US 'bunker-buster' not powerful enough against Iran

[Oldman1]

Judging from the amount of misses the US military makes, I'm pretty sure they can't throw a flying drill attached to a missile and make it hit the same 3 foot wide burrow hole twice.

Watch the video I just posted. And for those misses it can be technical or human error. You can't deny the accuracy of the weapons.

 

[unicorn]

Watch the video I just posted. And for those misses it can be technical or human error. You can't deny the accuracy of the weapons.

Military action against Iran premature: Dempsey

"A conflict with Iran would be really destabilising, and I'm not just talking from the security perspective," he said. "It would be economically destabilising," he said in an interview with the National Journal.

http://zeenews.**********/news/world/military-action-against-iran-premature-dempsey_755059.html

General Martin Dempsey changed his precious stand about military operation in Iran after this news about MOP had surfaced.


His previous statement
US General: We Can Successfully Attack Iran

Chairman of the U.S. Joint Chiefs of Staff Martin Dempsey said Tuesday that the United States can successfully attack Iran, if necessary. His biggest worry is that Iran will "miscalculate our resolve.

US General: We Can Successfully Attack Iran - Global Agenda - News - Israel National News

 

[Oldman1]

Military action against Iran premature: Dempsey


http://zeenews.**********/news/world/military-action-against-iran-premature-dempsey_755059.html

General Martin Dempsey changed his precious stand about military operation in Iran after this news about MOP had surfaced.


His previous statement
US General: We Can Successfully Attack Iran



US General: We Can Successfully Attack Iran - Global Agenda - News - Israel National News

The first link don't work.

 

[unicorn]

The first link don't work.

I have no intention to convince you on the issue. Make your damn mind

Dempsey: 'Premature' to Use Military Force Against Iran - Yochi J. Dreazen and Kevin Baron - NationalJournal.com

Dempsey: Strike against Iran wou... JPost - Iranian Threat - News

U.S. Military Chief Says "Premature" to Use Military Force against Iran

 

[Donatello]

Sometime i can't belive that this is reality.

Americans looking for more blood around the world. Man..

 

[gambit]

The link to your calculator does not work.

Works just fine with me. Looks like operator error on your end.

It is good to know that you have accepted that the US bomb myth is actually a bluff.

How is that a 'myth'? The bomb is real. Just because it does not penetrate to the degree that WE wanted, that does not mean Iran does not care about it. Just because all I have a .22 pistol instead of a .44 Magnum, does that mean you do not care if I start shooting in your direction?

 

[gambit]

The USA claimed it was prepared against the Soviet Union,We never saw the USA and the Soviet Union in war to judge how much the USA was prepared as it claimed.

You never saw the Soviets in a war against US either to judge them. This is a stupid criticism.

As I said before, I don't underestimate the US Air Force,...

Of course you have. Just like most here. And that is the way we like it.

It's a formidable force, but you're ignoring the fact that it doesn't have infinite capabilities.

Did we say we do? Try to find a better critical approach than 'infinite'.

Yes, the US bunker busters are precision guided bombs using GPS, but they do have limits for the range of operation. They can be dropped on the target from a definite distance, surely you can't drop them on Iran if your B2's fly on Iraq for example. I don't know how long that range of operation is, if you tell me how long the range of operation for those GDS guided bunker busters are we can talk about it in a better way.

I tried to understand what you said there but decided that it was not worth it. Suffice to say that during the air campaign over Yugoslavia, our B-2s flew from CONUS to Yugoslavia and returned. There will be no problems with B-2s from CONUS over to Iran and back.

 

[gambit]

well It's claimed that GPS can be fooled or at least mad unusable if it is for a small area

True. But not for altitude.

another question if you need two of these bombs to destroy a target you must drop them at the exact same position because these bombs don't destroy the top layer of fortification they are designed to detonate deep underground so there will be a small hole on the ground and a big havoc 30-40 m under ground . this can be done with small bombs but can it be done with a 14 ton bombs?can you drop both of them at the same position with the same penetration angle ?

Just because Iran cannot do <something> that does not mean we cannot as well. From the famous Desert Storm bombing footage, give me a credible argument as to why one bomb cannot follow its predecessor when delivered from the same aircraft when we know we can and have delivered bombs on the same target from different aircrafts from different positions.

---------- Post added at 10:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:20 PM ----------

Hmmm... Isn't that ummm, yes, you mean you'd "terrorize" them to think so. Who else does that? Hmmmmmmm...

---------- Post added at 06:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:40 PM ----------

I'm interested to know what fortifications did the Iranians do. Was it like another layer of concrete or something more improvised as they normally do things there...

You can call it 'terrorism' if you like. But my point was that if a target is bombarded enough to make its accessibility and sustainability uncertain, then said target can be considered to be 90% rendered ineffective.

 

[TruthSeeker]

If the USA decides to try to take out Iranian nuclear facilities by military means, then it will first completely disable Iranian air defences to establish complete air superiority. Once this is accomplished (and it will be) then the nuclear facilities can be struck repeatedly. If the US bombs cannot destroy the facilities down to the lowest levels, then they can, at least, make tombs of the facilities and can strike repeately against any attempt to "rescue" the entombed nuclear workers. The point is that, unless the Iranian forces can stop the US from establishing total air superiority, they cannot defend their nuclear facilities, no matter how deep they are and no matter how much concrete they have poured.

Of course, the Iranians can then strike the US with terrorist-style attacks, such as exploding dirty bombs in Washington and New York. Whether or not the US could defend against such retaliation is as much of an open question as the one about destroying Iranian nuclear facilities. Such is the unpredictability of war. This is why the US should NOT think that it can destroy Iran's nuclear facilities without losing a major American city to nuclear contamination.

 

[Arian]

You never saw the Soviets in a war against US either to judge them. This is a stupid criticism.

I didn't judge anyone or anything. I just said that the US claim of being prepared against the Soviets can not be proved. Just because I say it can not be proved doesn't mean that I'm saying it is disproved. It can't be disproved either.

Did we say we do? Try to find a better critical approach than 'infinite'.

Why you like to jump in in any discussion even if it's not addressed to you? My post was addressed to Oldman1 because he said that the US B2's will fly over Iran and will drop their bombs on the target from a long distance before they get into trouble by the Iranian air defense. I said that the US doesn't have infinite or unlimited capabilities.

I tried to understand what you said there but decided that it was not worth it. Suffice to say that during the air campaign over Yugoslavia, our B-2s flew from CONUS to Yugoslavia and returned. There will be no problems with B-2s from CONUS over to Iran and back.

Well, either you have comprehension problems or you don't like to read others because you're too obsessed with your own arguments that you like to insist on your nonsense in every discussion you participate.
Yugoslavia wars were around 2 decades ago, it's irrelevant to compare the performance of US B2's in those series of wars with a possible war that might happen in 2012.

 

[gambit]

I didn't judge anyone or anything. I just said that the US claim of being prepared against the Soviets can not be proved. Just because I say it can not be proved doesn't mean that I'm saying it is disproved. It can't be disproved either.

Neither can the Soviets' claim of being prepared against US. You made an empty criticism.

Why you like to jump in in any discussion even if it's not addressed to you? My post was addressed to Oldman1 because he said that the US B2's will fly over Iran and will drop their bombs on the target from a long distance before they get into trouble by the Iranian air defense. I said that the US doesn't have infinite or unlimited capabilities.

We do not need to. We just need to be good enough.

Well, either you have comprehension problems or you don't like to read others because you're too obsessed with your own arguments that you like to insist on your nonsense in every discussion you participate.
Yugoslavia wars were around 2 decades ago, it's irrelevant to compare the performance of US B2's in those series of wars with a possible war that might happen in 2012.

It is not irrelevant, how else can you explain something call 'Military History' where students studied what happened hundreds and thousands of years ago? What the USAF did two decades ago is even more relevant. I hope the entire Iranian military establishment is as shortsighted as you are.

 

[Oldman1]

I have no intention to convince you on the issue. Make your damn mind

Dempsey: 'Premature' to Use Military Force Against Iran - Yochi J. Dreazen and Kevin Baron - NationalJournal.com

Dempsey: Strike against Iran wou... JPost - Iranian Threat - News

U.S. Military Chief Says "Premature" to Use Military Force against Iran

Whoa whoa calm down. I wanted to look at the link and you start spouting about not convincing me on the subject and tell me to make up my dam mind as you said. That kinda contradicts the purpose of giving me the link in the first place.

 

[Oldman1]

I didn't judge anyone or anything. I just said that the US claim of being prepared against the Soviets can not be proved. Just because I say it can not be proved doesn't mean that I'm saying it is disproved. It can't be disproved either.


Why you like to jump in in any discussion even if it's not addressed to you? My post was addressed to Oldman1 because he said that the US B2's will fly over Iran and will drop their bombs on the target from a long distance before they get into trouble by the Iranian air defense. I said that the US doesn't have infinite or unlimited capabilities.



Well, either you have comprehension problems or you don't like to read others because you're too obsessed with your own arguments that you like to insist on your nonsense in every discussion you participate.
Yugoslavia wars were around 2 decades ago, it's irrelevant to compare the performance of US B2's in those series of wars with a possible war that might happen in 2012.

As I said before the B2s were designed to penetrate into enemy airspace combine with long range weapons. Several factors I have not included can contribute to a successful operation against hardened bunkers.

 

[Hack-Hook]

True. But not for altitude.


Just because Iran cannot do <something> that does not mean we cannot as well. From the famous Desert Storm bombing footage, give me a credible argument as to why one bomb cannot follow its predecessor when delivered from the same aircraft when we know we can and have delivered bombs on the same target from different aircrafts from different positions.

well the bomb eventually must come down and if you can jam
at low altitude you can jam it at high altitude just need a bigger
jammer

and about the second part Oh mighty USA ,I knew you believe it
can do any thing but when you made the bomb 10 time bigger it
would be 100 time harder to stir it.

 

[Arian]

Neither can the Soviets' claim of being prepared against US. You made an empty criticism.

Well, I know repeating myself won't help, because you like to keep talking nonsense. Oldman1 claimed that the USA was prepared for a soviet attack, that claim can't be proved. No one is talking about any Soviet's claim right now that you say 'the Soviet's claim of being prepared against US' can't be proved. You just like to have said something for the sake of playing the role of a smart ***.

We do not need to. We just need to be good enough.

Fine. And you're not good enough at the moment. This one too can't be proved or disproved because you haven't launched an attack yet.

It is not irrelevant, how else can you explain something call 'Military History' where students studied what happened hundreds and thousands of years ago? What the USAF did two decades ago is even more relevant. I hope the entire Iranian military establishment is as shortsighted as you are.

The students learn military history to learn from the mistakes, not to use the same tactics now. Do you say the tactics and strategies of the Achaemenid Army is still adoptable today?
Again, because I know talking to you will lead us nowhere, I shall not exhaust myself explaining why I think it's irrelevant to talk about a war that has happened two decades ago. I prefer to discuss things with other Americans, I feel I benefit more if I discuss things from them than I repeat myself over obvious things for you, If you don't jump in though.

---------- Post added at 01:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 PM ----------

As I said before the B2s were designed to penetrate into enemy airspace combine with long range weapons. Several factors I have not included can contribute to a successful operation against hardened bunkers.

And I told you that we needed to know how long the range of operation of those weapons are to come to a reasonable conclusion. Can US B2's drop bombs on a target from 400 kms away for example?