Turkey Could Evaluate Russian Su-57 Aircraft If US Blocks F-35 Sale

[LeGenD]

Ask NATO members dude. They're the ones who are pressuring Turkey. Basically the S-400 breaks the stranglehold held by THAAD and ASTER systems and provides a more lethal and no-strings-attached solution to Turkey. Also, as a part of this deal, Turkey would not give access to the back-end codes of the S-400 system, which NATO cannot digest.

S-400 is roughly PAC-3 TIER with 77N6 missiles whereas S-500 is roughly THAAD TIER.

There is no such thing as no-strings attached solution from any major arms supplier. Turkey has to choose between NATO and Russia; no middle path. In either case, Turkey would be under influence.

One little correction. Chechnya is already a republic of Russia. So it was within their country while Georgia and Ukraine became separate CIS countries after USSR breakup.

Fair.

 

[T-Rex]

S-400 is roughly PAC-3 TIER with 77N6 missiles whereas S-500 is roughly THAAD TIER.

There is no such thing as no-strings attached solution from any major arms supplier. Turkey has to choose between NATO and Russia; no middle path. In either case, Turkey would be under influence.


Fair.

Turkey has already chosen to do whatever serves her security without being dictated by the arms supplier. As for being under the influence even the US is under the influence. So the question is who's not under some sort of influence? What kind of influence is the issue here and for Turkey the kind of influence Russia has over Turkey is not harmful for her security and that is the bottom line.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Ukraine and Russia have full diplomatic relationships. Stop talking about things u have no clue about.

No they don't. They recalled their ambassadors. They have no direct diplomatic contact.

 

[Basel]

I gave u video translation it talks about US jets and not about pak fa.


1) Wrong. Israel conducted 2 SDB attacks in Syria recently: one near Aleppo and second near Palmyra. Both deep inside Syrian territory so could not be launched from Lebanon.
2) Syria has means to attack Israeli planes in Lebanon: S-200, Buk and MiG-29 equipped with newest Russian missiles RVV-AE.

But your F-35s are invisible to Syrian sensors as ball size RCS are not painted on screen by radar systems, then why F-35 stayed inside Lebanon air space to attack Syrian targets? Even F-15/16 could have done that.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

But your F-35s are invisible to Syrian sensors as ball size RCS are not painted on screen by radar systems, then why F-35 stayed inside Lebanon air space to attack Syrian targets? Even F-15/16 could have done that.

To be honest F-35 can bomb Damascus from Tel Aviv. I think F-35 has 300 km range cruise missiles, no? At least it has SDB which has like 150 km range.

 

[500]

But your F-35s are invisible to Syrian sensors as ball size RCS are not painted on screen by radar systems, then why F-35 stayed inside Lebanon air space to attack Syrian targets? Even F-15/16 could have done that.

I repeat both SDB attacks where from inside Syrian airspace.

To be honest F-35 can bomb Damascus from Tel Aviv. I think F-35 has 300 km range cruise missiles, no? At least it has SDB which has like 150 km range.

SDB has 110 km range at max height and speed, at typical speed and altitude it has some 90 km range. In order top attack Palmyra and Aleppo u have to cross the Syrian border.

 

[Basel]

S-400 is roughly PAC-3 TIER with 77N6 missiles whereas S-500 is roughly THAAD TIER.

There is no such thing as no-strings attached solution from any major arms supplier. Turkey has to choose between NATO and Russia; no middle path. In either case, Turkey would be under influence.


Fair.

Really no middle path?? What the hell west is doing with India?? Why Greece was allowed to buy S-300 from Russia?

West usually put pressure on Muslim countries like that, non Muslim countries normally got exempted, hypocrisy at its best.

 

[LeGenD]

Turkey has already chosen to do whatever serves her security without being dictated by the arms supplier. As for being under the influence even the US is under the influence. So the question is who's not under some sort of influence? What kind of influence is the issue here and for Turkey the kind of influence Russia has over Turkey is not harmful for her security and that is the bottom line.

Turkey and Russia have a turbulent past: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Russo-Turkish_wars

During the course of Cold War, Turkey was not on good terms with USSR and NATO offered security. Recep Erdoğan is a power hungry tinpot dictator in the making; he is untrustworthy, unpredictable and reckless in his decision-making.

It is an open secret that Erdoğan and Fethullah Gulen were close to each other and both were of the view that Turkish military should be detached from Turkish politics. However, the two drifted apart over political disputes and Gulen moved to the US in 1999. Now Erdoğan wants the US to extradite Gulen to Turkey because he pins the blame of 2016 coup attempt on Gulen. US requested solid evidence of Gulen's involvement but Erdoğan failed to provide such. In fact, Erdoğan benefited immensely from 2016 coup attempt and managed to consolidate his power further. Food for thought: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...mystery/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.bb9397777a97

Additional information: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/12/turkey-failed-coup-attempt-161217032345594.html

Turkish homegrown political turmoil has spilled outside its borders and turned into a source of friction between the US and Turkey since 2016. Erdoğan is obliging Russia in order to exert pressure on the US to hand over Gulen to him. US have taken a principled stand on this matter that Gulen will be extradited when solid evidence of his involvement in 2016 coup episode will be presented. Russia, of-course, is a beneficiary of this friction.

Reality is that Erdoğan is a manchild; he thinks and acts like a Sultan, and wants to be obeyed without question. He have his share of supporters but there are many who despise him. Turkish members of this forum do not represent the prevalent sentiment in Turkey in regards to Erdoğan; one of my colleagues have visited Turkey several times and he has a lot to say.

Time will tell whether Erdoğan was a blessing for Turkey or a bane.

 

[500]

Really no middle path?? What the hell west is doing with India?? Why Greece was allowed to buy S-300 from Russia?

West usually put pressure on Muslim countries like that, non Muslim countries normally got exempted, hypocrisy at its best.

Greece did not buy S-300. Cyrpus bought it, but because of Turkish objection it was moved to Greece.

 

[T-Rex]

Turkey and Russia have a turbulent past: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Russo-Turkish_wars

During the course of Cold War, Turkey was not on good terms with USSR and NATO offered security. Recep Erdoğan is a power hungry tinpot dictator in the making; he is untrustworthy, unpredictable and reckless in his decision-making.

After reading this much I stopped reading because are you not the one who thinks that sissy, MBS and their goons are the champions of democracy in the Muslim world? If you must call somebody a tinpot dictator who can be a better candidate than sissy the mafia god father? Erdogan has not yet robbed the Turkish people of their right to elect their leader, something your favourite 'democratic' leader did in seconds after his illegitimate power grab through a military coup. So please save those titles for such characters. Yes, like every human being Erdogan has his faults too but undemocratic fetish isn't one of them. For such traits you have to look at sissy, MBS and their despotic associates in UAE.

 

[500]

No they don't. They recalled their ambassadors. They have no direct diplomatic contact.

No they did not.

 

[LeGenD]

After reading this much I stopped reading because are you not the one who thinks that sissy, MBS and their goons are the champions of democracy in the Muslim world? If you must call somebody a tinpot dictator who can be a better candidate than sissy the mafia god father? Erdogan has not yet robbed the Turkish people of their right to elect their leader, something your favourite 'democratic' leader did in seconds after his illegitimate power grab through a military coup. So please save those titles for such characters. Yes, like every human being Erdogan has his faults too but undemocratic fetish isn't one of them. For such traits you have to look at sissy, MBS and their despotic associates in UAE.

You stopped reading because you couldn't digest the truth. Turkey doesn't have a democracy, period. Bashar al-Assad also conducted elections in Syria and what was the outcome? You have no idea what kind of man Recep Erdogan is; I know through a colleague of mine who has been to Turkey several times.

MBS is popular in Saudi Arabia and he is striving to curtail wahhabism there. Yes, Saudi have monarchy but it works for them, or you want US to export is democracy to Saudi Arabia now?

Bro, world isn't perfect. US isn't the only thing bad out there - at the least, Americans have played a major role in revolutionizing the lifestyle of mankind over the course of 21st century. What has Turkey and Saudi Arabia offered to us?

Turkey is in a state of crises due to its inner political instability. People like Erdogan will find a way to blame the US and even aliens for problems confronting them; they are masters of cultivating a narrative because they benefit from them. However, Turkey will be in deep shit should it abandon NATO, I tell you as much. S-400s won't save it.

 

[Basel]

Greece did not buy S-300. Cyrpus bought it, but because of Turkish objection it was moved to Greece.

But Greece have those, and NATO didn't have issue with that.

 

[-------]

But Greece have those, and NATO didn't have issue with that.

Greece also integrated S-300 with NATO air defence systems using third party SW/HW integration. But it doesn't matter, Turkey will get its S-400 and it will be integrated into Turkish Air Defence System. Note, I say Turkish not NATO.

 

[T-Rex]

You stopped reading because you couldn't digest the truth. Turkey doesn't have a democracy, period.

Your butt hurts because your Machiavellian prince is hated by every sensible man who values honesty and modesty. If you conduct a survey outside your wahabi palaces you can find out yourself just how 'popular' your prince is. On the other hand, most people in Turkey don't have any problem voting for Erdogan but of course to people like you there's no democracy in Turkey, democracy is in sissy's Egypt. Your love for those good for nothing Arab despots have blinded you. To fools like you all that glitters is gold.

Bashar al-Assad also conducted elections in Syria and what was the outcome? You have no idea what kind of man Recep Erdogan is; I know through a colleague of mine who has been to Turkey several times.

It's so unfortunate that your friend only talks, perhaps he was punished for some sort of criminal offence and so he has this grudge against Erdogan like criminals have against honest leaders. Tell him to produce the kind of evidence we have against sissy, till then tell him to shut up. A stooge of MBS is giving lecture about democracy that's the irony here.

MBS is popular in Saudi Arabia and he is striving to curtail wahhabism there. Yes, Saudi have monarchy but it works for them, or you want US to export is democracy to Saudi Arabia now?

If MBS was so popular he wouldn't cling to his father's bloody throne. Instead he would try it with the ballot boxes.