I appreciate your concerns, but you are trying to reach perfection. You cannot commend them, then cry that money is being spent, it is that money and the capability that was created from those resources that have allowed the successes you have recognised. But you prefer to complain, it does not make sense.
Look at our budgets in the 1980s, that was a crazy level of defence spending, but today our threats have increased and yet our defense budget as a proportion of government expenditure or percentage of GDP is a lot lower.
You simply cannot have it both ways, life is about balance, running a country is about balance, taking into account your circumstances, that being said we are doing ok. Please remember we have had constant instability in our region for 40 years. It is unfair not to recognise that, and keep putting the blame on our heads.
I agree. Pakistan needs to figure out how to do more with less.
Iran is a good example of this strategy. Saudis are outspending Iran 4-1 for every dollar, yet Iran is far ahead
Why?
Reason is ridiculously simple. Iran has embraced asymmetric warfare while Saudi is still doing conventional war.
Conventional war has always been far more expensive than asymmetric war. Asymmetric war is much cheaper and much more effective against a larger enemy. Asymmetric war is perfect for Pakistan fighting larger enemy like India, but since Pakistan is stubborn and refuses to go asymmetric, defence budget keeps rising because army insists on expensive and ineffective old ways of conventional warfare.
Cyber warfare is free yet Pakistan is not doing it. Drones and missiles are cheaper than Air Force yet Pakistan is not doing it. So of course Pakistan is going to have artificially bloated defence expenses as long as PA is stubborn and refuses to go asymmetric. Money that Pakistan could save by going asymmetric and ditching conventional warfare could be used to fund new things like Pakistan hypersonics and space.
Instead we have worst of both worlds because conventional war is more expensive and less effective than asymmetrics. I don't see that changing as long as current anti-technology toxic conventional mindset continues to exist in Pakistan military that ignores and neglects asymmetric war.
I really admire How our Pakistan Armed Forces and ISI, in the most difficult circumstances have fought 40 + countries agencies trying to make us Iraq, Syria and Libya. Its an unbeleivable job done for past 20 years.
But what pains everyone now as you can see on social media, twitter facebook and TV channels is when alot of waste is done by Army, and then NUST, 100+ Army companies fine, but put that money in Pakistani exchanger, in Pakistan treasure, they donot add it up, the income is never added back in Pakistan economy, then comes our high budgets with no audits, no checks no oversight and no management, look at the health and education budget. Pakistanis are dying with Covid-19, no beds, no ICUs, look at how badly Lahore is affected coronavirus, and look at our economy....and yet why the Armed Forces donot see it because they donot understand it how crucial our economy is linked to Pakistan's ultimate survival.
Not one decent argument of why Military has high budget as compared to Education and Health? You know why because these Army men know jackasss about it.
Army follows golden rule: Don't shit where you eat. They will ensure Army companies are well run because that's where they make their money.
Any company in Pakistan that doesn't have Army connections will be left to the dogs and thrown to the hyenas.
It’s hard to unpick these stats of federal expenditure on defence vs federal + provincial on health and education. If one compares the full picture, army budget seems more reasonable.
However, what’s worth criticising IMO is how we can afford such a big percentage increase in the army budget when the economy has barely grown previous fiscal year and may shrink in the coming year. All while IMF is instructing us to cut expenditure everywhere else in order to continue with reform. This is where people argue.. but look at India’s growing budget and capabilities, army needs more because of xyz threat etc.
However, I don’t think this giant increase in expenditure given the current situation can be justified. Not when the government will be saving on expenditure elsewhere (relative to % change in gov exp in comparable nations in covid related stimulus packages). Also, comparisons with Indian budget increases are wholly incorrect. Their GDP growth rate has and continues to outstrip ours, and they have the fiscal space and aren’t in the midst of a financial crisis with IMF breathing down their necks. Also, their expenditure as a % if GDP is obviously smaller than ours to begin with. And that dollar terms budget OP used is also invalid, our budget has increased faster if percentage growth in PKR and INR terms is used, we also had massive devaluation that the chart misses.
So some criticism of the army budget is completely justified. And with this government, that criticism is understandably amplified anyway.
Army expenditure problem will keep getting exponentially worse in the future unless Pakistan makes the switch from conventional to asymmetric warfare.
If your country is bigger than your enemy, conventional warfare is better.
If your country is smaller than your enemy, asymmetric warfare is better.
Asymmetric warfare is more effective and much cheaper than conventional warfare against an enemy.
Asymmetric warfare is three things:
1. Cyber warfare
2. Drones
3. Missiles
Pakistan is not using any of these right now. If we did, our defence expenses would decrease dramatically and our deterrence would increase significantly.
The issue with these idiots like you is they have a tunnel vision, Armed Forces will grow till judgement day as they stated, and you are an Indian, devoid of understanding what are we gonna do with a USSR type army without an economy and nothing to feed 220 million Pakistanis and exact plans to increase our GDP. When you ask them how Military machine is run and fed? Nil How are we going to pay back loan to IMF? blank....Tu aah jana phir, F10 Mcdonalds apney khabotar ley.
AC mein beta sao raha hai on 220 million awam's money, enjoying, or should i deliever a pizza in your Pindi Cantonment now for you to enjoy more.
What most people do not realize is that faltering economy is a national security threat to existence of Pakistan. Economy is what powers defence budget of Pakistan.
Everybody knows that India and Afghanistan are national security threat to safety of Pakistan but no one connects the dots that weak economy in Pakistan is almost as big a national security threat as India and Afghanistan.
Yes I was going through the budget document last night, its long...fck sake $40 billion loan taken from 2018 to 2021 and out of $40 billion, $27 billion Pakistan has to pay back in loan interest, rest $10 billion reserve and 3$ billion left to use in 4 years. Where have we got ourselves in. This is what our Military DONOT understand, 0 understanding of economics, taxes, manufacturing and use of 220m Human resources. Atleast if the Military waste is stopped, lavish expenditures, extra foreign trips of no use, and cut down by Army it will be a leading example for the country and a lot of money is saved.
No you must be more dumb to understand 72 years of history.
What I know is each Pakistani including Overseas Pakistanis have a loan of almost 2 lakh on each shoulder. Who is going to payback this????? Defaulters....cannot hide can you?
The issue with these idiots like Rafi and T/T is they have a tunnel vision, Armed Forces will grow till judgement day as they stated, devoid of understanding what are we gonna do with a USSR type army without an economy and nothing to feed 220 million Pakistanis and exact plans to increase our GDP. When you ask them how Military machine is run and fed? Nil.
One thing military could do is kill 2 birds with 1 stone.
Pakistan must kill dead SUPARCO and start fresh, create a new military space agency and breathe some life into it. Start hiring scientists and researchers across Pakistan like crazy to pump up hypersonic and space research. Do the same thing for cyber, drone, and missile fields, create new military research agencies and start hiring people across Pakistan to do this research for military. Then Pakistan will increase economy and defence at the same time.
Thats the sad deliema of Pakistan...pinched the hardest nerve since last 70 years....Military can provide security only cannot provide jobs to 220m, it cannot be a manufacturing hub. Progress and Economic growth is done by Government Officers, when Military takes the chunk of money, 100 civilian companies run by Army, and then take the largest chunk of Budget too.....sorry but truth is Pakistan soon will head to default and its not too long. Alot of problems are clearly existing in the power structure of Pakistan.
I hope somebody can wake the hell up and switch Pakistan's defence strategy from conventional to asymmetric. It will decrease expenses and increase deterrence. We should have done this years ago, someone needs to slap some sense into military planners so they can realize how badly they have screwed up by neglecting asymmetric. Some major structural and hierarchy shakeup is necessary to loosen up rigid military structure because asymmetric is completely 180 opposite mindset of thinking than our current stack of rigid generals who cannot think outside the conventional box. Most likely all top military leaders will have to be fired or be asked to resign if they do not implement asymmetric strategy.
It's a fact that it's not working. We have snakes ruling our great state. I would say we need a powerful independent technocratic group of people who can make the long term policy of our government. Let the political parties go to elections and get elected, the main policies should be made by the technocratic people who could make policies for 50years and keep amending them as new challenges emerge, then let the government implement it. One problem is when we change government after 5 years, the new government takes a new direction, then after 5 years a new direction. We are suffering alot because of this.
I have been saying this forever. This is really a problem with democracy, there is no stability. Everything gets reset every 5 years and this is a nightmare in such an unstable region where long-term strategic planning is crucial. Gov't needs to be able to set aside 5 year reset somehow and focus on a long-term strategy that cannot be changed every 5 years.
Maybe the solution is to create some new independent autonomous body in Pakistan that creates an official 20 year long-term defence strategy that all political parties must agree to. So regardless of who wins elections every 5 years, defence strategy is consistent, stable, and allowed to mature over time without interruption every few years.
Selective pick and choose does not work. Dont fall in this trap of military budget. We need a strong army just like we need a strong economy. A strong economy will not survive without strong military. There are too many security challenge in the region. In fact, what we spend on military is less than what we should be spending. But for that we need strong economy.
Fully agree, weak economy as equal to or bigger threat to Pakistan's national security than India and Afghanistan because economy is what powers defence budget.
Nobody cried for the army to come. The army had to sort this stuff because they were the people that created these extremists in the first place during the 80s. So if army was killing them they werent doing anyone any favour because these people were the creation of the same generals. The people of Pakistan had to suffer because of these FA pass duffer generals .
Completely agree
Sometimes the bowl the soup is in is hotter than the soup itself
