TTP militants are Pakistan’s responsibility, not ours, Afghan Taliban leader Suhail Shaheen says

[Faizi Shooter]

hahaha, I see nothing but hate against Pashtuns here.
Yes, pashtuns do fight among themselves over small inconveniences but that, in no way gives rise or support to TTP in any way. The only reason some people from KPK and Balochistan join these groups is underdevelopment. Army cannot contain these groups 100% unless these areas se development, specially Balochistan, since its also a very large area for army to keep control at.

 

[TheSolution]

hahaha, I see nothing but hate against Pashtuns here.
Yes, pashtuns do fight among themselves over small inconveniences but that, in no way gives rise or support to TTP in any way. The only reason some people from KPK and Balochistan join these groups is underdevelopment. Army cannot contain these groups 100% unless these areas se development, specially Balochistan, since its also a very large area for army to keep control at.

I think the reason people from KP or Balochistan would join these groups first of all (if they don't actually agree with the ideology that is) is because of tribal loyalty.

Remember, they may not agree with anything being said but purely feel the need to support a tribal elder.

Because the underlying reason for constant fassad is pashtunism,, the same as it has been for the last 75 years

Shariah law doesn't effect pashtunawali

We could try it if course, but it would be dangerous to make concessions to these Afghani types and it might embolden them, I think unlike in the past we need to bring the hammer down on afghans of all types, refugees, TTP etc

You can't implement Sharia in a single province without two things happening:

1. People in other provinces will 100% demand Shariah, especially those with strong Islamist support.

2. Shariah in one province will essentially create a formalised version of TTP, and they will demand all of Pakistan to be under Shariah.

Remember, Shariah is an ideology that is meant to spread over all Muslim lands, in our case at the very least it would cover the whole of Pakistan.

If you want Shariah, then you must implement in the whole of Pakistan to avoid pointless fighting afterwards for others wanting it in the entire state. At that point you might as well declare Pakistan a caliphate too loool if it implements shariah.

 

[Mirzah]

Because the underlying reason for constant fassad is pashtunism,, the same as it has been for the last 75 years

Shariah law doesn't effect pashtunawali

We could try it if course, but it would be dangerous to make concessions to these Afghani types and it might embolden them, I think unlike in the past we need to bring the hammer down on afghans of all types, refugees, TTP etc

Try it not as concession, but take away ttp's recruitment tactic by implementing the harshest sharia laws in kpk and then using sharia law on ttp militants and make an example out of them, it would be funny to see ttp terrorists without arms and legs begging on the side walk

 

[hussain0216]

Try it not as concession, but take away ttp's recruitment tactic by implementing the harshest sharia laws in kpk and then using sharia law on ttp militants and make an example out of them, it would be funny to see ttp terrorists without arms and legs begging on the side walk

Absolutely,,

The problem is simple

If Afghans, TTP etc were Hindus we would have annihilated them,, strung them up from trees, slaughtered whole villages of them

Our handicap is the wider pashtun population

Even the pashtuns who are against the Taliban don't want a hard attack on them and immediately go into a shell if their is inevitable collateral damage



We have been stuck for ages because of this



Pakistan however is decided, to pull back the military and let the police take the lead, backed up by FC full of local recruits and it's banking on being able to inflict more damage upon the TTP and their families then the other way around and grinding them down


However due to the nature of the people in the tribal areas we are destined to always have some trouble in the area

You can't change a donkey into a decent law abiding human being and citizen

 

[PakAlp]

Its very easy to blame and attack Pashtuns/Pashtunwali for Pakistan troubles but the biggest puppets, traitors, corrupt, mafias in Pakistan are from Punjab/Sindh. They oppose anyone that challenges their rule in Pakistan. These so called posh, educated, bollywood/Hollywood lovers are responsible for majority of the problems. The tribal people in Balochistan and KPK want to live their own life style but the mafias want them to become Indians and western. So its 2 different ideologies having issues. The Pakistani awaam is suffering in between.

hahaha, I see nothing but hate against Pashtuns here.
Yes, pashtuns do fight among themselves over small inconveniences but that, in no way gives rise or support to TTP in any way. The only reason some people from KPK and Balochistan join these groups is underdevelopment. Army cannot contain these groups 100% unless these areas se development, specially Balochistan, since its also a very large area for army to keep control at.

Pakistanis as usual finding something to fight amongst themselves. I always blame the people of Pakistan aswell as the ruling elite who are busy in looting. They have never worked to make Pakistan better, instead made the people fight over provinces, ethnicities, sects. The people are blamed because they keep falling for these traps.

 

[PakAlp]

Just look at the Afghan Taliban from a neutral point of view, without any bias and hatred. At the moment they are weak and poor but will still not accept the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan, they made their point of view clear, they will not start a war between themselves and ttp because they're allies, ttp gave them sanctuary during the USA war, gave them fighters. Its their policy. They will not betray their people but Pakistan had their eyes closed when usa bombed their territory 400 times, even when the USA was occupying Afghanistan, Taliban refused to negotiate until usa leaves. Imagine it was Pakistan, our leadership would lay down in front of the usa.

Imagine the day they'll become strong militarily and economically. Pakistanis on PDF think of Afghanistan as weak and useless just like Indians think Pakistan is weak and useless. Same mentality.

 

[ProudThamizhan]

Pakistan is run by absolute morons, At the height of the US presence in Afghanistan, when there was limitless money being poured into Afghanistan by the US, Pakistan should have negotiated a funding of a hardened border wall on the Afghan Pakistani border, completely mined the area thoroughly and set up manned watch towers along with surveillance equipment, drones and other infrastructure. It would have stopped the TTP being able to cross over as well and stop the drug flow and refugees from Afghanistan coming into Pakistan, and this would have all been done with US money, as the US was eager to have cross border militancy stopped in both directions, and it would have even twisted the arm of Kabul to go along with the proposal. Instead they waited to start fencing only when the US started losing interest in Afghanistan and was fatigued and wanted to dedicate resources in the fight against China.

It was a tad bit worse than that . When US et al we’re fighting the terrorists , Pakistan was allowing them passage to escape.

 

[ProudThamizhan]

No multiple Indian consulates used as spy centers

Bringing them down, bought down 2 decades of Indian planning and investment

It destroyed two decades of afghan planning alongside pashtun nationalists/separatists against Pakistan

It took the U.S and NATO out of the region




Pakistan never had a problem with Afghanistans relationships with any state including India,, but not at the cost of Pakistani strategic interests


All afghans are the enemy of Pakistan, they always have been, it's Pakistani that have been blind,, but Taliban have natural weaknesses that are better for us then a hostile Afghan Republic

Total nonsense . When challenged Pakistan could not come up with one iota of evidence for the dozens of so called India. Consulates along Pakistan border . You guys just lie so much that now you’ve forgotten what is truth and what is the lie .

 

[my2cents]

Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iran should form a Confederation with an Islamic Constitution like the EU. They will have a three times bigger army and a three times stronger economy and the problems of IMF, TTP, IS and BLA will vanish.

What kind of Islamic confederación are you talking about? Can't even complete your pipeline with Iran for fear of sanctions. You should thank your stars that they did not sue you for $18 billion dollar fine, which they threatened you with. Not that you have that kind of money sitting around. But in general you have issues with all your neighbors.

 

[Goritoes]

Can someone please " Accidently " drop 50 Tsar Bomba on Afghanistan?

 

[hyperman]

It was a tad bit worse than that . When US et al we’re fighting the terrorists , Pakistan was allowing them passage to escape.

All the more reason to have built the fence. To be honest I don't really blame the Pakistanis for looking the other way on that issue, even if they wanted to, they would have had a tough time going into tribal areas to flush out the afghan talibs. The entirety of the US approach to Afghanistan was flawed, its a landlocked state in central asia which can only be reached though Pakistan(it could be reache through Iran and Russia/CSTO states but geopolitically it was unfeasible), to the entire campaign was dependent on Paksitani logistics, yet there was no deference to Pakistan on US policy in Afghanistan, and the state in how it was formed and functioned became hostile to Pakistan, so innately there was a contradiction and a conflict brewing. The best time to have left was right after the invasion when the govt was set up, a peace deal could have been reached that took into concerns of Pakistan, but alas, it didn't happen. The best decision Trump made was finally making the decision to withdraw(which also happened in the worst way), I was a bit worried that Biden would listen to the COFR parasites and cancel the withdrawal and stay indefinitely, but thankfully he didn't. Internally Afghanistan has gone to shit, but externally outside of the refugee issues, its gotten better, the opium trade has been crushed, Daesh has largely been suppressed, there is no civil war, and the most import matter of all, the US govt isn't bleeding resources indefinitely in a losing effort and allocating it elsewhere.

 

[TheSolution]

Just look at the Afghan Taliban from a neutral point of view, without any bias and hatred. At the moment they are weak and poor but will still not accept the border between Pakistan and Afghanistan, they made their point of view clear, they will not start a war between themselves and ttp because they're allies, ttp gave them sanctuary during the USA war, gave them fighters. Its their policy. They will not betray their people but Pakistan had their eyes closed when usa bombed their territory 400 times, even when the USA was occupying Afghanistan, Taliban refused to negotiate until usa leaves. Imagine it was Pakistan, our leadership would lay down in front of the usa.

Imagine the day they'll become strong militarily and economically. Pakistanis on PDF think of Afghanistan as weak and useless just like Indians think Pakistan is weak and useless. Same mentality.

You speak as if there wasn't a massive army inside Afghanistan that didn't actively support America with all their operations and be used as cannon fodder as well as the Ghani and Karzai cabinets. Afghans sold out their own country even worse than the Pakistanis. They have some of the worst warlords in history that would destroy entire cities for some chump change from foreigners.

Afghans had nothing to lose because most of their country was rubble anyway so they went to war.

Pakistan analysed the consequences and concluded outright hostilities with the US is not feasible so supported covertly the groups it needed. Keep in mind Pakistan wasn't bombing innocents either, they were active members of terrorist groups from around the world.

There is countless official papers explaining the above. Go read them.

Try it not as concession, but take away ttp's recruitment tactic by implementing the harshest sharia laws in kpk and then using sharia law on ttp militants and make an example out of them, it would be funny to see ttp terrorists without arms and legs begging on the side walk

If Shariah becomes official, the TTP also becomes an official army, not a terrorist group, and it expands its size.

Now what do you think will happen if only one province in Pakistan has Sharia with a huge army and supporters?

 

[ARMalik]

Taliban are right because TTP personnel are managed by ISI and GHQ Generals hence it is nothing to do with Taliban. TTP is simply there to kill Pakistan people at these behest of GHQ Generals. It sounds really fuked up and twisted BUT THIS IS WHAT THESE GENERALS ARE -- EVIL AND TWISTED.

 

[ProudThamizhan]

All the more reason to have built the fence. To be honest I don't really blame the Pakistanis for looking the other way on that issue, even if they wanted to, they would have had a tough time going into tribal areas to flush out the afghan talibs. The entirety of the US approach to Afghanistan was flawed, its a landlocked state in central asia which can only be reached though Pakistan(it could be reache through Iran and Russia/CSTO states but geopolitically it was unfeasible), to the entire campaign was dependent on Paksitani logistics, yet there was no deference to Pakistan on US policy in Afghanistan, and the state in how it was formed and functioned became hostile to Pakistan, so innately there was a contradiction and a conflict brewing. The best time to have left was right after the invasion when the govt was set up, a peace deal could have been reached that took into concerns of Pakistan, but alas, it didn't happen. The best decision Trump made was finally making the decision to withdraw(which also happened in the worst way), I was a bit worried that Biden would listen to the COFR parasites and cancel the withdrawal and stay indefinitely, but thankfully he didn't. Internally Afghanistan has gone to shit, but externally outside of the refugee issues, its gotten better, the opium trade has been crushed, Daesh has largely been suppressed, there is no civil war, and the most import matter of all, the US govt isn't bleeding resources indefinitely in a losing effort and allocating it elsewhere.

I mostly am of similar thought as above. But the benefit of doubt you are prepared to give Pakistan is where I think a big part of the plot was lost. We did not "trust but verify" for a long time and that emboldened Pakistani establishment to carry on more double games which then ended up in sever loss of trust.

Trump was already inclined to (rightly call it quits) but this loss of trust made it easier. And but for this loss of trust somebody like Biden could have vascilated and cancelled the withdrawal

 

[hyperman]

But the benefit of doubt you are prepared to give Pakistan is where I think a big part of the plot was lost. We did not "trust but verify" for a long time and that emboldened Pakistani establishment to carry on more double games which then ended up in sever loss of trust.

There was no "double game" states function according to their realpolitik interests, so when you set policy, you account for these realpolitik interest of parties. the Taliban was Pakistan's hedging of bets, after initially betraying them in the original invasion. From the getgo, the approach was flawed, if Pakistan was being relied on for logistics then Pakistan should have had the input in the formation of the Afghan government that the US formed, and there should have been deference towards Pakistan, instead what happened was Karzai was brought in and propped up, Karzai decided to take a hostile attitude toward Pakistan, allied with India(which does not share a border with Afghanistan and was largely irrelevant) and was driving a pastun nationalist outlook that was hostile to Pakistan, So the Pakistanis followed their realpolitik interests and started hedging with the Taliban(predicting that the US would eventually pull out and the govt would collapse,an assessment that played out correctly), which created problems with the US, b/c the Bush administration overthrew the taliban. So you see, there is an incoherence here in the policy.

If they were going to set up the govt that they did with Karzai that was going to be hostile to Pakistan(again idk why they would do this in the first place), then relying on Pakistani logistics was the dumbest move ever. And since there was no alternative to pakistani logistics(Iranian and Russian logistics were unviable for geopolitical reasons), logic would dictate for that the govt that formed could not have a hostile outlook towards Pakistan, and placated for pakistani interests..

There was interview from Michael Scheuer from like 11 years back, and he out of all the analysts I've seen, seems to have read this dynamic the most accurately, look back.