Trump to sign defence act preventing weapons sales to Turkey

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

It's true that NATO isn't as it used to be, but it still has enough resources and propaganda to be a very severe threat. Turkey will have to jump into Russia's arms for protection and assistance, but what will Russia ask in return? nothing is free. Also, do you think NATO will simply let go of 70 years worth of investment without trying to get it back? Trump is a moron, but a very dangerous one. What I'm saying is Turkey needs at least a decade or two to adjust, a sudden cut off will weaken it severely. If it goes rogue like Iran, it will make Iran look prosperous since Iran has far more resources. Turkey is much weaker than you think, in fact all of NATO except the US is weak and dependent on "the system"; politically, economically, and militarily.

If America even thinks about invading Turkey they better watch out. Turkey is Russia's neighbor and vital to Russia's national security especially Bosporous. You can bet on it Russia Su-35 deploy to Turkey for deterrence if Trump even makes a threat to invade Turkey.

 

[MMM-E]

Turkey’s army will be no different than Iran’s army in one decade unfortunately

What vibrant defence industry? Turkey is still entirely dependent on US and European equipment. Yes, Turkey has a few weapons in production, but even some of those are copies of European or US stuff.

in the next 10 years Turkey will have one of the best defense industry in the world including TS1400 Turboshaft gas turbine engine for Helicopters ( only a few countries in the world )
950hp and 1500 hp diesel engines for Howitzer and Tank


Turkey develops its own MPT55 and MPT76 Rifles , JNG-90 Sniper Rifle , MFY-71 fully automatic Machine Gun, next generation APCs,AFVs,IFVs, T155 STORM II 155mm Howitzer , YAVUZ truck mounted 155mm Howitzer , ALTAY Tank with AKKOR Active Protection System , FNSS SAMUR Amphibious Assault Bridge ,
KAPLAN Explosive Ordnance Disposal Robot , TAMKAR Mine Clearing System, etc


also Turkey develops all kinds of missiles

-- OMTAS man portable anti Tank Missile
-- KARAOK shoulder launcher anti Tank Missile ... ( similar to American JAVELIN )
-- 40 km TRG-122 guided MLRS
-- 120 km TRG-300 guided MLRS
-- 150 km J600T Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 280 km KHAN Tactical Ballistic Missile
-- 800-1000+ km BORA Ballistic Missile
-- 250 km SOM-J network enabled Cruise Missile
-- 800 km SOM-ER Cruise Missile
-- 200+ km ATMACA Anti ship Missile
-- SAPAN Rolling Airframe Missile
-- 8 km CIRIT laser guided Rocket for Attack Helicopters
-- 8 km MIZRAK-U Anti Tank Missile for Attack Helicopters
-- 30 km TEMREN Missile for Navy Helicopters
-- GOKTUG BWR and VWR Air to Air Missiles
-- AKBABA Anti radiotion Missile
-- 800-1400 km GEZGIN land and Naval based Cruise Missile
-- HISAR-A Air Defense System ( 15 km range and 10 km altitude )
-- HISAR-O Air Defense System ( 35+ km range and 18 km altitude )
-- HISAR-U Air Defense System ( 90 km range and 30 km altitude )
-- KORKUT 35mm SPAAG ( Airbust ammunition )
-- BURAK Space Probe Rocket and Launch System
-- UMIT Space Launch System

-- NEB Penetrator Bomb
-- 12 km LGK Laser guided Bomb
-- 28 km HGK and TEBER INS/GPS guided Smart Bombs
-- 110 km KGK INS/GPS guided Smart Bomb
-- ORKA Leightweight Torpedo
-- AKYA heavyweight Torpedo
-- TUFAN Electromagnetic Railgun



also Turkish defense company ASELSAN ranked 55 in the 2018 global top 100 list based on defence product revenue

-- AKKOR Active Protection System
-- KORAL Radar Electronic Warfare System
-- MEHPOD Jamming Pod
-- ASELPOD Targeting Pod
-- Airborne stand off Jammer
-- SPEWSII Self protection Electronic Warfare System
-- IFF Mode 5/S Long Range Interrogator

-- HIZIR Torpedo Countermeasure System for Surface Ships
-- HIZIR-LFAS Low Frequency Towed Active Sonar
-- ZOKA Acoustic Torpedo Countermeasure Decoy
-- ZARGANA Submarine Torpedo Counter Measure System
-- TORK Hard-Kill Torpedo Countermeasure System

-- 66 km ALPER Naval LPI Radar
-- 89 km SERDAR Coastal Surveillance LPI Radar
-- 100 km STR Weapon Locating Long Range Radar
-- 120 km KALKAN II Air search Radar
-- 450 km CAFRAD GaN based Naval Radar
-- 600+ km EIRS Early Warning Radar
-- Airborne GaN based AESA Radar




also Turkish Naval Industry

-- ADA class stealth Corvette ( in service )
-- MILGEM-I class stealth Frigate ( under construction )
-- TF-2000 class Destroyer ( under development )
-- MILDEN class AIP Submarine ( under development )
-- 137 m BAYRAKTAR class LST.. ( can carry 20 Tanks )
-- New type LCT
-- ALEMDAR class Submarine Rescue Mother Ship (MOSHIP)
-- Super Tanker
-- Patrol Boat
-- Fast attack Missile Boat



also Turkish Aerospace Industries ( TAI )

-- TAI HURKUS Trainer and light attack Aircraft
-- TAI HURJET Jet trainer and air close support Fighter Jet
-- TAI TFX 5th gen stealth Fighter Jet
-- TAI T129 Attack Helicopter
-- TAI ATAK2 Attack Helicopter Project
-- TAI T625 Utility Helicopter
-- TAI 10 tons class Utility Helicopter Project
-- TAI ANKA MALE UCAV
-- GOKTURK Military Satellite

Bayraktar TB-2 Tactical UCAV is in service and Bayraktar AKINCI UCAV by 2020 ( 4,5 tons MTOW and 1300kg payload , SATCOM , AESA Radar )



so 4 Turkish defence companies among top 100 globally in 2018
http://people.defensenews.com/top-100/

Turkey is the only Muslim majority country with companies represented on the list

 

[EpiiC]

If America even thinks about invading Turkey they better watch out. Turkey is Russia's neighbor and vital to Russia's national security especially Bosporous. You can bet on it Russia Su-35 deploy to Turkey for deterrence if Trump even makes a threat to invade Turkey.

America has way many planes better than SU-35!

 

[azbaroj]

What vibrant defence industry? Turkey is still entirely dependent on US and European equipment. Yes, Turkey has a few weapons in production, but even some of those are copies of European or US stuff. Not to mention, the Turkish military has been part of NATO for a very long time. All its standards, equipment, training, and doctrine are handed down by NATO. Cutting all that suddenly will cause a very severe imbalance. An imbalance that could take decades to fix. Russia and China will never treat Turkey the way NATO did. Turkey got away with a lot because of its favorable position within NATO. If it goes out, that political cover will go and suddenly all types of problems that were suppressed will suddenly pop up.

Apparently two reasons for which US is not providing with F-35 to Turkey
1. Detention of the Pastor A Brunsen
2. Buying S-400 from Russia .
If Turkey Release Pastor and cancel buying S-400 systems , Turkey will not get F -35s .
There are other issues which are the real cause to not to supply the F 35s .
1. Islamization by Erdogan
2. Historic low relation with Israel
3. Warm relation with Iran and Russia .
4. Turkey is no more a blind American tool .
5.Israel is opposing to supply f-35 to Turkey .
So if Turkey release the Pastor and cancel buying S 400 , US will bring other issues such as Human rights , Democracy , freedom of speech , supporting Hamas etc. and congress will forward the bill that , under Erdogan Turkey is no more a reliable partner . Supplying f-35s to Turkey will endanger the safety of Israel
So pastor and S 400 is a issues but not the main .

 

[T-Rex]

Apparently two reasons for which US is not providing with F-35 to Turkey
1. Detention of the Pastor A Brunsen
2. Buying S-400 from Russia .
If Turkey Release Pastor and cancel buying S-400 systems , Turkey will not get F -35s .
There are other issues which are the real cause to not to supply the F 35s .
1. Islamization by Erdogan
2. Historic low relation with Israel
3. Warm relation with Iran and Russia .
4. Turkey is no more a blind American tool .
5.Israel is opposing to supply f-35 to Turkey .
So if Turkey release the Pastor and cancel buying S 400 , US will bring other issues such as Human rights , Democracy , freedom of speech , supporting Hamas etc. and congress will forward the bill that , under Erdogan Turkey is no more a reliable partner . Supplying f-35s to Turkey will endanger the safety of Israel
So pastor and S 400 is a issues but not the main .

You got that right. Definitely there are more to it than what one can see with naked eyes. The US has exposed her hostility to many of the values Turkish people will defend with their lives.

 

[azbaroj]

USA has history of betraying

Turkey should not panic it will hurt US more than turkey

It is financial loss to US

and turkish defence industry is very much can take this chalange on hand they have best minds

It is blessing and disguise better not buying those unusable F 35 with stings atrached to it

Any nation buy from USA will tjink twice you will see how it hurts USA

I think Turkey should cancel buying f 35
coz its performance is completely dependent on software upgradation and Israel all ready urged not to provide with upgraded version of software to Turkey . Further more Israel has the technological knowledge to manipulate and hack or track or even crack the F 35 and make it inoperable . Further more if America wants , any time they can push the kill button to make f 35 inoperable . Turkey will not be able to operate these planes independently or against the will of US . So Turkey should think twice .

 

[cabatli_53]

You got that right. Definitely there are more to it than what one can see with naked eyes. The US has exposed her hostility to many of the values Turkish people will defend with their lives.

It is revealed in Wikileaks documents that US carried out a secret project containing hardware and software kill-switches to control/block closed-box strategic complete systems given in the hands of NATO costumers with billion $ deals. That must be the way US feel safer for countries they promised to protect so When a state started to exit out of their politic orbit, They will agree on activating kill switches to block the capabilities gained with nation's tax money in crisis times. Until that phase, Threatening, Small/medium scale secret sanctions on component/complete level, congress blockage for deals and economical wars are other cards that they are using against states. Most probably, US classifies the costumers as Group-1/2/3 in accordance with risk factors to apply different policy. Some states have all privileges to reach deep technologies of US products including modification/domestic asset integration rights without any problem, While others doesn't even allowed to do some simple maintenance works. That is the way US control the states for strengthening its influence and politic camps under the name of NATO alliance.

In that circumstances, They realized that Turkey started declaring independence on those area of technologies they control/block/sanctions, making deals with countries out of NATO, While developing own equivalent systems. As a results of successes in defense industry, Self confidence of state increased and voice began to rise even higher to protect the benefits of Republic inside/outside of our borders Even If It harms US plans.
It is the first time Turkish Army faced GPS blockage in Afrin operation but Army proceeded to strike the targets with drones developed by domestic industry. Long altitude SAM missiles have a strategic precautions in determining the fate of a country so US rises the voice not to proceed our own way but theirs. The real reason hiding behind the politic speeches is about to keep controlling Turkey via missile deal again. Suspending delivery of F-35 is a temporary punishment (90days) to put Turkey into same orbit with re-assessing the S-400 deal and regional disagreements harming US interests. Economy is a pressure tool to make Turkey weaker to keep our concentration away from disputes US joined in.

 

[T-Rex]

It is revealed in Wikileaks documents that US carried out a secret project containing hardware and software kill-switches to control/block closed-box strategic complete systems given in the hands of NATO costumers with billion $ deals. That must be the way US feel safer for countries they promised to protect so When a state started to exit out of their politic orbit, They will agree on activating kill switches to block the capabilities gained with nation's tax money in crisis times. Until that phase, Threatening, Small/medium scale secret sanctions on component/complete level, congress blockage for deals and economical wars are other cards that they are using against states. Most probably, US classifies the costumers as Group-1/2/3 in accordance with risk factors to apply different policy. Some states have all privileges to reach deep technologies of US products including modification/domestic asset integration rights without any problem, While others doesn't even allowed to do some simple maintenance works. That is the way US control the states to strengthening its influence and politic camps under the name of NATO alliance.

In that circumstances, They realized that Turkey started declaring independence on those area of technologies they control/block/sanctions, making deals with countries out of NATO, While developing own equivalent systems. As a results of successes in defense industry, Self confidence of state increased and voice began to rise even higher to protect the benefits of Republic inside/outside of our borders Even If It harms US plans.
It is the first time Turkish Army faced GPS blockage in Afrin operation but Army proceeded to strike the targets with drones developed by domestic industry. Long altitude SAM missiles have a strategic precautions in determining the fate of a country so US rises the voice not to proceed our own way but theirs. The real reason hiding behind the politic speeches is about to keep controlling Turkey via missile deal again. Suspending delivery of F-35 is a temporary punishment (90days) to put Turkey into same orbit with re-assessing the S-400 deal and regional disagreements harming US interests. Economy is a pressure tool to make Turkey weaker to keep our concentration away from disputes US joined in.

I think it's time for Turkey to trash the NPT. It will be a very strong message to the bully and it will also start a good trend. Ideally all Muslim states should come out of NPT but the problem is only a few have sovereignty.

 

[Yongpeng Sun-Tastaufen]

Apparently two reasons for which US is not providing with F-35 to Turkey
1. Detention of the Pastor A Brunsen
2. Buying S-400 from Russia .
If Turkey Release Pastor and cancel buying S-400 systems , Turkey will not get F -35s .
There are other issues which are the real cause to not to supply the F 35s .
1. Islamization by Erdogan
2. Historic low relation with Israel
3. Warm relation with Iran and Russia .
4. Turkey is no more a blind American tool .
5.Israel is opposing to supply f-35 to Turkey .
So if Turkey release the Pastor and cancel buying S 400 , US will bring other issues such as Human rights , Democracy , freedom of speech , supporting Hamas etc. and congress will forward the bill that , under Erdogan Turkey is no more a reliable partner . Supplying f-35s to Turkey will endanger the safety of Israel
So pastor and S 400 is a issues but not the main .

So? Turkey can buy MiG-35 from Russia. Just as good if not better than F-35.

 

[azbaroj]

So? Turkey can buy MiG-35 from Russia. Just as good if not better than F-35.

https://sputniknews.com/amp/analysis/201808151067215661-f35-su35-expert-opinion/

 

[azbaroj]

So? Turkey can buy MiG-35 from Russia. Just as good if not better than F-35.

Once super power Turkey , dependent on other countries for its essential arms , is a matter of shame . On arms technology they should be equivalent to at least with France , Britain , Italy or Germany . But in fact they are far more leg behind these countries . Even they leg behind Serbia , once their colony and also they are buying parts for armoured from Serbia to protect their tanks . I don't know why they are unable to produce advanced and hitech defence materials . Sorry for my bad english .

 

[cabatli_53]

Once super power Turkey , dependent on other countries for its essential arms , is a matter of shame . On arms technology they should be equivalent to at least with France , Britain , Italy or Germany . But in fact they are far more leg behind these countries . Even they leg behind Serbia , once their colony and also they are buying parts for armoured from Serbia to protect their tanks . I don't know why they are unable to produce advanced and hitech defence materials . Sorry for my bad english .

I think you should firstly get some proper source to educate yourself about what Turkey can do or not before reaching such conclusions.

 

[user1]

It is going to be a blessing in disguise.

Pakistan started an indigenous fighter plane program in the collaboration with China after the 1999 Pressler amendment which stopped the sale of F-16s to Pakistan. Result is JF-17 Thunder with a new program to build a fifth gen fighter.

Hopef ully, Turkey will now speed up the development of it 's own indigenous fighter Tai-TFX in collaboration with the nations which do not treat their allies as tissue papers.

 

[cabatli_53]

It is going to be a blessing in disguise.

Pakistan started an indigenous fighter plane program in the collaboration with China after the 1999 Pressler amendment which stopped the sale of F-16s to Pakistan. Result is JF-17 Thunder with a new program to build a fifth gen fighter.

Hopef ully, Turkey will now speed up the development of it 's own indigenous fighter Tai-TFX in collaboration with the nations which do not treat their allies as tissue papers.

Turkish industry proceeds development of three different national fighter program simultaneously.

• Hürjet CAS/Advanced trainer fighter-2022 first flight
• MIUS Unmanned Stealth Fighter jet-2023 first flight
• TF-X stealth air superiority fighter-2023 ground tests to commence.

 

[azbaroj]

I think you should firstly get some proper source to educate yourself about what Turkey can do or not before reaching such conclusions.

Yes , I am trying to know about Turkey's defence production . But I am unable to know why turkey is dependent on US for their fighter plane or Air defence systems . Once super power is why not as advanced USA , Russia or Uk . I know about your TFX program , Drone technology , Naval Ship production , tanks and missile production . But why your T-129 is not completely indigenous ? Why Turkey can't produce state of the art technology Air defence or fighter plane . In case of hitech , once Turkey's colony Serbia is advanced than Turkey . I put this question , only to know , I will be grateful if you let me know the answer .

I think you should firstly get some proper source to educate yourself about what Turkey can do or not before reaching such conclusions.

Which part of my statement is wrong ?