out.. It was lucky for turks that they got leader like Kemal pasha... under pasha turkey developed, else it would have been be like third world country... And as far my knowledge, Pasha was not Islamic... he was liberal democratic Muslim...

 

[Janubaba]

please read history of turkey, After first world war Ottoman Empire was wiped out.. It was lucky for turks that they got leader like Kemal pasha... under pasha turkey developed, else it would have been be like third world country... And as far my knowledge, Pasha was not Islamic... he was liberal democratic Muslim...

Yes and now Turkey is again ruled by those people who everyone know are Islamists and I have friends in Turkey and they all know Turkey is going back to Islam and going back very fast

 

[Black Widow]

It is the system for the whole world and it will be implemented in the whole world

Good luck for that...

Sir Islam has not failed Secularism has failed because it is a man made system but Islam is from GOD not from a human being

your personal belief has no value in logical world......

Sir Islam is not just a religion its a whole system

Its whole system only for Muslim, For non Muslim, its just like any other religion, Islamic law/policies/belief must not be forced to non Muslim.. Infact even in India some part of sharia is applicable to only Muslim...

Sir Islam has not failed Secularism has failed because it is a man made system but Islam is from GOD not from a human being

If Democracy would have been failed concept, this list would have name of democratic country ...

Failed state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Black Widow]

Yes and now Turkey is again ruled by those people who everyone know are Islamists and I have friends in Turkey and they all know Turkey is going back to Islam and going back very fast

And who is that frnd of your>???? Abdulla gul???

Abdullah Gül - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Janubaba]

Good luck for that...



your personal belief has no value in logical world......



Its whole system only for Muslim, For non Muslim, its just like any other religion, Islamic law/policies/belief must not be forced to non Muslim.. Infact even in India some part of sharia is applicable to only Muslim...



If Democracy would have been failed concept, this list would have name of democratic country ...

Failed state - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Sir Islam is the system which the GOD sent and it will be implemented in the whole world even though kafirs don't like it