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Two Nation Theory

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VisionHawk

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Dear All
Salam


We all know the basis for Pakistan was 'Two Nations theory'. Which simply means that Muslims are a nation by any

definition with their own beliefs, culture and history and thus must have their own homeland.

58 years later look at the condition of Pakistan. It is pitiful.

· Violence
· Backwardness
· Lack of knowledge about our own values
· Blind following
· Despair
· Lack of leadership and grass root social organizations
· Rule of vultures


This is enough to depress any Pakistani.

Is the the Two Nations theory practically dead?
 
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Originally posted by VisionHawk@Mar 5 2006, 03:30 PM
Dear All
Salam
We all know the basis for Pakistan was 'Two Nations theory'. Which simply means that Muslims are a nation by any

definition with their own beliefs, culture and history and thus must have their own homeland.

58 years later look at the condition of Pakistan. It is pitiful.

· Violence
· Backwardness
· Lack of knowledge about our own values
· Blind following
· Despair
· Lack of leadership and grass root social organizations
· Rule of vultures
This is enough to depress any Pakistani.

Is the the Two Nations theory practically dead?
[post=6668]Quoted post[/post]​

Well the one nation theory by your definition is also dead because if "Pakistan" is pathetic, so is India. Even if Pakistan had been part of India, what guarantee that things would have been any better.
 
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How does 'two nation' theory relate to the internal problems that Pakistan faces today? I fail to see the linkage here. India has its own set of problems. Two-nation theory is NOT dead and CANNOT be dead since Pakistan exists and functions like any other country.

The internal problems are something all countries face. It is up to the citizens of the state to raise their voice against the practices that you've pointed out. A 'people's revolution' is required. Pakistanis should bear in mind, 'people should not be afraid of their governments; governments should be afraid of their people'.
 
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I don't see any way the theory and pakistan of today has to do with one another either. Right now, we should'nt even be thinking about this thoery. Right now all every bit of pakistanis should be foused of devloping pakistan. Once we are devloped then we will be ale to represent the ummah proudly. Most of us think that islam is lost in pakistan, but that's not the case. Even now pakistanis know that pakistan was founded to lead the ummah, we are aware of this. Just becasue some of the pakistanis don't follow islam you can't judge the whole nation by those peoples deeds.

Yes we will raise and lead the ummah, but right now we need to lead our self first and devlop. :flag:

[Mod Edit: Please do NOT turn this into a religious thread. You can give your sermons elsewhere. We are talking politics over here. First and Last warning!]
 
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the 2 nation theory is alive and kicking today because bangladesh became a seprate country and did not join with bharat because it is hindu fundmentalist. muslims and hindus are 2 diffrent peoples
for example:
1. muslims worship one god / hindus worship many. some with nine arms and legs as well as monkeys and snakes cows

2. muslims eat cows /hindus worship them and some even drink their pee

4 muslims burry there dead people/ hindus burns them

5.muslims are from the same line of religion as christans and jews / hindus follow paganism

6. muslims believe all man are equal/ hindus believe in a racist caste systems

7.muslims bath pray 5 times a day and keep clean/ hindus are unhygenic, bath in river ganga with is dirtier than a gutter and is human soup because i saw it on national geogriphic channel

so muslims and hindus can never be one nation because the muslims who got remained back in bharat are tortured and discrimanted against everyday by hindus like in gujrat and other states.
 
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I agree that muslims and hindus are different.
 
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A.Rahman said:
I agree that muslims and hindus are different.

yes 100% agreed and here is an example of what i mean to say earlier . this is a incident happens in the indian town of lucknow yesterday.


Four killed in Hindu-Muslim clashes

LUCKNOW (AFP) - Four people were killed and 18 injured in clashes between Hindus and Muslims in the mainly Muslim northern Indian town of Aligarh, a senior official said Thursday.
Trouble began when a group of Hindus found part of a wall surrounding a temple damaged late Wednesday, R.M. Shrivastava, home secretary of Uttar Pradesh state, told reporters in the state capital Lucknow.
Hindus and Muslims first shouted at each other but that escalated to stone throwing and gunfire, Shrivastava said.
“Two people were killed on the spot while two others died later in hospital,” he said, adding all the dead were Muslims.
Five of the injured were being treated for gunshot wounds and were in critical condition, Shrivastava said.A curfew has been imposed in parts of the town where tensions were still running high following Wednesday’s incidents, he added.The city of Ayodhya in Uttar Pradesh was the site of the demolition of a 16th century mosque by Hindu zealots in 1992 that sparked sectarian riots across India and claimed more than 2,000 lives.
 
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I feel sorry for muslims in India, May Allah help them and protect them from the opression of extremist Hindus.
 
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A.Rahman said:
I feel sorry for muslims in India, May Allah help them and protect them from the opression of extremist Hindus.
You may or may not have been to India, but this journalist from Dailytimes writes...
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/defaul..._6-4-2006_pg3_4
Thursday, April 06, 2006 E-Mail this article to a friend Printer Friendly Version
HERE & THERE: India — tradition and progress —Razi Azmi

Throughout India, juxtaposed with tradition, superstition, religiosity, poverty and squalor, there is progress, modernity, prosperity and tolerance. Many Hindus are deeply religious, but they pursue their varying creeds in individual and personal ways, as opposed to the dogmatic, congregational and collective rituals of Muslims. There is a deity here and an idol there, and a bow or a nod to the god

Any visitor to India is surprised by the legions of cows that hang around the streets. As soon as they cease to be productive, cows and bulls are abandoned by their owners to fend for themselves. They are too costly to be fed and too holy (gau-mata or mother-cow) to be converted into food.

The street, then, becomes their home. Surviving on garbage and evidently malnourished, they are susceptible to diseases and often have open sores, from illnesses as well as collisions with all kinds of vehicles. The roads are littered with cow dung and their urine flows freely. The wheels of passing vehicles spread them over the road like butter and jam over toast.

Throughout India, juxtaposed with tradition, superstition, religiosity, poverty and squalor, there is progress, modernity, prosperity and tolerance.

Many Hindus are deeply religious, but they pursue their varying creeds in individual and personal ways, as opposed to the dogmatic, congregational and collective rituals of Muslims. There is a deity here and an idol there, and a bow or a nod to the god (or goddess) of this or that, even from a distance, suffices for most Hindus most of the time.

Many temples, mosques and shrines have become commercial enterprises for those who have the good fortune or the muscle power to control them. Kolkata’s most important temple, Kalighat, is no exception.

My Western travel guide had warned: “Avaricious priests will try to whisk you downstairs to confront the dramatic monolithic image of the terrible goddess in the basement, with her huge eyes and bloody tongue”. As expected, a priest advised me that offering a coconut, one kilo of sweets, some flowers and Rs 521 in cash would achieve all my wishes.

As I approached the Kalighat temple, I saw destitutes begging for alms and prostitutes “linger[ing] on the thoroughfares and bridges offering their services in tragic, grimy circumstances”. I overheard one prostitute tartly tell her prospective customer, who was obviously a hard bargainer: “Thank god, I have not yet been reduced to begging”.

At the Ajmer shrine of renowned Muslim saint Khwaja Muinuddin Chishti, khadims are likewise wont to milk pilgrims. Here, too, I had been forewarned by my guidebook: “Entering the dargah, you’re likely to be stopped by stern-looking young men claiming they are ‘official guides’. In fact, they are khadims, hereditary priests operating in much the same way as Hindu pujaris, leading pilgrims through rituals in the sacred precinct in exchange for donations”. Generous donations and offerings were supposed to materialise all my wishes.

There is a large board at the entrance to the shrine promoting the khadims in these unabashedly self-serving words: “Khadims relations with mazar-e-aqdas (holy shrine) is not only ancient but also intimate... [They] have right to receive nazr-o-niyaz (offerings) of Huzoor Syedna Khwaja Gharib Nawaz (RA).”

India’s Muslim population is highly conspicuous. Mosques, old and new, are everywhere — north, south, east and west. In most Indian cities, towns and villages the muezzin’s call to prayer (azaan) is broadcast from loudspeakers mounted on minarets of mosques. An hour’s drive from Benaras, I saw the massive new building of a madrassa, comparable in size with the largest in Pakistan.

One of Delhi’s main railway stations is named Hazrat Nizamuddin, after the well-known saint whose shrine is nearby. Akbar road is one of the main thoroughfares of New Delhi. Other roads are named after Babar, Feroz Shah, Sher Shah, Shahjahan, Tughlak, Lodi, Bahadur Shah Zafar, even Aurangzeb, the Mughal emperor best known for his intolerance of Hinduism.

On the road north and east from Benaras one passes Muhammadabad, Fatehabad, etc. Among other district and town names in India are: Ghaziabad, Ghazipur and Fatehpur, Aurangabad, Ahmadnagar and Ahmadabad, not to mention Aligarh and Allahabad.

Railway stations in Uttar Pradesh and Bihar have their names written in Urdu, besides English and Hindi, as are all street names in Delhi. Even Benaras Hindu University has a thriving Arabic, not to mention Urdu, department.

There are extremist Hindus just as there are fanatical Muslims. But one is struck by the tolerance of the vast majority of Hindus towards Muslims and their religious places and practices. Many Hindus are known to patronise Muslim shrines, such as Khwaja Muinuddin Chishti’s in Ajmer, Hazrat Nizamuddin’s in Delhi, Shaikh Salim Chishti’s near Agra and Baba Haji Ali’s in Mumbai.

The Muslims of north India went through a very traumatic experience on account of partition in 1947, with towns and villages depopulated and families split. There was hardly a Muslim family in UP and Bihar which had not lost one or more of its members owing to migration to Pakistan. The emigration had devastating personal, social and political effects on those who remained in India by choice or circumstance.

With time, however, the trauma and scars of partition have healed. Indian Muslims now are self-contained with shrinking ties to their relatives across the border in Pakistan. As families and family ties within India have expanded, and the partition generation is ageing and dying, Indian Muslims are increasingly Indo-centric, viewing Pakistan as just another country whose policies, if anything, cause them more harm than good.

Though under-represented in the civil services, police and the armed forces, Muslims are doing well in business, trades, craft, cinema and sports. Indeed, some have done exceptionally well. India’s richest man, Wipro Ltd Chairman Azim Premji, is a Muslim. Worth over $8 billion, he was ranked No 38 on Forbes magazine’s list of the world’s richest people last year.

In at least one temple and at the back of countless trucks I saw, written in Hindi, “hum sub ka maalik ek” (we all belong to the same Creator). But, regardless of what some truckers and priests might declare and the state might decree, old habits and social stratifications die hard.

The quota system enforced by the government is heavily tilted in favour of the lower castes and dalits (untouchables), but life in many Indian villages and towns is still influenced by the caste system to a certain degree. It is worth mentioning that India’s last president, KR Narayanan, was a dalit.

But India is certainly changing, although BJP’s election slogan of “India shining” may have been a gross exaggeration.

Bangalore and Hyderabad are second only to California’s Silicon Valley in Information Technology. If Bollywood competes with Hollywood, quantitatively at least, some Indian television channels are nearly as good as their Western counterparts in news coverage and investigative reporting. Similarly, Indian English newspapers are comparable to their Western counterparts in both form and content.

Public call offices with the facility of international direct dialling are to be found in every nook and corner of the country. The phones are fully computerised, providing a printout of the duration and cost of the call as soon as it is terminated.

India looks like an unfolding success story. Gone are the days of the 1960s when some Western economists could joke about a sluggish “Hindu rate of growth”, as distinct from capitalist and communist rates of growth.

The recent adoption of sound economic policies, supported by a thriving democratic dispensation, a powerful civil society, and a secular ethos, assure steady progress. I conclude this series with the words that I used at the outset: incredible India!
 
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Thursday, April 06, 2006 E-Mail this article to a friend Printer Friendly Version
HERE & THERE: India — tradition and progress —Razi Azmi

Throughout India, juxtaposed with tradition, superstition, religiosity, poverty and squalor, there is progress, modernity, prosperity and tolerance. Many Hindus are deeply religious, but they pursue their varying creeds in individual and personal ways, as opposed to the dogmatic, congregational and collective rituals of Muslims. There is a deity here and an idol there, and a bow or a nod to the god

Any visitor to India is surprised by the legions of cows that hang around the streets. As soon as they cease to be productive, cows and bulls are abandoned by their owners to fend for themselves. They are too costly to be fed and too holy (gau-mata or mother-cow) to be converted into food.

The street, then, becomes their home. Surviving on garbage and evidently malnourished, they are susceptible to diseases and often have open sores, from illnesses as well as collisions with all kinds of vehicles. The roads are littered with cow dung and their urine flows freely. The wheels of passing vehicles spread them over the road like butter and jam over toast.



------and you are proud of this?:laugh:
 
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Depends on what you want to see in the article....the tolerance shown to muslims by hindu majority or the part of the cow dung in the street, its up to you, but if one observes stray dogs they generally go sniffing towards the cow du......
 
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sword9 said:
Depends on what you want to see in the article....the tolerance shown to muslims by hindu majority or the part of the cow dung in the street, its up to you, but if one observes stray dogs they generally go sniffing towards the cow du......

i dunno but that all we see on national gepgraphic channel and other is indias drinking bull pee and then i also saw a rat temple and hindu people were drinking milk or something with rats turds floting in them and stuff and something bout cobras being their god and hindu peoples worshipign them and giving offerings but maybe thats their religon and let thm do it if they belive in it.
 
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Its better if we discuss facts than the crap in both countries. Comanche within your posts the only words i see are rats, hindu, drinking, worshipping, dung, god, which doesn't relate to the topic in anyway.

The two nation theory is aside than what you both are going towards to discuss.
 
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sword9 said:
You may or may not have been to India, but this journalist from Dailytimes writes...

Well i dont know abt comanche but i surely never been to India and thn too i had been recieving hate mails from Indian readers about my articles.
these mails are full of abusive language which show how much they hate us.
And at times i failed to understand that we do not hate them that much as they do.

When i get such emails from very senior and welknown peopel of India i feel realy dejected that despite passage of 50 years they are not willing to accept the two nation theory.
i think this is the time that you must accept that Pakistan is a reality and shez going to be out there on the world map forever.
 
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Jana said:
Well i dont know abt comanche but i surely never been to India and thn too i had been recieving hate mails from Indian readers about my articles.
these mails are full of abusive language which show how much they hate us.
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we are more than 1 Bn ,finding a hundred morons wont be difficult.

Jana said:
And at times i failed to understand that we do not hate them that much as they do..

u need two to tango..
 
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