Update: Indian troops killed soldier after questioning: Pakistan Army

[Mirza Jatt]

good work by Indian army....

 

[Gentelman]

That's a lame excuse.. Get out of anecdotal comments and compare numbers.. If you call BJP as a terrorist organization, then I am sorry, but by that logic one can call Pakistan a country of 180 million terrorists.. Being religiously motivated does not make you a terrorist. What you do with that motivation does.. And there in lies the difference between India and Pakistan..

there is difference between religious motivation and being exterminator....
well religiously perfect Muslim is also prefered by non Muslims to live with....
these intruders have nothing to do with Islam....
even you would be praising them if these were true Muslim rather than calling them terrorist...
and a human can be muslim...
and how can these be human??
you suppose these people have humanity??
Islam teaches humanity and respect from heart.....

 

[Joe Shearer]

thats right
and hats off to you and people like Krait
you guys kept your comments graceful unlike some people of course who wanted to troll and chest thump it

even in the worse of tensions, such crossings are not unheard of but this proved fatal for that guy because of our recent border fights. the locals claim to have seen that guy being questioned by the Indians who halted him. there is an agreed standard operating procedure where soldiers of both countries are told what to do when challenged after crossing the border by mistake.
mostly there is some intense questioning and a local flag staff meeting where the problem is resolved in a day or so

we already had our two soldiers snipped after the alleged beheading of Indian soldier so both forces knew that everyone was alert and looking out for any opportunity so any misadventure was out of question(which is being suggested by chest thumpers).

any way rest in peace is all i can say and at least Indians had the decency to return the body unlike that of an unknown Pakistani soldier whose' skull was shown to Berkha Dutt (confessions of a war reporter) .

I hope that Pakistanis dont decide to avenge this unfortunate death and for the sake of peace give Indians the benefit of doubt although unfortunately they are claiming a gunfight and our patriotism will dictate which version to accept.

Indian Helicopters have strayed into Pakistan not just the soldiers hopefully the people who are celebrating and trolling will keep that in mind that such incursions can end in tragedies as well. Hopefully captured Indians would be allowed back once their innocence is confirmed like in the previous such cases.



there is an agreed protocol and SOP in place between the two sides. the person who has strayed the wrong side is to halt and identify himself when there is no chance that he can cross back safely of course.


more on this news

Indian troops killed soldier after questioning: Pakistan Army | Pakistan | DAWN.COM

I agree with your eminently sensible and dignified, civilised post, but wish to point out that various versions are going around. The Indian Army has reported that there was an exchange of fire, that an apparent intruder was killed, and that he was found to be a Pakistan Army jawan. You are aware, of course, that the protocol regarding accidental crossings by soldiers of either side does not apply to militants infiltrating into Indian territory. In this case, if the man was not identified as a soldier, and if he opened fire, he might well have been shot as an infiltrator and the mistake discovered, presumably when the body was searched. If the Indian soldiers had been up to no good, it would be the easiest thing in the world to hand over the body to the local police force for burial as an unidentified, armed intruder. Ironically, most of the unidentified bodies that are said to have been discovered are burials of this sort. The fact that the body was returned seems to indicate an exchange of fire, and a genuine doubt about the identity of the person detected.

 

[livingdead]

there is difference between religious motivation and being exterminator....
well religiously perfect Muslim is also prefered by non Muslims to live with....
these intruders have nothing to do with Islam....
even you would be praising them if these were true Muslim rather than calling them terrorist...
and a human can be muslim...
and how can these be human??
you suppose these people have humanity??
Islam teaches humanity and respect from heart.....

there is not single definition of religiously perfect muslim, people like good human being, not good muslim.
BTW among Indian muslims I met, aurangzeb is considered closer to ideal muslim than akbar.

 

[Joe Shearer]

Aur karo aman ka tamasha.

Indians interrogated him and then killed him.

Even pics of the soldiers body were flashed on TV...albeit in black and white.

We can go on trading contradictory accounts of what happened until the cows come home. May I know how that will help?

 

[Joe Shearer]

Ab indians ye karay gy humaray sath after we returned their helicopter and those fookin indians were given tea and snaks!


Back Stabbing Ba.....



how come an astray soldier can injure 2 hindu soldiers until he feels threatned?

What do you mean "Hindu" soldiers? Have you completely lost your balance?

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

Ok, you can take the so called 'secularism' up somewhere. That doesn't hide the fact. Just because you have a few 'muslims' or 'christians' in senior roles, doesn't show that the country is secular in nature. The political and media b.s. should be left aside. We are talking about humans here.

At least India has a secular constitution, govt, and free and impartial judiciary compared to Muslim dominated countries, so system wise that's a better condition to live with.

1) The Indian police and army watched the destruction of mosques and churches. I've posted a LOT on these issues. Go read my previous posts or read below.

There incidents are sad incidents which happened decades back life is normal in those places now, legal process are going on in this matters and many has been punished.

2) The Christians and Muslim killings are a norm. Get with the program. You can't hide or justify killings of others and avoid the blame. Everyone's shi*t stinks and yours too

Yes sure killings are not a a solution or justifiable but often it's is in reaction to one or other violent incident, we should avoid there kinds of incident but in a country as diverse as India, where people are not educated, very low ratio of police and courts compared to population, it's not easy task.

3) The POPE had to call the Indian prime minister asking him to immediately act on weeks of violence against Christians last year. As no military or state perconnel were trying to control the riots.

which riot ?

4) You guys killed hundreds of Sikhs inside your own India. Your army published a memo in 2000 telling everyone that the people with turbans (the Sikhs) were all terrorists or inclined to commit that, so keep an eye on them

Sikh killings were mob riots, cases are still there in courts I guess(unfortunately our legal system is too slow to deliver justice) .
show me where did army published memo saying " people with turban are all terrorists " other than warning potential terrorists/extremists, it turned true when our prime minister was shot down by one such terrorist, she was warned to avoid sikh personal from her personal security, but she ignored the warning.

5) I have a few good friends from India, mostly Christians, Sikhs and Muslims. I get this stuff first hand. So PLEASE, I may have never been to India or Pakistan.....but I know EXACTLY what you or someone living there would know.

if you have friends who live in India, then we also live in Indian, and we know what is what in country better than your "hear say account ". and I advice you to come and experience India before making anymore claims.

6) Kashmir.....killings, rapes, murders, extra judicial killing by the mighty Indian Army......may I keep going?

sure everything happens in Kashmir just like any other country..army is mainly on border areas to kill the terrorists who sneak in, and is called up for help only when state police can't handle the situation.

Here, see, read and listen for your own sanity's sake. It doesn't hurt to admit you guys also have a terrorist problem and there are hindu fractions involved. The world knows it, you and I know it and it's the truth. India isn't exactly the 'heaven' on the planet earth as you guys claim it to be. Being patriot is one thing, being stupid and blind patriot.....is being amateur.

don't put words in our mouth, nobody is claims India is a paradise, but it surely is not a hell, which you are trying to portray. we have a secular democratic govt and impartial judiciary and independent media, it's a country which still holds together despite of it's cultural, linguistic, ethnic and religious diversity, British expected us to riot and break down in few years, but still we are here, and getting stronger and Progressive day by day. there will be small small occasional riots and counter responses but that trend also decreased drastically.
[Sky] India's Christians Persecuted 2008.10.19 - YouTube

Christians Killed in India - YouTube

The reality for Christians in India - YouTube

Brutal Torture and Bloodshed- The Reality of India.flv - YouTube

Hindus killing muslims and christiuans in india - YouTube

Cruel Indian Army Killing Muslims Islam Kashmir - YouTube[/QUOTE]

 

[notorious_eagle]

Please learn to read carefully. I'm not referring to your martial race army, I'm referring to the posters here who almost all of them for a second do not believe the PA official stand that PA did not kill the two Indian soldiers a few days back. but now they believe the PA story fully because its convenient for ''whatever psychological condition explains that''. Thats moot, apparently.

Just look at yourself, trying to be constructive and raising straws by referring to PA as 'Martial Race Army'. Someone of your stature with 6000 posts should be constructive instead of resorting to trolling. Turning your argument around, the IA denied that a platoon of their soldiers crossed over, attacked a PA check post and killed 1 PA soldier while the PA maintained throughout that IA attacked their check post. I would be very content with accepting PA's account because ghosts cannot attack a PA check post dressed in IA uniform.

As to your abusive language, well it reflects badly on the forum and yourself too. Yesterday a mod was using abusive language. No skin off my back. Haven't seen anyone lose their cool on the other busy thread though, the quetta one.

Again, resorting to trolling by raising the Quetta Suicide bombings. These two are separate incidents and have nothing in common between them. Stop raising straws just to support your twisted logic. You are right, i should not have used abusive language but when a member of over 6000 posts starts trolling, it really gets to you. There is no victimhood complex on our side as you claim, enough with these 'make yourself feel good posts'.

 

[notsuperstitious]

@notorious_eagle, so you think PA did not kill two Indian soldiers a few days back? A yes or no would be appreciated.

Let me tell you however all other Pakistani posters do NOT believe that claim by PA.

BTW the Quetta thread reference was to make a point that you guys are irrational and angry when it comes to Indians. There are many posts here abusing Indians, one even by a mod and yes I do feel like replying to those.

 

[notorious_eagle]

@notorious_eagle, so you think PA did not kill two Indian soldiers a few days back? A yes or no would be appreciated.

Let me tell you however all other Pakistani posters do NOT believe that claim by PA.

First answer this. Did the IA attack a PA check post or not which initiated this entire mess? Your Army has denied it but your journalists seem to think so that IA attacked that PA check post, in fact 'The Hindu' broke the story why these small skirmishes took place. You can't have the cake and eat it too. People who live in glass houses don't throw stone at others.

BTW the Quetta thread reference was to make a point that you guys are irrational and angry when it comes to Indians. There are many posts here abusing Indians, one even by a mod and yes I do feel like replying to those.

That i cannot disagree with but these are two separate incidents. Lets stop pretending to be angels here, i didn't see you condemn those posts which i moderated where Indian members were celebrating the death of the PA Jawan.

 

[Bratva]

I agree with your eminently sensible and dignified, civilised post, but wish to point out that various versions are going around. The Indian Army has reported that there was an exchange of fire, that an apparent intruder was killed, and that he was found to be a Pakistan Army jawan. You are aware, of course, that the protocol regarding accidental crossings by soldiers of either side does not apply to militants infiltrating into Indian territory. In this case, if the man was not identified as a soldier, and if he opened fire, he might well have been shot as an infiltrator and the mistake discovered, presumably when the body was searched. If the Indian soldiers had been up to no good, it would be the easiest thing in the world to hand over the body to the local police force for burial as an unidentified, armed intruder. Ironically, most of the unidentified bodies that are said to have been discovered are burials of this sort. The fact that the body was returned seems to indicate an exchange of fire, and a genuine doubt about the identity of the person detected.

All media reports indicate, the soldier was challenged, which means he was spotted, and whoever spotted him had a good look of him because he saw a person with a gun in his hand. We all agreed here, Forward observation post soldiers are in full Army dresses. So your assumptions are way off the mark.

Now the real assumptions is didn't Indian Army tells the SOP's of accidental crossing to all Indian forward observation posts? If yes than Why when IA spotted a Pakistani Army soldier, instead of shouting or telling him through a loud speaker, he was challenged which means he was threatened with a Gun?

 

[Windjammer]

May sound a bit off-topic, but those questioning the morality of PA, this image alone suffices to bust the credibility of Indian security set up, it proves that what Indian agencies or security forces claim is not always the gospel truth and should force any self respecting citizen to pause and introspect rather than the habitual chest thumping but then again the catch word is....self respecting. !!

 

[notsuperstitious]

May sound a bit off-topic, but those questioning the morality of PA, this image alone suffices to bust the credibility of Indian security set up, it proves that what Indian agencies or security forces claim is not always the gospel truth and should force any self respecting citizen to pause and introspect rather than the habitual chest thumping but then again the catch word is....self respecting. !!

Pathetic effort for you yet again. This was wrong intel and Indian security forces accepted it fully. There is a vast difference between lies and mistakes. Accepting mistakes increases credibility, does not diminish it.

Lying would be Kargil, that was no mistake but a deliberate BIG lie.

First answer this. Did the IA attack a PA check post or not which initiated this entire mess? Your Army has denied it but your journalists seem to think so that IA attacked that PA check post, in fact 'The Hindu' broke the story why these small skirmishes took place. You can't have the cake and eat it too. People who live in glass houses don't throw stone at others.

I'm being consistent here and fully believe the IA story. IA has said the 6th Jan death of a Pakistani soldier was in a firefight but no border was crossed. Its you guys who are being selective.

 

[Windjammer]

Pathetic effort for you yet again. This was wrong intel and Indian security forces accepted it fully. There is a vast difference between lies and mistakes. Accepting mistakes increases credibility, does not diminish it.

Lying would be Kargil, that was no mistake but a deliberate BIG lie.

After the trio turned up to prove their innocence and expose the hyped up Indian staged acts and lies, did the Indian authorities had any other choice except to bite the bullet..... not to mention the ten most wanted list....what to say of once bitten twice shy. And off course you would be inclined to believe all the nonsense spewed by your frivolous media since they just happened to be present behind every rock, boulder and glacier to film and witness the Kargil chapter. Pathetic. !!

 

[Gentelman]

self delete...