Turkey lifts ban on head scarf in Army for female soldiers.

[Neptune]

Tell me, do you think Jewish soldiers in USA, Israel or any other country would be provided with kosher food? If so why? Kosher food is manifestation of religion as much as headscarf?

I don't know the IDF. But US does that already (MREs I mean). Pardon my ignorance but I don't get what you mean. Can you expand?

 

[T-123456]

This is a good decision. Following religion or not following it is a personal choice and should be treated as such... the banning of valentines day in Pakistan is the opposite action which is similar to this. Too much fanaticism is not good as well as curtailing the principles of Islam is wrong too. Though hijab is not a must it still is based on personal choice whether a woman wants to wear it or not. Forcing someone to do anything is wrong.

Ok then,let men have long beards and long hair in the military.
Does that make any sense?
Whats next,she doesnt salute men because its not kosher?
In the military you all have to look the same to some degree,nobody stands out.
I dont mind women wearing hijab in other professions but not in the military.
Erdogan is turning our country into a failed state,banana republic.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

Nope. Firstly, I need to mention that putting so called western nations as a reference is something I would strongly oppose. But most of the countries you may refer to are those that have integrated civic nationalism into society a long time ago. But yet by taking such decisions for every minority at all areas have divided them. The way we see them is different because we face dozens of terrorist organizations. They are indeed more polarized than we could. Thats why they started tearing apart actually. UK and US first now France. Others will follow the suite. Their societies will be divided unfortunately. And such freedom looking privilege provider decions will make the same effect to Turkish public which is already in turmoil. Hopefully we will get over it one day and rise as one body.

Excuse my language but your comparisons are way beyond ridiculous. You are comparing a Muslim-majority country like Turkey with Western countries and their handling of minorities in the military complex. You are ignoring a very important fact here: these woman in Turkey are the majority.

You have no right whatsoever to dictate how they have to behave or what they have to wear and vice versa. YOU are the minority in our society.

Therefore your civil rights should be also under state protection. No female soldier should be forced to wear a headscarf if she doesn't want to and it's equally important that no female soldier should be forced to remove her headscarf if she wants to wear it voluntarily. Why are you Kemalists so obsessed with Islam?

People don't have to be secular as long as their decisions are based on the secular rules of our country. If the Muslims in our society can express themselves freely, Mr. Erdogan must deal with other and more important problems of our country openly. We will debate about economy, civil rights, foreign policy instead of debating about the headscarf and wasting valuable resources.

 

[T-123456]

What a change!! This is the power of Sabr and Shukr. Reis Erdo'an and his Muslim party have fundamentally made a turn-around effect for Turkey like the reorganization of the Ottoman Empire under Sultan Mehmut II (1808-1839), which led to its ultimate collapse and creation of the Republic...

Bro hastayim senin iletilerine,you make everything sound so positive.
You remind me of @xxxKULxxx (used to be a member here).

 

[Indus Pakistan]

I don't know the IDF. But US does that already (MREs I mean). Pardon my ignorance but I don't get what you mean. Can you expand?

The substantive issue with regards to veil and the military is - should the state make any allowances for religion? Yes or No?

 

[what]

Why are commie Turks mad? Are they actually going to make women go fight their wars?

What are commie Turks and who's mad in this thread? Can you point to a single post?
I would love to see woman fighting too, where's the problem?

 

[xenon54 out]

@Topic nothing is gonna change because the military personnel with headscarf, if anything, will be very insignificant to make any difference in the first place, if someone feels better with a headscarf then so be it.

@foreigners before you comment you should know that military is literally holy to Turks, make a poll here and you will see that every single Turkish member will agree with me and thats why every Turk has a right to his own opinion and doesnt need your permission to post something about his military.
So please think of this before you run your mouth about TSK, thx and no offense to anyone.

 

[what]

The substantive issue with regards to veil and the military is - should the state make any allowances for religion? Yes or No?

As a secular country Turkey did not allow any display of religious anything on you when you're on official duty, because you're representing a country that officially has no religion. So you either allow all forms religious clothing for example in the military including turbans for Hindi Turks or Kippas for Jewish Turks.

 

[Neptune]

The substantive issue with regards to veil and the military is - should the state make any allowances for religion? Yes or No?

Not in the military at certain points such as beards and headscarf.

 

[Indus Pakistan]

certain points

Certain is 'grey' area. I expected in the affirmitive. Fact is religion is accomodated in most militaries. I have not checked but I would be staggered if US military does NOT provide kosher food for it's Jewish soldiers. I know they already make exemptions for Sikh headgear.

 

[xenon54 out]

Certain is 'grey' area. I expected in the affirmitive. Fact is religion is accomodated in most militaries. I have not checked but I would be staggered if US military does NOT provide kosher food for it's Jewish soldiers. I know they already make exemptions for Sikh headgear.

Israel obviously does, and even orthodox Jews dont need to serve in military as far as i know but Israel isnt a secular country in the first place.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

Turkey is normalizing and that's the biggest thing happening. I sincerely hope that folks will be less judgmental of each other. It's not possible to change one's opinion and mindset by force. Hopefully, now that everybody has at the least personal freedom, no more complaining!!!!

 

[Indus Pakistan]

secular country in the first place.

Secularism as a concept is very multiplex and the precise configuration of that varies from country to country. I guess the Turkish definition is evolving - bearing in mind it was product of a politics of a time. Now similarly it is being revisited to be brought in more in sync with the genius of the present ruling elite.

 

[xenon54 out]

Secularism as a concept is very multiplex and the precise configuration of that varies from country to country. I guess the Turkish definition is evolving - bearing in mind it was product of a politics of a time. Now similarly it is being revisited to be brought in more in sync with the genius of the present ruling elite.

Its actually very simple:

Secularism = equal distance to all religions
Laicism = No state religion

Which is booth the case in Turkey and i honestly dont understand why many conservatives are disturbed to even read those words.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

@Kaptaan and other members

Let me give you an example how our secular Kemalists created single-handedly Islamists in Turkey.

Please, start the video at 1:25 and watch this video till the end.

This is Sivas University. Nursing Pinning Ceremony. 1995. 6 years before AKP came to power.

The first girl with the white headscarf, who tried to speak, was the top graduate in her class.

She was not allowed to attend her own ceremony because she wore a headscarf. Look what happened to her in this video and try to understand why even liberal people like me cannot and will not support Kemalists. Never. I rather die than voting in favor of CHP. What they did is not excusable.