What's new

Vertical Launch Astra Based Air Defence System (LLQRM) Under Development

Q
Quick reaction SAMs are different than normal SAMs.

Quick reaction SAM can be used for defence of ships as well.
For ships,we will co-dovolp a dedicated one called maitri,that too with in 3 years.and by logic investing in land based astra with Russian seeker is simply not a wise decision.
 
.
Q

For ships,we will co-dovolp a dedicated one called maitri,that too with in 3 years.and by logic investing in land based astra
with Russian seeker is simply not a wise decision.

Astra has indigenous seeker I guess.

It is solid fuelled and there are some major improvements as well.
 
.
No,its using Russian
Astra has indigenous seeker I guess.

It is solid fuelled and there are some major improvements as well.
No it is using Russian agat seeker,may be from astra mk2 will have Indian seeker.

I am not telling that area defence Akash missile system is negating the need for quick reaction SAM in point defence role,we already having similar but more capably maitri project which doesn't justify spending money for astra based quick reaction missile
 
Last edited:
.
India already has 25 km range Akash, adding another 20 km range missile?
Akash is based on the SA-6 airframe and is not a Fire-and-Forget system

Akash IS the soviet era SA-6 grumble.
No, it is not identical. The internal schema shows a different layout with an onboard digital computer, no Semi-active seeker, different propellant, different actuators and command guidance datalinks. It is also different in materials. Composite technology for Akash includes radome assemblies, booster liners, ablative liners, sustainer liners, compression moulded wings and fins. The system also uses different radars.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akash_(missile)
 
Last edited:
.
Akash is based on the SA-6 airframe and is not a Fire-and-Forget system


No, it is not identical. The internal schema shows a different layout with an onboard digital computer, no Semi-active seeker, different propellant, different actuators and command guidance datalinks. It is also different in materials. Composite technology for Akash includes radome assemblies, booster liners, ablative liners, sustainer liners, compression moulded wings and fins. The system also uses different radars.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akash_(missile)
what do you think of this LLQRSAM?
 
.
It doesn't. Different size, different dia, diff length.
Oh really?

Akash
Length 578 cm (228 in) [I've also found reference to 582 cn]
Diameter 35 cm (14 in)
Speed: around Mach 2.5.
http://static.expressindia.com/expressindia/newpic/IndianMissiles.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akash_(missile)
domain-b_AkashSAM.jpg

akash1.jpg

AKASH AIR DEFENCE WEAPON SYSTEM
akash_512153f.jpg


SA-6 Kub
Length 5800 mm
Diameter 335 mm
Wing span: 1.245 m
Max speed: Mach 2.8
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/row/sa-6.htm
2K12 Kub - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

SA-6_gainful_Missile_Russe_21.gif

3M9-Gainful-Cutaway-1.png

3M9M Gainful Cutaway (via Vestnik-PVO)
1 1SB4M CW monopulse semi-active homing seeker with Doppler closure rate capability
2 3E27 CW radio two channel proximity fuse (30 m nominal radius)
3 3N12 57 kg blast-fragmention warhead
4 1SB6M Autopilot
5 Ramjet intake ducts
6 9D16K sustainer solid gas generator charge (67 kg LK-6TM reducing propellant)
7 Frangible seals
8 Boost stage solid propellant charge (172 kg VIK-2 propellant)
9 Exhaust nozzle
10 Cruciform tailfins
11 Cruciform wing
2K12 Kub/Kvadrat Self Propelled Air Defence System / SA-6Gainful / Cамоходный Зенитный Ракетный Комплекс 2К12 Куб/Квадрат
22282596.jpg~original


what do you think of this LLQRSAM?
Dunno yet. I'm not too familiar with Astra. Spyder isn't VL, this is. But, for the role envisaged, that may not be necessary (compare RAM on naval ships. Block 2 RAM will eventually be available in quadpack for ELS for MK41 VLU)
 
.
Dunno yet. I'm not too familiar with Astra. Spyder isn't VL, this is. But, for the role envisaged, that may not be necessary (compare RAM on naval ships. Block 2 RAM will eventually be available in quadpack for ELS for MK41 VLU)
why ?

give some info about RAM block 2
 
.
Oh really?

Akash
Length 578 cm (228 in) [I've also found reference to 582 cn]
Diameter 35 cm (14 in)
Speed: around Mach 2.5.
http://static.expressindia.com/expressindia/newpic/IndianMissiles.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akash_(missile)
domain-b_AkashSAM.jpg

akash1.jpg

AKASH AIR DEFENCE WEAPON SYSTEM
akash_512153f.jpg


SA-6 Kub
Length 5800 mm
Diameter 335 mm
Wing span: 1.245 m
Max speed: Mach 2.8
http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/row/sa-6.htm
2K12 Kub - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

SA-6_gainful_Missile_Russe_21.gif

3M9-Gainful-Cutaway-1.png

3M9M Gainful Cutaway (via Vestnik-PVO)
1 1SB4M CW monopulse semi-active homing seeker with Doppler closure rate capability
2 3E27 CW radio two channel proximity fuse (30 m nominal radius)
3 3N12 57 kg blast-fragmention warhead
4 1SB6M Autopilot
5 Ramjet intake ducts
6 9D16K sustainer solid gas generator charge (67 kg LK-6TM reducing propellant)
7 Frangible seals
8 Boost stage solid propellant charge (172 kg VIK-2 propellant)
9 Exhaust nozzle
10 Cruciform tailfins
11 Cruciform wing
2K12 Kub/Kvadrat Self Propelled Air Defence System / SA-6Gainful / Cамоходный Зенитный Ракетный Комплекс 2К12 Куб/Квадрат
22282596.jpg~original



Dunno yet. I'm not too familiar with Astra. Spyder isn't VL, this is. But, for the role envisaged, that may not be necessary (compare RAM on naval ships. Block 2 RAM will eventually be available in quadpack for ELS for MK41 VLU)
Crosspost

RADAR

Akash SAM

a Battery Level Radar - the Rajendra, and a Command post (Battery Control Centre). Two batteries are deployed as a Squadron (Air Force), while up to four form an Akash Group (Army configuration). In both configurations, an extra Group Control Centre (GCC) is added, which acts as the Command and Control HQ of the Squadron or Group. Based on a single mobile platform, GCC establishes links with Battery Control Centres and conducts air defense operations in coordination with air defense set up in a zone of operations. For early warning, the GCC relies on the Central Acquisition Radar. However, individual batteries can also be deployed with the cheaper, 2-D BSR (Battery Surveillance Radar) with a range of over 100 km.

SA6 Gainful

SURN 1S91 vehicle included two radar station - a target acquisition and distribution radar 1S11 and a continuous wave illuminator 1S31, in addition to an IFF interrogator and an optical channel. The acquisition range of the radar was reported as 50 km (31 mi) for the Phantom II type target.

Engagement

AKASH SAM
Each Akash battery can engage up to four targets simultaneously. Each battery has four launchers with three missiles each, with each Rajendra able to guide eight missiles in total, with a maximum of two missiles per target. Up to a maximum of four targets can be engaged simultaneously by a typical battery with a single Rajendra if one (or two) missile is allotted per target. A single Akash missile has an 88% Probability of kill. Two missiles can be fired, five seconds apart, to raise the Probability of Kill to 98.5%

SA6- Gainful
It can only guide one or two missiles to a single target at any time. The missile is initially command guided with terminal semi active radar homing (SARH), with target illumination provided by the "Straight Flush" radar. Detonation is via either the impact or proximity fuze

Configuration:

Akash SAM:
An Akash battery comprises four 3D phased array radars and four launchers with three missiles each, all of which are interlinked. Each radar is able to track 16 targets simultaneously and control a launcher with 3 missiles. Hence it is reported to be able to detect 100 and track 64 targets and simultaneously attack any 8 of those targets at one time. The Akash system is comparable to the Patriot system, but unlike the Patriot, Akash is fully mobile and capable of protecting a moving convoy of vehicles

SA6-Gainful:
Each 2K12 battery consists of a number of similar tracked vehicles, one of which carries the 1S91 (SURN vehicle, NATO designation "Straight Flush") 25 kW G/H band radar (range 75 km/47 miles) equipped with a continuous wave illuminator, in addition to an optical sight. The battery usually also includes four triple-missile transporter erector launchers (TELs) and four trucks each carrying three spare missiles and a crane

MISSILE:

Akash SAM:
Akash is a surface-to-air missile with an intercept range of 30 km.[2] It has a launch weight of 720 kg, a diameter of 35 cm and a length of 5.78 metres. Akash flies at supersonic speed, reaching around Mach 2.5. It can reach an altitude of 18 km and can be fired from both tracked and wheeled platforms.[2] An on-board guidance system coupled with an actuator system makes the missile maneuverable up to 15g loads and a tail chase capability for end game engagemen

SA6-Gainful:
The fairly large missiles have an effective range of 4–24 km (2.5–15 miles) and an effective altitude of 50–14000 m (164–45,931 ft). The missile weighs 599 kg (1321 lb) and the warhead weighs 56 kg (123 lb). Top missile speed is approx. Mach 2.8. The combined propulsion system 9D16K included solid fuel rocket motor which, when burned out, forms the combustion chamber for a ramjet




thanks
 
.
why ?

give some info about RAM block 2
ORD_ExLS_Insert_Explained_lg.jpg


exls_weapons.jpg


ramupr6.jpg


image_popup.jpg


The RAM Block 2 is an upgraded version of the Rolling Airframe Missile (RAM) ship self-defense missile system. RAM Block 2, the latest step in the development of the Rolling Airframe Missile, is a kinematic and RF receiver upgrade of Block 1/1A. A larger, more powerful rocket motor and advanced control section make the missile two and a half times more maneuverable with one and a half times the effective intercept range. This provides the Block 2 missile with the capability to defeat high-maneuvering threats, increasing the survivability of the defended ship. An enhanced RF receiver allows detection of anti-ship missiles that employ low probability of intercept receivers.
Raytheon: Rolling Airframe Missile (RAM) Guided Missile System

As compared to the Original RIM-116 (2 rather than 4 forward fins, slimmer rear section, different tail controls)
searam-rim-116-920-19.jpg

RIM116RAM2013wikicloseup.jpg
 
.
ORD_ExLS_Insert_Explained_lg.jpg


exls_weapons.jpg


ramupr6.jpg


image_popup.jpg


The RAM Block 2 is an upgraded version of the Rolling Airframe Missile (RAM) ship self-defense missile system. RAM Block 2, the latest step in the development of the Rolling Airframe Missile, is a kinematic and RF receiver upgrade of Block 1/1A. A larger, more powerful rocket motor and advanced control section make the missile two and a half times more maneuverable with one and a half times the effective intercept range. This provides the Block 2 missile with the capability to defeat high-maneuvering threats, increasing the survivability of the defended ship. An enhanced RF receiver allows detection of anti-ship missiles that employ low probability of intercept receivers.
Raytheon: Rolling Airframe Missile (RAM) Guided Missile System

As compared to the Original RIM-116 (2 rather than 4 forward fins, slimmer rear section, different tail controls)
searam-rim-116-920-19.jpg

RIM116RAM2013wikicloseup.jpg
share some technical specs of block 2 and what is different with respect to block 1......wiki is showing only block 1.......and price /missile

and also you didn't explain this
Dunno yet. I'm not too familiar with Astra. Spyder isn't VL, this is. But, for the role envisaged, that may not be necessary (compare RAM on naval ships. Block 2 RAM will eventually be available in quadpack for ELS for MK41 VLU)
 
Last edited:
.
share some technical specs of block 2 and what is different with respect to block 1......wiki is showing only block 1.......and price /missile
Read 54, visit Raytheon.
RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

RAM Block 2 has larger engine and extra canards for increased range and manoeuverability forward, and different controls in the tail. It also has an upgraded radio frequency (RF) receiver, and an improved control system.The Block 2's new launch motor probably gives the USN a 30% increase in range over the legacy RAM Block 1, and Raytheon significantly improved the Block 2's RF seeker capability. The engine upgrade combined with the new RF receiver will enable the RAM Block 2 to home in on inbound missile radar emissions earlier and target hostile missiles at a greater distance. Even though the Block 2's motor is larger than its predecessor and there is a new set of canards forward on the missile, the Block 2 still fits inside the launch tube used by legacy RAMs. Although Raytheon is currently upgrading US and international RAM Block 1s, the older missile cannot be upgraded to the Block 2. RAM is a co-operative programme between the US and German governments with industry support from Raytheon and RAM Systems (RAMSYS) of Germany.
First of Raytheon's RAM Block 2 missiles delivered to USN - IHS Jane's 360


.
p1536070.jpg

and also you didn't explain this
A trainable launcher gives a more direct line of fire to target, whereas a VLS first goes straight up and only then towards the target (=longer flight time). VLS is mainly useful in defeating attacks from multiple directions in quick succession.
Block 0
image013.jpg

Block 2
ba4a29e32de67805d0d1c4efe4140dd0.JPG


Block 1 and 2 together
53fea2c093b68.preview-620.jpg
 
Last edited:
. .
Read 54, visit Raytheon.
RIM-116 Rolling Airframe Missile - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

RAM Block 2 has larger engine and extra canards for increased range and manoeuverability forward, and different controls in the tail. It also has an upgraded radio frequency (RF) receiver, and an improved control system.The Block 2's new launch motor probably gives the USN a 30% increase in range over the legacy RAM Block 1, and Raytheon significantly improved the Block 2's RF seeker capability. The engine upgrade combined with the new RF receiver will enable the RAM Block 2 to home in on inbound missile radar emissions earlier and target hostile missiles at a greater distance. Even though the Block 2's motor is larger than its predecessor and there is a new set of canards forward on the missile, the Block 2 still fits inside the launch tube used by legacy RAMs. Although Raytheon is currently upgrading US and international RAM Block 1s, the older missile cannot be upgraded to the Block 2. RAM is a co-operative programme between the US and German governments with industry support from Raytheon and RAM Systems (RAMSYS) of Germany.
First of Raytheon's RAM Block 2 missiles delivered to USN - IHS Jane's 360


.
p1536070.jpg


A trainable launcher gives a more direct line of fire to target, whereas a VLS first goes straight up and only then towards the target (=longer flight time). VLS is mainly useful in defeating attacks from multiple directions in quick succession.
Block 0
image013.jpg

Block 2
ba4a29e32de67805d0d1c4efe4140dd0.JPG


Block 1 and 2 together
53fea2c093b68.preview-620.jpg
:tup::tup:
 
.
Why can't we have a SAM system that can reach 300+ Km

What is this obsession with adding little by little
Even if you had a 300+km SAM, you would still need shorter range SAM's e.g. for point air defence or simply because while certain terrain may be covered by the LR SAM this doesn't mean it isn't penetrable. In mountenous terrain you might fly very low in valleys, so you're screened from the LR SAM and you get away with this unless there are sorter range systems along likely attack routes.

PLus you might want to work with interlinked independent system, so you keep some AD integrety even if command structures get eroded.

LOCAL201312211444358164737761325.jpg


Integrated+Air-Defence+Configuration.jpg


Spyder_MR_SR_ground-to-air_defence_missile_system_Israeli_Defence_Industry_Military_Technology_Paris_Air-show_2011_001.jpg


NASAMS.jpg


Skywatcher.jpg
 
.
@sancho is this real?
The range is a non-issue as DRDO are already working on a mk.2 version of the Astra with a longer range the key here is the lessons and technology DRDO will be able to accrue by developing a ground VL variant of an advanced BVR missile.

I think its the same Astra based Air Defence System. Range 25 to 30 Km.

India developing its own short-range surface-to-air missiles for navy
327530-missiles.jpg

Unlike Akash (pictured), the new missiles will be cannister based

India is working on a short-range surface-to-air missile (SRSAM) which, when developed, can be used by the country's navy which earlier rejected the indigenous Akash missiles.

The new indigenous project is at an initial stage and is being developed by the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO), a source in the know of the project development told dna.

The new missiles with a range of 25-30 kilometres can be used by the Army and the Air Force too, the source said.

The project is independent of the DRDO's and the French firm MBDA's joint missile programme for navy that the government took a decision on recently as reported by dna on March 31.

Unlike Akash missile, the new missiles will be a cannister based and vertically-launched system suitable for naval ships. They can be placed hidden in the ship's dock and escape enemy surveillance radars.

"The fact that they will be vertically-launched next-generation quick-reaction missiles will enable Navy to strike a target in all directions from the ships with much improved manoeuvering," said the source.

The cannister based SRSAM will also absorb the large part of the flume that emanates during a missile launch. This will be to the Navy's advantage that have limited space to operate from the warships.

The new project's cost components and time frame of completion could not be immediately known.

India already has long range cannister based missiles like Brahmos and Agni but navy's requirement is a short range quick-reaction missile.

The medium-range surface-to-air missile Akash was initially made keeping in view Army's requirement but later its Air Force version was developed. The Navy, however, hadn't found it fitting its requirement.

Meanwhile the Indian Navy is also preparing to equip its warships with Israeli Barak-8 air-defence missile system which is to happen by the year end.

Also, the DRDO has recently begun engaging with the French firm MBDA for development of nine SRSAMs which have 40 missiles each. India recently revived the $5 billion SRSAM 'Maitri' project - a joint programme between the DRDO and MBDA whcih had seen no headway since 2007.

Source:- India developing its own short-range surface-to-air missiles for navy | Latest News & Updates at Daily News & Analysis
 
.

Pakistan Defence Latest Posts

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom