Turkey marks Commemoration of Atatürk, Youth and Sports Day

[T-123456]

Actually the seeds of secularism was already set in Ottoman Empire throught the ''Tanzimat'' reforms, it was a stage of ''Europeanisation'' the Sultans abandoned the old palace and their harem with it, the new buildings had European look, education was being reformed and even decriminalized homosexuality etc.

And why didnt it work?

 

[xenon54 out]

And why didnt it work?

Well in the very end it did but not in the way the Empire was intending, it gave birth to Young Ottomans which eventually continued with Young Turks, the rest is history.

 

[Zulkarneyn]

Did you know that he helped the Young Turks,in secret?

I actually haven't heard that he helped them in secret. But when you think about the "revolution" of July 1908, it's interesting that Abdulhamid gave in to Ittihat's demands. Of course their revolution was an ongoing and interesting process in itself, uprisings in Trakya and sending numerous telegraphs so that he would give in. And he gave in, interestingly enough, the Young Turks chose to let Abdulhamid's closest men remain on power because the provinces had to obey the central rule in Istanbul, and you couldn't do that by completely reinstating all governmental institutions with young officers, however well intended.

The Young Turks in itself is a result of the Tanzimat era brother. Things didn't happen overnight, if we didn't have the Tanzimat era, we wouldn't be able to produce such excellent minds.

 

[T-123456]

I actually haven't heard that he helped them in secret. But when you think about the "revolution" of July 1908, it's interesting that Abdulhamid gave in to Ittihat's demands. Of course their revolution was an ongoing and interesting process in itself, uprisings in Trakya and sending numerous telegraphs so that he would give in. And he gave in, interestingly enough, the Young Turks chose to let Abdulhamid's closest men remain on power because the provinces had to obey the central rule in Istanbul, and you couldn't do that by completely reinstating all governmental institutions with young officers, however well intended.

The Young Turks in itself is a result of the Tanzimat era brother. Things didn't happen overnight, if we didn't have the Tanzimat era, we wouldn't be able to produce such excellent minds.

It was a big mistake to bring the Tanzimat,especially when the Empire was ''weakening'' in power and finance caused by earlier sultans.
The Tanzimat caused stronger nationalistic sentiments throughout the Empire,it was easier for the Europeans to ''infiltrate'' and form resistence ''cells'' in at first the Balkans,then the rest of the Empire.
After the Crimean war,it was already over,the term ''Sick man of Europe'' had become a reality and there was no way out.
To make it short,the Tanzimat accelerated the demise of the Empire.
Reforms should have been made but not to much to sudden and never under pressure(by old Europe).

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

You can't criticise tayip in this country, hell if we can't criticise him then Atatürk should never be criticised. At the end on the day tayip can't be Atatürk finger nail.

For returning to Islam, Reis Erdogan is like Sultan Mehumt II, who started the secularization process with Tazminat. Like the physical world, events in history follow a cyclic order...

Reis Erdogan has repeatedly won democratic elections since 1994. How many Mustafa Kemal won?

 

[xenon54 out]

For returning to Islam, Reis Erdogan is like Sultan Mehumt II, who started the secularization process with Tazminat. Like the physical world, events in history follow a cyclic order...

Reis Erdogan has repeatedly won democratic elections since 1994. How many Mustafa Kemal won?

And again the democracy card, people like you think that democracy is only about voting, let me tell you something, if you are today able to vote for your favourite party as a citizen of this country then its only thanks to Atatürk.

 

[Zulkarneyn]

It was a big mistake to bring the Tanzimat,especially when the Empire was ''weakening'' in power and finance caused by earlier sultans.
The Tanzimat caused stronger nationalistic sentiments throughout the Empire,it was easier for the Europeans to ''infiltrate'' and form resistence ''cells'' in at first the Balkans,then the rest of the Empire.
After the Crimean war,it was already over,the term ''Sick man of Europe'' had become a reality and there was no way out.
To make it short,the Tanzimat accelerated the demise of the Empire.
Reforms should have been made but not to much to sudden and never under pressure(by old Europe).

The Empire had already crumbled, long before the introduction of Tanzimat. The Tanzimat reforms, in the least, opened the empire to Europe so that we could follow up on the lost centuries of development. Naturally it was an abrupt process, once its introduction, as you say the Empire wasn't ready. The literacy rate were in single digits in Anatolia and so on.

I don't see any other alternatives to Tanzimat and Young Turk movement. Yes disasters happened and the empire was burdened with questions of legitimacy and minority national uprisings. I don't think these were due to Tanzimat reforms, but it was the age of nation-states, and our provinces in Europe would sooner or later opt for independence and fiercely fight for it. Tanzimat reforms were introduced because our Sultans realized we had absolutely no chance against our nemesis Russia

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Ankara valiliği ve Erdoğan hain tayfası 19 Mayıs yürüyüşünü engellemiş. Bundan sonra ne olacak? Bayrağı felan değiştirmeye kalkarlar herhalde.

Cok buyuk seyler geliyor..

I actually haven't heard that he helped them in secret. But when you think about the "revolution" of July 1908, it's interesting that Abdulhamid gave in to Ittihat's demands. Of course their revolution was an ongoing and interesting process in itself, uprisings in Trakya and sending numerous telegraphs so that he would give in. And he gave in, interestingly enough, the Young Turks chose to let Abdulhamid's closest men remain on power because the provinces had to obey the central rule in Istanbul, and you couldn't do that by completely reinstating all governmental institutions with young officers, however well intended.

The Young Turks in itself is a result of the Tanzimat era brother. Things didn't happen overnight, if we didn't have the Tanzimat era, we wouldn't be able to produce such excellent minds.

Like everything else the Ottoman Empire had to end too. The Sultan foresaw it, so he tried to avoid the blood shed. As a great Ustad of that time put it,"The Ottoman Empire is pregnant with a European State, so it'll give birth to one"...

 

[-SINAN-]

Like everything else the Ottoman Empire had to end too. The Sultan foresaw it, so he tried to avoid the blood shed. As a great Ustad of that time put it,"The Ottoman Empire is pregnant with a European State, so it'll give birth to one"...

Sultan was a traitor to the Turkish nation...

He signed below and agreed to our homeland to be given to foreigners.

I don't know how people still can defend last Ottoman Sultans....wake up, they were traitors......

I guess this happens when you don't have a proper education but learned history from lunatics like Kadir Mısırlı.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Sultan was a traitor to the Turkish nation...

He signed below and agreed to our homeland to be given to foreigners.

I don't know how people still can defend last Ottoman Sultans....wake up, they were traitors......

I guess this happens when you don't have a proper education but learned history from lunatics like Kadir Mısırlı.

After Treaty of Loussane, Lord Curzon," We have kept Turkey physically intact, but killed from inside. She will never regain her former might". It was followed in verbatim. According to the British archive and from his memoirs, Mustafa Kemal requested the British Ambassador to Turkey to become President after his death. We have solved all the riddles associated with him and his regime is no longer there and won't return forever...

 

[-SINAN-]

fter Treaty of Loussane, Lord Curzon," We have kept Turkey physically intact, but killed from inside. She will never regain her former might". It was followed in verbatim. According to the British archive and from his memoirs, Mustafa Kemal requested the British Ambassador to Turkey to become President after his death. We have solved all the riddles associated with him and his regime is no longer there and won't return forever...

Yeah, yeah....lunatic Islamists and their "Ataturk was British agent" conspiracy theory......

 

[jammersat]

Mustafa Kemal Ataturk , to me seems like he was a nice guy kinda like the current president of turkey erdogan ,

he perhaps did more for his country than his iranian counterpart Reza han , who throned himself a king , not only he was not a nice guy , he was illiterate too , a coward too , unlike what the IR media portray , he gave freedom to jewish press and then shut their newspapers down when hitler was getting momentum in europe

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Yeah, yeah....lunatic Islamists and their "Ataturk was British agent" conspiracy theory......

Millet is well aware of the facts. Clue: nobody names his/her son Mustafa Kemal. They always vote Reis Erdogan (lunatic Islamist) to power..

 

[Deliorman]

If it wasn't for Ataturk and every Turk that died on the front for this Country you wouldn't be here to talk bullshit about him now...

 

[-SINAN-]

Millet is well aware of the facts. Clue: nobody names his/her son Mustafa Kemal.

Nobody names his son as "Atatürk"...so ?

Let's see after his dead, what people are going to do to your reis......

They always vote Reis Erdogan (lunatic Islamist) to power..

You Reis has no such claims first of all....And look deeply at your reis....because Meral Akşener is going to bury him.