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The state that wouldn't fail

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a state that wouldn't fail :cheers:
but why did it have to go so down in the first place,i doesnt have as much poverty,lack of toilets,diversity,etc as much as its neighbour india
 
This is not the thread. I will expose your pretensions on a suitable thread if I need to.

You are sickening BTW. On the one hand you call Indians haters and then show what you are made of.

Don't bother, you've exposed yourself time and time again...
 
The state in peril

Editorial
Published in The Express Tribune, March 23rd, 2011.

After 64 years as an independent state, Pakistan is a troubled republic like many post-colonial states in Africa and many older ones in the Islamic world. What sets it apart, however, is the level of terrorism being experienced by its population. What is more, Pakistan is stereotypical of the states that misdiagnose their troubles and seem to act against their own interests. At no point in its history was Pakistan more besieged with crises challenging its very existence than now. Intra-state conflict has grown in Pakistan as a consequence of the strategic decisions taken towards the end of the 20th century to rely on asymmetric war through proxy warriors. These paved the way for the debilitation of state authority through a sharing of its monopoly of violence with its chosen non-state actors. While external sovereignty is a myth, internal sovereignty is essential to the survival of the state. The creation of ungoverned spaces inside Pakistan in order to facilitate the extraction of non-state actors became a norm rather that the exception.

The result of this policy of ungoverned spaces’ has been the re-establishment of Pakistan’s Tribal Areas in the north as the domain of terrorism, with domination of adjacent administered territory, including Peshawar, the headquarters of the Khyber-Pakhtunkhwa province. What Pakistan finds difficult to defend today is its claim on North Waziristan, where foreigners raise terrorist warriors to attack across the border as well as deep inside the country, from Peshawar and Islamabad to Karachi. It is also difficult to deny that the Tribal Areas, where the Pakistan army is fighting a fluctuating battle with the likes of Mangal Bagh, are also the place of muster for the Talibanised Punjabi youths supplied by jihadi militias.

Although the Punjab government is at pains to deny that Punjabis can be Taliban, the fact is that, in sheer numbers, the Punjabis now found among the ranks of the terrorists fielded by al Qaeda could be more than the Pakhtuns. This estimate is based on the observation that Pakhtuns seem to be more Talibanised, not because they believe in the extreme al Qaeda world view, but because they live under the informal governance of the terrorists and have to follow their decree. The Punjabi terrorist first believes in the creed of terror, then undertakes the journey out of his province.

This March 23 is perhaps the gloomiest because we have opposed terrorism inflicted on us by al Qaeda with a self-destructive extremism of our own. Add to this the misdiagnosis that terrorism against Pakistan is being orchestrated by America, India and Israel, to target and destroy our nuclear weapons. The clergy has been agitating in favour of a flawed man-made law and has succeeded in indoctrinating ordinary Pakistanis and state employees in favour of killing people they suspect of insulting the Holy Prophet (pbuh). The example of the arrest and acquittal of CIA contractor Raymond Davis has demonstrated that the people are not willing to follow the extreme prescriptions of the religious parties when they refuse to stage a ‘revolution’ against the government.

After 64 years, Pakistan is waking up to its India-obsessive strategy and is gradually rejecting the ‘security state’ paradigm that has caused crippling wars that have not benefitted the country. If the military still wants to adhere to this paradigm, it may find itself isolated in the face of the mainstream political parties, the PML-N and the PPP, who wish to change it. As 2011 rolls on, Pakistan is economically hamstrung by a chronic energy shortage, state corporations that supply basic amenities verging on bankruptcy, and a private sector paralysed by law and order problems. Normally, this is the time to wake up and change tack.

As Pakistan thinks of solutions, it must first realise that any measures adopted must be rationally acceptable inside Pakistan as well as to the world outside. The most worrying sign is Pakistan’s international isolation as it tackles its disorder. The year 2011 could be crucial because this year the military establishment might well break from its past pattern and save the country by not exploiting the internecine national politics of the day.
 
WASHINGTON DIARY: The military’s risky game

Daily Times
Dr Manzur Ejaz
March 23, 2011

It is likely that Pakistan’s military and intelligence agencies have been involved in whipping up the Raymond Davis case and then getting him released on quasi-legal grounds. Now, the military has put its foot down to stop drone attacks after several years of silent acquiescence. The push-back against the Americans could be a smokescreen to attract the anti-American fervour of the nation’s public and eventually enter North Waziristan (NW), but the rhetoric may further empower the religious right and extremist groups.

Pakistan’s ‘deep state’ — that is what some people have started calling the sum total of the military and its agencies — has been playing the anti-American game through the religious right and wandering patriots like Imran Khan to pursue its policy objectives. Seemingly, the strategy has worked in the short-run but the monster of religious extremism and irrational nationalism has been growing and taking on a life of its own.

It is reasonable to assume the highest levels of US leadership would have contacted the Pakistan military’s top brass and ISI chief to have Raymond Davis released immediately after his arrest. Obviously, not only did the military refuse to intervene but it also prompted its media auxiliaries to hype up the matter. Jamaat-e-Islami, Jamiat-e-Ulema-e-Islam (JUI) and other religious parties, keen to provide some kind of political cover to the Taliban and other jihadi groups, picked up the issue and created anti-American street hysteria in Pakistan. Arguably, the deep state may have done this to assert itself against its American partners, some cynics saying this was a ploy to get more money.

The sudden release of Raymond Davis has probably come after the outstanding issues were resolved. We know what amount of diyat (blood money) was paid to Fahim and Faizan’s families but we have no information on what the deep state got in return. We do not want to belabour this point too much because the Pakistan military may have very genuine issues that the US was not listening to, and using the Raymond Davis card meant protecting the state’s interests. But, immediately after the Davis deal, the US foolishly caused the death of citizens who were holding a jirga in Datta Khel. Pakistan’s military chief reacted sharply and, according to recent reports, the Pakistan Air Force (PAF) has begun patrolling the Pak-Afghan border to repulse future drone attacks.

Pakistan’s military may have been genuinely angered by US ungratefulness; the dust from the Raymond Davis case has not yet cleared and the US has bombed citizens in an area where anti-Americanism is already a serious threat to the establishment. However, it is hard to believe that Pakistan will begin shooting down US drones to stop the attacks that it has silently condoned and cooperated with for years. Due to economic and other needs, Pakistan is not in a position to alienate the US to the extent that it is perceived as a hostile force.

In all probability, the Pakistani military is getting ready to go into NW and take charge instead of leaving it to the drone attacks. Before heavy deployment in NW, Pakistan’s military wants to win over the common people of that area through assuming the mantle of anti-American rhetoric for which it was using the religious right brigade in the past. Furthermore, the US logistically cannot use drone attacks in NW once the Pakistan military has a heavy presence in that area. Such factors lead us to believe that the patrolling of the Pak-Afghan border by the PAF is a precursor for a South Waziristan-like military operation in NW.

The Pakistan military has to cleanse NW whether it likes it or not. However, the question is how long it can afford to assume to leadership of anti-America rhetoric. Probably not for long and, eventually, it will be inclined to revert back to the religious jihadi brigade to keep the US on its toes. This is what the deep state is accustomed to, but it has a price: each time an-anti American spell is created, the religious right becomes stronger and bolder. It may not have fatally bitten the deep state directly but it has created havoc with Pakistan’s economy.

In the years prior to these recent developments, the Pakistan Army has maintained that it could not send troops on the ground in NW because it would be an overextension of their forces. This fact, along with the figures of the thousands of young Pakistani soldiers who have died fighting against extremism, should not just be rhetoric for the Pakistan Army, but a sign that their plan has backfired. This plan has always been to utilise the religious right wing to drum up sentiments that favour the shortsighted goals of the military, not the nation as a whole. Indeed, the nation has suffered greatly due to this myopic view of governance. The military must realise that using chips like Raymond Davis to create public support will only hurt their long-term survival and empower their enemies.

Furthermore, if Pakistan’s economy keeps on tanking due to religious extremism while India, China and the rest of the region keep on growing, how can Pakistan pretend to be a genuine and recognisable regional power of the kind that the deep state is obsessed with? Put simply, who, from inside or outside the country, will invest in a religiously intolerant nation? One can afford Salafi Islam and other forms of theocracy if one has oil reserves like Saudi Arabia and Iran. However, if livelihood is going to come from human efforts then the deep state had better start thinking about how the religious brigade affects this process and whether it is appropriate to use it for policy goals in the future.
 
some corroboration of the above, from a thread on this forum about the arrest of a terrorist attempting to attack Majlis, -- just another day in the life:


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Re: Attack on Parliament Foiled; Terrorist Arrested: Police
Almost , dua kabool ho gai but pakra giya , neek kaam kerne ja raha tha koi

If you fail the first time try , try and try again , and I qoute
 
Pakistan on a shrink’s couch

Dawn
Irfan Husain
Mar 26 2011

DIAGNOSING the mental health of a nation is just as tricky as diagnosing an individual with a personality disorder.

But while psychiatrists are trained and experienced in treating their patients, few venture to turn a clinical gaze towards the inner demons that trouble a state`s psyche.

Breaking with this tradition, Dr Mubarik Haider has performed a valuable service by peering into the innermost recesses of the collective Pakistani mind. His diagnosis is something some of us had long suspected, but had rarely articulated so clearly. Speaking at a lecture (Pakistan — a state on the crossroads: causes and effects) organised by the Pakistan Writers Association in collaboration with two media organisations recently, the psychiatrist spelled out his thesis with an enviable lack of hyperbole.

Displaying more brutal frankness than doctors normally use when spelling out a medical condition to their patients, Dr Haider pulled no punches. According to a newspaper report on the lecture, he urged Pakistanis to escape their state of denial and face reality. He asked them to reflect on the fact that perhaps “most of the world`s current revulsion towards Pakistan was based on good reasons, instead of it being the result of a vast Zionist conspiracy”.

I have long written about the state of denial most Pakistanis are in. From government ministers and officials to the public to the media, we are all convinced that everybody is out to get Pakistan. Whether it`s the floods that ravaged large swathes of the country last year, or the spectre of Islamic terrorism stalking the land, it`s all somebody else`s fault.

When I wrote to condemn the Pakistani terrorists who had planned and carried out the Mumbai massacre in 2008, I was flooded with emails from angry readers demanding to know what proof I had to link Pakistan with the attack. For them, the confession of the sole survivor of the gang of killers was not enough. How did the armed band slip into Mumbai so easily? Why did it take the Indian authorities so long to intervene effectively? To conspiracy theorists, all these questions pointed to a secret Indian plot to malign Pakistan.

The report on the lecture summarises Dr Haider`s argument thus: “Most people know at least one person who seems to suffer from a never-ending persecution complex. This individual is convinced that everybody is out to get him and declines from reconsidering his opinion despite a heap of evidence to the contrary. He dreams up wild and fantastic conspiracies that others have plotted against him and interprets every action with deep suspicion.

“To substantiate his view, he believes that there must be something about him that others are jealous of or desire or covet. Perhaps inevitably, he eventually becomes incapable of civilised dealing. Others are forced to resort to confrontation, avoidance or desertion. Vain to the last, he refuses to consider that something may be wrong with himself after all. He is simply incapable of one thing: critical self-reflection.”

Over the years, this paranoia and persecution complex have grown to dominate the public discourse. Indeed, these maladies now inform the thinking of policymakers as well. When I have asked well-educated people why the world should be against us, I get answers like “The Americans want to neutralise our nuclear arsenal”. Or, “Blackwater is behind the suicide bombings in Pakistan to destabilise the country”.

They refuse to see that a strong, stable Pakistan is in everybody`s interest, or that we are largely responsible for what`s happening in and around the country.

Indeed, our problems have reached such vast proportions that we find it easier to pretend they are somebody else`s fault rather than dealing with them. And America, being the biggest player in the region, is the most convenient scapegoat. The subtext in blaming Washington for all our ills is this: if a superpower is against us, obviously we cannot resist. This absolves our leaders of the need to tackle our urgent problems of hunger, illiteracy, unemployment and disease.

Dr Haider is of the view that “Pakistan exhibits all the symptoms of a schizophrenic society embroiled in innumerable conflicts”. He blames state institutions, the political and religious leadership and media organisations of “further fomenting a culture of conflict and paranoia by irresponsibly perpetuating myths about the world”.

These myths are on display in Pakistan round the clock on TV where anchors and their self-important guests hold forth on a large number of conspiracy theories. In this warped worldview, everything from a defeat in cricket to a natural disaster is somebody else`s fault.

Perhaps nobody is as responsible for feeding our paranoia and our state of denial than our TV channels. Our anchors invariably duck their responsibility of critically examining all the claims and charges flying around the studios. Instead, they fuel this madness by browbeating those few guests who refuse to take part in this orgy of unfounded accusations against dark forces inimical to Pakistan.

This mindset is also ever-present on the Internet where all manner of conspiracy theories multiply like malign viruses. When the devastating floods hit Pakistan last year, I received many emails accusing a new American technology known as HAARP for triggering the unusually heavy monsoon rains. These paranoid bloggers completely ignored the fact that the Americans were by far the biggest donors in the relief efforts, and sent in a large number of helicopters to take food and medicine to stranded communities, and rescue thousands of people.

So much for the diagnosis. What`s the cure? The hallmark of an educated mind is the ability to analyse problems coolly and rationally. An emotional response is usually the wrong one. But our minds are conditioned by years of slogans and clichés, as well as historical baggage that is no longer relevant. The disconnect between reality and our twisted perceptions grows by the day.

We could start by asking ourselves a simple question: why should the rest of the world be against us? Who would possibly gain by Pakistan`s dismemberment? Such an event would be hugely dangerous and destabilising for the entire region. Indeed, the spectre of a failed and broken Pakistan haunts security establishments the world over.

So let`s open our eyes to reality and face the world as it really is, and not how our tortured dreams have made it out to be.
 
^^ Pretty articulate about something that most people know by now.

There are others who suffer from this affliction, I doubt they do to the same degree.

Till you don't diagnose correctly, there is no cure.

Even if you diagnose correctly, till you accept it there is no cure.
 
^^ Pretty articulate about something that most people know by now.

There are others who suffer from this affliction, I doubt they do to the same degree.

Till you don't diagnose correctly, there is no cure.

Even if you diagnose correctly, till you accept it there is no cure.

Making fancy comparisons in an English language newspaper would not make any difference to the common man, be it in Pakistan, India or Nepal, as they don't understand the language. The problem with such columns is that they are largely preaching the converted.

Personally comparing Pakistanis to schizephrenics is being unfair to the schizophrenics. They are the way they are because they lack absolute insight. We do not lack that.

The vital question though is hw does one get rid of the state of denial that one is? In fact, how does the person who is not ina state of denial make a person who is in state of denial that he is in one? Pretty tricky.
 
Making fancy comparisons in an English language newspaper would not make any difference to the common man, be it in Pakistan, India or Nepal, as they don't understand the language. The problem with such columns is that they are largely preaching the converted.

Well, if this forum is anything to go by, I don't think knowledge of English takes away the propensity for believing in or creating conspiracy theories.

So the difference is of degree only. I would assume the Urdu media reader would be a bigger believer in these theories for obvious reasons.

Don't they translate these into the Urdu editions? I thought most major newspapers have a Urdu edition as well.

Personally comparing Pakistanis to schizephrenics is being unfair to the schizophrenics. They are the way they are because they lack absolute insight. We do not lack that.

I don't think people like you were the target of that part. Regarding the "target audience" for that phrase, let me quote your Dr. Hoodbhoy again. He explains it better than I can.

Psychologists say that even hard facts can be denied when people subscribe to a radically different vision of the world. A glimpse of the current Pakistani weltanschauung – the mental makeup which selects and filters facts before they reach the conscious brain – can be had through the lives of the three young US-educated Pakistanis mentioned above..."

Why Do They Pick On Us Pakistanis? - Chowk: India Pakistan Ideas Identities.com

So it is not necessarily a question of lacking facts or insights, it is of filtering out what seems inconvenient.

The vital question though is hw does one get rid of the state of denial that one is? In fact, how does the person who is not ina state of denial make a person who is in state of denial that he is in one? Pretty tricky.

It is tricky yet simple. Let me give an analogy that I read in a book by Gurcharan Das on Indian economy. Sorry its a bit off-topic but I guess this explains the concept.

He was discussing about the prevalence of high poverty rates in India before the reforms started and why so may people "failed". As per him, in any society 10%-15% people will always succeed irrespective of the system. 10%-15% will always "fail". It is the middle 70%-80% that can succeed or fail depending on whether your system acts as an enabler or disabler.

These people will pull themselves up to succeed if we could create an enabling system (as happens in West and some other successful economies), else they will join the "failures".

So coming back to your question, there will always be some who will be in denial and there will always be some who will see the reality. There is a large segment in between that can see the reality if the conspiracy theories were not so mainstream in Pakistan.
 
Don't they translate these into the Urdu editions? I thought most major newspapers have a Urdu edition as well.

He was discussing about the prevalence of high poverty rates in India before the reforms started and why so may people "failed". As per him, in any society 10%-15% people will always succeed irrespective of the system. 10%-15% will always "fail". It is the middle 70%-80% that can succeed or fail depending on whether your system acts as an enabler or disabler.

These people will pull themselves up to succeed if we could create an enabling system (as happens in West and some other successful economies), else they will join the "failures".

So coming back to your question, there will always be some who will be in denial and there will always be some who will see the reality. There is a large segment in between that can see the reality if the conspiracy theories were not so mainstream in Pakistan.

Nope, they don't get translated into Urdu.

The two sections are largelt divorced from each other.

Yes, and how do we make someone see right when they think they are already seeing right?
 
Nope, they don't get translated into Urdu.

The two sections are largelt divorced from each other.

Yes, and how do we make someone see right when they think they are already seeing right?

As I said, you can never convince some.

However, a large majority would get away from this habit, if it is not mainstream. If it is not part of the textbooks, political discourse and in mainstream media. People have a lot of trust in the medium and it makes the theories credible.

I am not sure what one can do as an individual except not falling prey to it oneself. May be play the part in opposing the conditions that cause it to happen in the first place.
 
As I said, you can never convince some.

However, a large majority would get away from this habit, if it is not mainstream. If it is not part of the textbooks, political discourse and in mainstream media. People have a lot of trust in the medium and it makes the theories credible.

I am not sure what one can do as an individual except not falling prey to it oneself. May be play the part in opposing the conditions that cause it to happen in the first place.

Which brings us to a question that I often ask: how does a Third World, under-developed country ask it denizens to improve? How does a nation realise that there is a long term than a short term, how does anyone get rid of bad habits?

Secondly, how does one increase the minuscule and right-wing middle class to a substantial chunk with moderate (not liberal, leftist) leanings?
 
Let get out of this false perception created by some hippe journalists high on cold war era propaganda and afghan contraband.
Considering the ripples India and even Bangladesh is making around the political circles..Pakistan is ALREADY failed!! Election of incompetent and unable leaders like Zardari & Party are wide open proof of Pakistan's descend towards failure.
 
Which brings us to a question that I often ask: how does a Third World, under-developed country ask it denizens to improve? How does a nation realise that there is a long term than a short term, how does anyone get rid of bad habits?

Secondly, how does one increase the minuscule and right-wing middle class to a substantial chunk with moderate (not liberal, leftist) leanings?

Wow, these are real tough questions. Not sure there is a silver bullet answer or a short term solution.

May be a visionary leadership, accountable and strong credible institutions and economic growth that gives people hope can kick-start this slow process. May be you have some better answers. Will be great to know your own thoughts.
 
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