Tripura-Chittagong sea port bridge to be entirely funded by India

[Bilal9]

I don't see that happening. I mean look at the exports of Bangladesh to India (raw amount and composition).

I doubt Bangladesh will be able to compete in manufactured goods (beyond say textiles and RMG) in supplying the North East because the economies of scale India has developed in its hearth zones combined with the cheap transit across Bangladesh in effect now...mean a Walton fridge is not going to compete all that well with say a Videocon one a N.E state sources from West Bengal etc. I mean just compare the economies of scale of a Bangladeshi white-good producer like Walton to any Indian one (going by their total revenue, net income etc). I mean we can start by checking what the price of a typical Walton fridge is if you have that info somewhere.

http://articles.economictimes.india...li-bangladesh-exports-industry-body-cii-today

Indian imports from Bangladesh include textile fibres, paper yarn, fish, apparel, mineral fuels, salt and cement.

The raw good or low value addition goods are what will increase from Bangladesh into the North East and rest of India. But terms of trade for those are relatively low given Bangladesh's import basket from India includes 30 - 40% of large value added manufactures like vehicles and manufactured components.

The fact Bangladesh imports these from India show just how unviable Bangladeshi white-good manufactures will be in the North East with cheap transit. Also I am unsure what duties such value-added Bangladeshi goods attract in India.

Even hypothetically/conceptually, if you think the North East being a backyard of Bangladesh....its all relative since what exactly does India consider Bangladesh? You can't say one relationship is more of a partnership and the other is more of a captive "backyard" "large reliance" status

http://www.familyneeds.net/category/freezer-refrigerator/

Choose Walton as brand. Then look at MSRP vis-a-vis displacement.

Also consider that compressor of Walton models is sourced from better Asian brands. Also look at Videocon reputation in India for longevity vs. other brands.

Telling thing is there is almost no Indian refrigerator/freezer brand in Bangladesh mentioned here even after twenty some odd years of marketing in this country.

 

[Nilgiri]

http://www.familyneeds.net/category/freezer-refrigerator/

Choose Walton as brand. Then look at MSRP vis-a-vis displacement.

Also consider that compressor of Walton models is sourced from better Asian brands. Also look at Videocon reputation in India for longevity vs. other brands.

Telling thing is there is almost no Indian refrigerator/freezer brand in Bangladesh mentioned here even after twenty some odd years of marketing in this country.

It was just one brand (Videocon) that I remember from the 90s. No idea what the more popular brands are now in India.

I mean just compare some prices between Bangladesh and India for fridges:

Here is one of the cheapest entries I can find from Walton:

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-d-1f0-d-1f0/

About 140 Litre internal volume and it costs about 21,000 BDT....or about under 18000 INR.


Now for a quick search in an Indian catalog:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/applian...bcategory=refrigerators&sort=price:asc&page=2

There are plenty of name brands (LG, Haier, Panasonic, Samsung, Godrej..and others) with prices well under 18k INR with capacities far larger and with good quality ratings.....there is a huge host of models clustered around the 12,000 - 14,000 INR range...and these include foreign name brands like LG.

Comparing an LG 255 liter capacity fridge which appears to be the same model:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/appliance/lg-gl-b282swcm-255-litres-double-door-refrigerator-msf207818

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/lg-refrigerator-2b282slhlss/

It's like half the price in India compared to Bangladesh because such companies like LG have their production inside India. Its not a one or two local manufacturing companies and everything else is imported like in Bangladesh.

 

[Bilal9]

It was just one brand (Videocon) that I remember from the 90s. No idea what the more popular brands are now in India.

I mean just compare some prices between Bangladesh and India for fridges:

Here is one of the cheapest entries I can find from Walton:

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-d-1f0-d-1f0/

About 140 Litre internal volume and it costs about 21,000 BDT....or about under 18000 INR.


Now for a quick search in an Indian catalog:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/applian...bcategory=refrigerators&sort=price:asc&page=2

There are plenty of name brands (LG, Haier, Panasonic, Samsung, Godrej..and others) with prices well under 18k INR with capacities far larger and with good quality ratings.....there is a huge host of models clustered around the 12,000 - 14,000 INR range...and these include foreign name brands like LG.

Comparing an LG 255 liter capacity fridge which appears to be the same model:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/appliance/lg-gl-b282swcm-255-litres-double-door-refrigerator-msf207818

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/lg-refrigerator-2b282slhlss/

It's like half the price in India compared to Bangladesh because such companies like LG have their production inside India. Its not a one or two local manufacturing companies and everything else is imported like in Bangladesh.

The consumer perceptions in Bangladesh and India are a bit different. In India it seems 255 litre fridges are the sweet spot. Not so in Bangladesh. People in Bangladesh generally are heavy-duty food connoisseurs and also ready at 50 plus for diabetic medication and kidney transplants. So generally they are looking for larger fridges to store meat etc. Most middle-class urban households also have a freezer for long term storage.

I can tell you just from discussion with a few females with new families that they are shooting for different class of fridges. 255 Litre painted ice-boxes are not the aspirational items in Bangladesh (unless you are a lower middle class person).

Middle class and upper-middle-class people are generally looking for higher grade 450 litre plus fridges (to buy once and keep for say ten years or more). These are often 600~700 litre double-door models and in stainless steel finishes. 255 litre slimline fridges are not the norm in Bangladeshi middle-class households and has not been for a long time. I myself remember growing up in Bangladesh with two fridges that lasted a decade each, one a Kelvinator (British), the other a Norge (Made in Norway). Being used to imported Western brands and larger sizes for seven decades since Pakistan times has formed these perceptions - for better or worse. 255 litre sizing is a recent Asian phenomenon.

The LG models you compared are totally different animals. The one being sold in Bangladesh is clad in stainless steel and is not assembled in India (hence the higher price). Import duty may also be higher.

The Indian model is built for a price-sensitive market and customer. But price alone does not sell things in Bangladesh, even for an LG-branded refrigerator.

Just what it is....

 

[Nilgiri]

The consumer perceptions in Bangladesh and India are a bit different. In India it seems 255 litre fridges are the sweet spot. Not so in Bangladesh. People in Bangladesh generally are heavy-duty food connoisseurs and also ready at 50 plus for diabetic medication and kidney transplants. So generally they are looking for larger fridges to store meat etc. Most middle-class urban households also have a freezer for long term storage.

I can tell you just from discussion with a few females with new families that they are shooting for different class of fridges. 255 Litre painted ice-boxes are not the aspirational items in Bangladesh (unless you are a lower middle class person).

Middle class and upper-middle-class people are generally looking for higher grade 450 litre plus fridges (to buy once and keep for say ten years or more). These are often 600~700 litre double-door models and in stainless steel finishes. 255 litre slimline fridges are not the norm in Bangladeshi middle-class households and has not been for a long time. I myself remember growing up in Bangladesh with two fridges that lasted a decade each, one a Kelvinator (British), the other a Norge (Made in Norway). Being used to imported Western brands and larger sizes for seven decades since Pakistan times has formed these perceptions - for better or worse. 255 litre sizing is a recent Asian phenomenon.

The LG models you compared are totally different animals. The one being sold in Bangladesh is clad in stainless steel and is not assembled in India (hence the higher price). Import duty may also be higher.

The Indian model is built for a price-sensitive market and customer. But price alone does not sell things in Bangladesh, even for an LG-branded refrigerator.

Just what it is....

Yah well we were talking about what the Indian consumer in the North Eastern states would want since we are looking at Indian vs Bangladesh good consumption viability over there.

If we completely focus on the 450 litre plus fridge that you say is the preference for Bangladesh consumer, it is strange that Walton offers a handful of models in the line up they had at the site you posted (compared to the many models offered in mid and entry level capacity).

In fact they are only 4 models on offer in this range (450 Litres+) out of 67 total models and they cost from about 55k to 70k BDT.

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigertor-wss-4h5/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wt730-5b6/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wnj-5e5-0101/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wnj-5h5-0101/


Now if we look at some examples of Indian fridge prices in the 450L+ range, they start at page 15 in the catalog:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/applian...category=refrigerators&sort=price:asc&page=15

The first thing I notice is the much wider percentage of fridge models in this category.

Example LG India has 36 models in this category alone whereas LG's total selection in Bangladesh was 33 models about 7 or so were in this category.

Samsung India has 28 models in this category alone whereas Samsung total selection in Bangladesh was 15 models, about 4 of which in this category.

And we can keep going like this.

The Indian fridges of this category start at about 47,000 INR, so about the same as the Walton starting price...however there is a much wider selection and the super sized fridges (600L and larger) are often much cheaper in India.

So I personally find it very doubtful that Bangladesh made white goods at any price level or category will have a large captive market in India's North East. I mean you also mention duty that Bangladesh slaps on certain imports, well India does the same...so that will just add to the final price of a Bangaldeshi made appliance in the north East and detract from its viability in competing with Indian made goods.

It is to be noted that foreign name brand white goods (LG, Samsung, Panasonic, Hitachi, Bosch, Ahier etc) in India are not just assembled, they are manufactured from scratch at the large facilities in Pune, Ghaziabad, Noida, Ahmedabad, Chennai etc....any components not made in-situ also come from other factories in India. It's not a case of importing parts and assembling (that only happens with more advanced electronics like smartphones, and that is also going to change in the years to come).

 

[Bilal9]

Yah well we were talking about what the Indian consumer in the North Eastern states would want since we are looking at Indian vs Bangladesh good consumption viability over there.

If we completely focus on the 450 litre plus fridge that you say is the preference for Bangladesh consumer, it is strange that Walton offers a handful of models in the line up they had at the site you posted (compared to the many models offered in mid and entry level capacity).

In fact they are only 4 models on offer in this range (450 Litres+) out of 67 total models and they cost from about 55k to 70k BDT.

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigertor-wss-4h5/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wt730-5b6/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wnj-5e5-0101/

http://www.familyneeds.net/product/walton-refrigerator-wnj-5h5-0101/


Now if we look at some examples of Indian fridge prices in the 450L+ range, they start at page 15 in the catalog:

http://www.mysmartprice.com/applian...category=refrigerators&sort=price:asc&page=15

The first thing I notice is the much wider percentage of fridge models in this category.

Example LG India has 36 models in this category alone whereas LG's total selection in Bangladesh was 33 models about 7 or so were in this category.

Samsung India has 28 models in this category alone whereas Samsung total selection in Bangladesh was 15 models, about 4 of which in this category.

And we can keep going like this.

The Indian fridges of this category start at about 47,000 INR, so about the same as the Walton starting price...however there is a much wider selection and the super sized fridges (600L and larger) are often much cheaper in India.

So I personally find it very doubtful that Bangladesh made white goods at any price level or category will have a large captive market in India's North East. I mean you also mention duty that Bangladesh slaps on certain imports, well India does the same...so that will just add to the final price of a Bangaldeshi made appliance in the north East and detract from its viability in competing with Indian made goods.

It is to be noted that foreign name brand white goods (LG, Samsung, Panasonic, Hitachi, Bosch, Ahier etc) in India are not just assembled, they are manufactured from scratch at the large facilities in Pune, Ghaziabad, Noida, Ahmedabad, Chennai etc....any components not made in-situ also come from other factories in India. It's not a case of importing parts and assembling (that only happens with more advanced electronics like smartphones, and that is also going to change in the years to come).

I'm sure backward linkage will be far more prevalent in Indian refrigerator manufacturing than Bangladesh, given the larger volumes.

Here is a story, although a few years old, on Bangladesh refrigerator sector that has some high level stats.

http://www.jica.go.jp/bangladesh/bangland/en/report/529.html

 

[Nilgiri]

I'm sure backward linkage will be far more prevalent in Indian refrigerator manufacturing than Bangladesh, given the larger volumes.

Here is a story, although a few years old, on Bangladesh refrigerator sector that has some high level stats.

http://www.jica.go.jp/bangladesh/bangland/en/report/529.html

Yes Doyalbaba posted that somewhere in either this thread or some other thread.

Bangladesh sure has a massive market within itself that will keep its appliance and any current and future electronics industry very sustainable for sure given the potential thats there as people transition into new income brackets and existing spenders widen their own pockets.

Bangladesh investment rate is very solid, its close to Indian level now and it has ramped up nicely over the years, so I dont dispute almost any sort of future growth in pretty much any general economic sphere (especially manufacturing given the RMG success and also the income levels now being achieved with the current political stability) within Bangladesh.

I myself have a Bangladeshi friend who's father was in jute business for a long time and now they have diversified into more value added consumer products and are doing remarkably well....another close friend of mine's dad is the founder of a very large group of businesses (based mostly around construction but diversifying to some other sectors)....so I have a finger to the wind of Bangladesh economy in somewhat more micro day to day perspective all the time from what I hear from them. So all said and done, its definitely exciting times ahead for Bangladesh economy. India and Bangladesh are going to be working together more and more, theres no other option as it gets in the way of our progress to not do so. There is much to learn from each other and implement.

Long term of course parts of India are going to be part of a large product chain that are very integrated with Bangladesh....I mean these are consumer and supplier bases composed of 10's of millions of people! But I dont think anyone is going to be really talking in terms of captive markets/sheer economic "control" then, because everyone wants to have a good balance between supplying and consuming and thats where a healthy productive competition comes in to find the niche advantages of everyone in a region. I mean its akin to say the markets we find in Europe now...for example Belgium/Netherlands have a far smaller population than Germany, but they are not exactly economically dominated and 100% reliant on Germany (nor do they see eye to eye on absolutely everything because of German economic strength)...Their own suppliers/consumers have adapted to having such a large base of supplier/consumers in Germany. Thats the sort of future I foresee between India's North East and Bangladesh in terms of the population ratio....and also between India and Bangladesh overall. Its simple economics and it will flourish as the other more bitter/political/social stuff diminishes over time and fades from memory.