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may i ask u to tell me the name of your clan :D i like to know more about people of azerbijan

I only know that my clan's name is "Mansırlı", but it's impossible to trace the eventual origin, it's most likely a late local name. I came across the mention of a clan by the name of "Haji Mansurlu" from Mughan in 1700s, and Mansurlu toponyms are also found in Mughan. It could stem from any Oghuz tribe.
 
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Crazy theory :) Interesting to read though

Who were the Trojans?
s.yusifov@zaman.az | January 25, 2014 | Caricature | No Comments
df16a97c810f964b6cf61b6a60ec87d4.jpgChingiz Garasharli, professor of the Azerbaijan University of Languages, answers this question in his newly published book “The Trojans were Turks”. His conclusion is based on four factors: 1. Information of Old European authors, who write about the Turkic origins of the Trojans. The Fredegar Chronicle of the 7th century, Gesta Francorum of the 12th century, Tyreli William of the 12th century, Andrea Dandalo of the 14th century and many others considered the Turks to have descended from the Turcos of the Trojan origin. Felik Fabri, a German author, referred the Turkic history of Troy to the older period – to the time of Teucros.

Giovanni Mario Filelfo informs in his work “Amyris” that Sultan Mehmed the 2nd presented his victory over Greeks as a triumph of justice. According to him, with the conquest of Istanbul the Turks revenged the Greeks who had once occupied it.

Sultan Mehmed, the Turkish sultan, who was well-informed about the Turkic origins of Troy, was right to consider the conquest of Istanbul as vengeance for Troy. Later in the 20th century Mustafa Kemal Ataturk considered his victory on foreign invaders as vengeance for Ektor, a Trojan hero, the son of the last Trojan king – Priam.

In fact these Turkish victories were not at all invasion, but liberation of old motherland and vengeance for Troy of which evidence the European sources of 7th-15th centuries.

After Troy was destroyed by the Greeks, its population migrated in different directions, among which two of them are of particular interest: those who migrated to Italy founded the Etruscan civilization and those who settled in the north of Europe were dealt with in old Germanic sagas as the Turkic kings of Sweden and Norway.

The second factor to prove the Turkic origins of the Trojans is the Etruscan writings that has been deciphered by Ch.Garasharli through Old Turkic languages. The Etruscans are known to have descended from the Trojans who had migrated to Italy after the collapse of Troy.

Some European researchers yet in the previous centuries having found Turkic words in the Etruscan language, considered it to be of Turkic origin. They could not however go further on into the texts, as their translation needed a deeper knowledge of Old Turkic languages which could serve as key to the Etruscan writings. It was done by Garasharli in his researches.

Garasharli is right to say that the old European sources had no reason to fabricate false stories about Troy. He presents numerous facts of the Old Turkic names of the Trojans that prove the information of the Old European authors. It is the third factor to prove the Turkic origins of the Trojans:

Priam, the name of the last Trojan king, is obviously the same Priyam, the name of a Turanian commander, described in an old Turkic (Kazakh) epic. It should be mentioned that the Kazakh anthroponomy is particularly distinguished among Turkic languages for containing evident early Mediterranean (Trojan, Pelasgian) names. Even the name of the Ionian (Pelasgian) folk singer and poet, Homer, turns out to have its counterpart in the Kazakh epic: Gumar, a mythological Turanian folk singer

Garasharli discovers in the anthoponomy of the Trojans a whole group of Turkic names, which have evident counterparts in the old Turkic, Kazakh, Kirghizian, Chuvash and other Turkic languages.

Dardan, an ancestor of Priam’s generation, is the same Kirghizian Dardan – a personal name. And the interpretation is reasonable:

Turkic Dardan stems from the Kirghizian appellative dardan, which forms the personal name meaning “healthy”, “enormous”, “clumsy”.

Alber, the name of a Trojan commander, is the same old Turkic Alper, denoting “hero”, “brave” (O.Turk. alp, alb, “hero”, “brave” – er “man”) which was widely used as a component of Old Turkic personal names, and in the name of Alper Tonga, a Turanian ruler.

Garasharli discovers this name in old Germanic sagas. “The saga about Nibelungs” tells us about the albs (”heroes”) and their king Alberikh – Trojan by origin, who were the leaders of the Trojans..

Askan, the name of a Trojan hero, is completely consonant with an Old Turkic personal name – Askan, used by the Huns. Today it is observed in the anthroponomy of the Turkic Altays. Ch.Garasharli derives its origin from the appellative askan (”violent”, “naughty”) used in Turkic languages.

Paris, the name of Priam’s son, is found to coincide with the Turkic (Khakas) Paris, a variant of the personal names Baris/Barys/Barysh/Bars, used in other Turkic languages. It is derived from the Turkic parys/pars/bars (”ounce”, “snow leopard”) and used as the symbol of strength in Turkic anthroponomy. It is also observed in such compound personal names as Barsbeg, Barskan, Barısbek (Kazakh), Barisbi (Karachay – Balkar), etc.

The onomastic analogies found by the author are more and more. He finds that Aytilla, Priam’s sister, to be the same as the Kirghizian Aytilla, a male name.

Batiya, a female personal name, referred to the daughter of Teucros, the first king of Troy, is the same Batiya used in the Kazakh anthroponomy as female name.

Thus, the author finds the names of both Priam and his generation in Turkic anthroponomy.

Garasharli finds out analogies between Turkic-Trojan gods. For instance, Bayana, Athorodita’s epithet in Troy. In Greek mythology Athorodita was known as the goddess of marriage, birth and nursing”. The same function belonged to the Turkic Goddess, Bayana, which has obvious Turkic roots. Composed of the Turkic bay (”protectress”, “great”, “sacred”) and ana (”mother”), the theonym denotes “the protectress of the tribe”, “the great mother of the tribe”.

Finally, the fourth factor is the Old Turkic (Trojan) lexicon borrowed into the Scandinavian languages from the Trojan language, brought here by the Trojans after the collapse of Troy.

The existance of Turkic Trojans in Scandinavia was dealt by prof. Sven Lagerbring (1707-1787) in his book “The Turkic fathers of the Scandinavians”. In his book he demonstrates a lot of Turkic words used in the Swedish language with the same meaning as in Turkic.

Prof. Garasharli’s personal researches gives the same result. He has discovered a number of Turkic words in Scandinavin and Celtic languages which are harmonious with the information of the old Scandinavian sagas about the Turkic kings of Sweden and Norway.

Researches of Garasharli illucidates the dark ages of Scandinavian history which was connected with the Trojans, the old settlers of this land after the collapse of Troy. These historical events as well as the Turkic origins of the Mediterranean civilization is dealt in the book “The Turkic Civilization Lost in the Mediterranean Basin”.

His book: The Turkic Civilization lost in the Mediterranean basin - BOOK
 
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I only know that my clan's name is "Mansırlı", but it's impossible to trace the eventual origin, it's most likely a late local name. I came across the mention of a clan by the name of "Haji Mansurlu" in Mughan in 1700s, and Mansurlu toponyms are also found in Mughan, so that may be the ultimate origin, who knows. It could be any Turkic tribe to have settled there.
yea ofc people of azerbijan are made of all 24 tribe that what i like about azerbijan

do u have tribe / clan name tekke ?
 
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The Id Kah mosque from East-Turkistan. Chinese soldiers prevent Turk's from attending Friday Prayers.

43ed134c5591d471e0a6e9113f49e621.jpg


Chinese-Dragon, what is the reason behind this nonsense?
 
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I'm sure Salurs must have been present, but I don't think any tribe/clan could trace its origin to Salurs.
sry for late replay i was reading something , i was hoping to start a discussion wiht Targon about salur and origin of my tribe yomut is it ok for to start it with u ?
 
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Most of modern Turkmen tribes were formed in later period, so I don't know if it's possible to determine their older origins. But in terms of the history of Yomut tribe (and its origins etc.), I think you should know much more. For example in 1700s they were at war with Kypchak Kongurat tribe over the control of Khiva. I don't know about their older history, or eventual origins.
 
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@asena_great

As far as I know "Salur" is not recorded as a tribe in Anatolia, may be their branches who came to Anatolia changed their names which was usual, original organization of Oghuz was broken and divided into newly formed tribes. Although there are more then 10 villages carrying the name "Salur" , 3 of them in Antalya, this might be showing that early settlers know about which original Oghuz tribe they belonged to.

Edit: Looks like that Takkalu qizilbash tribe is indeed coming from Teke region in Anatolia.
 
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@Targon @ASQ-1918 @rmi5 @telkon


i for long time wanted to understand the how we turkmens get here and and realized every tribe has it's own movment so i focused on my tribe which lead me to salurs this is my theory

Salghurids - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

this was our original tribe's atabeg before mongol invasion

today there is no turkmen there and only turkic people are qashqai which i dont know a thing about them

just like @ASQ-1918 clan mansurli our tribe/clans are the name of some individual person i read it in online book in internet yomut was a person whom was the great gandson of ogurjik the grandson of oghuz

"yomut, said to have been the great-grandson of oguz's grandson ogurjik"
Tribal Nation: The Making of Soviet Turkmenistan - Adrienne Lynn Edgar - Google Books


i can say the same thing for tekke i search for a person in salgur tribe with name tekke and i guess i found that guy

Salghurids - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"
  • Sunqur b. Mawdud (1148–1161)
  • Zangi b. Mawdud (1161–1178)
  • Degele/Tekele b. Zangi (1178–1198)
  • Sa'd I b. Zangi (1198–1226)
  • Qutlugh Khan Abu Bakr b. Sa'd I (1226–1260)
  • Sa'd II b. Qutlugh Khan (1260–1262)
  • Muhammad Shah b. Salghur Shah b. Sa'd I (1262–1263)
  • Seljuq Shah b. Salghur Shah (1263)
  • Abish Khatun b. Sa'd II (1263)
  • Abish Khatun w/ Mengu Temur b. Hulegu (1264–1282)


druing seljuk's civil war atabeg of salghurids where at war with three different atabeg at same time atabeg of zangi ( the mosul one whom ruled by brother of sultan nur addin ) atabeg of yazd-kerman and atabeg of azerbijan (The Ildegizids,[1] Eldiguzids ) from what i know salghurids destroyed eldiguzids and send two of their turkmen brench to rule their land the ak and Kara Koyunlu but this weakend them and they start their down fall thei accept the rule of every one like khwarazm and later golden hord - ilkhanate when their extend ilkhanate rule their atabeg directly from this momet they disappeared

now this is my theory

some salgurs rebelled against the rule of mongols and some of them they fleed to turkey i see @Targon's tradition cloth they are similars to qashqai people some remain in the atabeg like qashqai people and some exiled to modern day turkmenistan as monglos are famous to exailed importend people to mongolia they may try it with salgur as we know there is small salar in china and turkmens of turkmenistan also are salgur , so i say some fleed the monglos in turkmenistan and in the end monglos settled remining salgurs in china

in later age shah ismail the azerbijani turk raised to power , he was (if im not mistakeing ) from ak Koyunlu tribe which was branch of salgurs his campaign is very interesting after mongols some salgur tribes whom left in east and south of iran live in bad condition for example as once @Targon told me from his book yomut was live n bad condition attacked by all of it neighbour ( idk if it was same for qashqai ) when shah ismail come to east yomut allied them self with safavi and over thrown another turkmen tirbe call oklu whom lived in astarabad (gorgan ) (like a tyrant they Ruthlessly rule over yomut taking big tax making a lot of bad thing to yomut ) after victory yomut absorb their people inside their own , by safavi policy turkmens settiled like belt to defend safavis from any attack from central asia as u see we live from casian sea to merv

i'm tracing salgur movement

@Targon i need to know when those salgur turkmens or tekkelu arrived to antalya does they come after mongol invasion ?

all of u are welcome to discuessed this theory bring more evidence or proof me im wrong
 
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Btw looking through some Ottoman tax records, here are some Turkic names from 16th century Yörüks, these are just random names I came across quickly, looks like even in Ottoman period, Turkic names didn't died out for centuries.

Tirkemish
Güvendik
Bektimur
Turbek
Tursun
Turhan
Turgut
Temir/Temur
Kara Yülük
Sungur
Yahşi
Balaban
Sevindik
Aydın
Karaca

@asena_great

God knows how many pieces original Oghuz tribes divided into, Salghurid rulers might from Salur tribe but that doesn't means all of the Salur tribe was there. In tax records we see that nomads from vast different origins, some were carrying names of different Oghuz tribes, some were newcomers from different parts of Anatolia.

On your theory, its not impossible, the name Teke in Anatolia might be coming from a prominent tribe settled in the region, and since there are at least 3 villages named Salur in Antalya alone, they might be originally from Salur, since there are no historical records we can't know if your Teke tribe and that Teke tribe is of same origin.

Edit: in the tax record of 1455, in the teke region tribes carrying the names of Oghuz tribes is Karkın, Bayındır, İğdir and Çavdur.

Another thing got my attention is there is a tribe called "Kımızcılar", may be for a while Kımız is consumed in Anatolia ? :D
 
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Edit: in the tax record of 1455, in the teke region tribes carrying the names of Oghuz tribes is Karkın, Bayındır, İğdir and Çavdur
except for karakin we have the rest of those time in my provence we have , İğdir village and surname they are here considerd as sub clan of yomut


we have them too karaca also is a surname taken from karaca clan
 
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