THE SAD STORY OF THE REJECTION OF SCIENCE

[Turingsage]

The biggest damage that colonials did to the Muslim world was separation of non-religious studies/sciences from the madrasa system. This needs to be put back together so that madrasas don't produce useless nutcase molvies.

Thats a pathetic excuse of a lie. You have had 75 years to change what you blame the British for. The Brits did not impose a madrasa system. You did and YOU insisted on primacy of religious education to the exclusion of science.

 

[_NOBODY_]

The biggest damage that colonials did to the Muslim world was separation of non-religious studies/sciences from the madrasa system. This needs to be put back together so that madrasas don't produce useless nutcase molvies.

It has been 75 years since we gained independence so why are you still blaming the Brits for our current problems?

 

[TheSolution]

You completely misunderstood his point. He stated that we Pakistanis twist Islam to justify our wrongdoings and this is 100% true. The traditional values of Pakistan are mostly dog sh*t. Our traditional values have f**k all to do with Islam, we still carry so many pre-Islamic traditions with us. Also, where did @SQ8 and @VCheng even remotely criticize Islam? Our values are as far away from Islam as possible. Corruption, theft, lying, blaming others for your own problems, cheating, bribery, fraud, jealousy, showing off, backbiting, associating partners with Allah while calling yourself Muslims, and oppressing others are integral values of your average Pakistani. I see them every single day here in Lahore, things are just as bad elsewhere in the country if not worse. I am surprised that Allah hasn't punished us more.

What's worse is that these are difficult things to weed out culturally from society.

We should start by introducing the rule of law and having strict consequences.

 

[_NOBODY_]

What's worse is that these are difficult things to weed out culturally from society.

We should start by introducing the rule of law and having strict consequences.

Who will enforce these laws? Government officers are the worst. Here's an example, one can get away with committing a traffic violation by bribing the officer. The only way to significantly decrease this is by becoming a police state like China.

 

[TheSolution]

Who will enforce these laws? Government officers are the worst. Here's an example, one can get away with committing a traffic violation by bribing the officer. The only way to significantly decrease this is by becoming a police state like China.

Yep I've heard it's that bad. Honestly everyone needs to be whipped or something to fix up. An accountability system that has severe consequences if found guilty must be put into place. How shameful that those who claim to be the custodians of Islam are corrupt to the core.

 

[epebble]

Not all but certainly a large section of society have. Just look at the kind of indoctrination that some "clerics" put kids through. Of course we have ulema who negate such ridiculous ideas but it's safe to say many feel that they can simply ignore scientific evidence.

The author could have saved much effort by just linking to that video. It is criminal that these clerics are destroying what little curiosity the kids have and filling it with absurdities.

 

[AlKardai]

It honestly just starts with a mindset of responsibility and patriotism.

Responsibility for the environment and the country needs to be instilled into the youth.
This way, economic growth will be more possible as people will aid the state whilst achieving things academically.

We should also focus on changing the intellectual mindset of the awam into a growth Mindset. This should be done by questioning ideals that people disagree with and questioning things that they do not understand about society or religion. But there are two sides of this spectrum. Those with intellectual authority should also be prepared enough to deal with these questions, and should only be appointed to their positions based upon achievements.

Achievements in intellectual fields are obvious, but achievements in religious fields should include the processes of changing the mindset of people and to establish tolerance within society- tolerance for other religions and ideals. Unity between communities could also be labelled as an achievement

From there, you can build a sense loyalty towards the state, which will automatically lead to a decrease in corruption, if it is labelled as betrayal.

A solid welfare (transport, job security, healthcare) structure should be created for the poor. This way, their loyalty towards the state will increase as well as them educating their children better on morals such as responsibility, dignity and respect.


The basis of a welfare state relies upon gaining a high amount of wealth. Whilst the economy is in the toilet, the dream welfare state will not be created. And this is why we need Imran Khan

 

[Enigma SIG]

Yep I've heard it's that bad. Honestly everyone needs to be whipped or something to fix up. An accountability system that has severe consequences if found guilty must be put into place. How shameful that those who claim to be the custodians of Islam are corrupt to the core.

The average Pakistani needs chittar parade 5 times a day.

 

[epebble]

You completely misunderstood his point. He stated that we Pakistanis twist Islam to justify our wrongdoings and this is 100% true. The traditional values of Pakistan are mostly dog sh*t. Our traditional values have f**k all to do with Islam, we still carry so many pre-Islamic traditions with us. Also, where did @SQ8 and @VCheng even remotely criticize Islam? Our values are as far away from Islam as possible. Corruption, theft, lying, blaming others for your own problems, cheating, bribery, fraud, jealousy, showing off, backbiting, associating partners with Allah while calling yourself Muslims, and oppressing others are integral values of your average Pakistani. I see them every single day here in Lahore, things are just as bad elsewhere in the country if not worse. I am surprised that Allah hasn't punished us more.

I think the author is just trying to argue that there is a lack of scientific temper in Pakistan. It is not a litany of wows of all that is wrong with the nation. Many of the issues the author discusses are common to other Islamic countries too, there is no need to flagellate Pakistan alone for those sins. The author is clearly arguing that literal interpretation of religious texts, as shown in that video where a cleric is injecting stupidity into young minds he is 'educating', is the cause of this backwardness.

If it is any consolation, this is not a unique problem of Islam, Western civilization also went through this trauma during the renaissance period when scientific knowledge against scriptures was disfavored. Galileo and others were punished for saying earth is not the center of the universe. More recently, Darwin's theory of evolution was bitterly criticized for being opposed to scripture for saying man (along with all life forms) is a product of evolution, yes, may even be from primates (apes) and not created by God as a perfect Homo Sapiens. Even now, as recently as 1990s, in San Diego, California a school district was being pressured by some parents to teach 'Intelligent Design" (codewords for biblical theory of Genesis) along with evolution. Fortunately, it was voted down.

 

[SQ8]

Just say it and stop holding it in your chest you have something against someone's personal beliefs and that is not sitting right with you. You are making it seem like science and Islam have some kind of ancient enmity that's preventing science from gaining a foothold let me put it simply the day you put more emphasis on learning and not dumb theories that day will be your EID.

Traditional values and religion is what holds a community together look at the western world they have become pioneers in knowledge yet at the same time the average Joe is a depressed baboon you know why because values and beliefs mean nothing to them the society is in a steep decline where people like andrew tate are becoming their heroes enough said.


Go on genius name the core problems but don't go on a rant about Islam and XYZ traditions id like to see where the fault lines lie.

The thing is most so-called woke liberalgandus don't know their arse from their elbows yet you see them giving lectures on SOCIETAL problems. Please enlighten us on the problems.

Im not holding anything back - what makes you think your Pakistani traditions have remotely anything to do with Islam?
Where does not allowing girls by to study by many households in Pakistan Islamic?
Where is having ten halwa khor humans figuring out where the moon is when the entire phases are known Islamic?
Where is cousin marriages, tribal racism Islamic?

You have lied to yourself that your Pakistani traditions rotting away are somehow derived from Islam and therefore sacred.

The rest of your post is the usual hypocrite whataboutism defense? What does Andrew tate have to do with Pakistan?
What does SUPARCO’s decline have to with Islam? Hoodboy is outlining the academic reasons but you are an ignoramus and can only run to your knee jerk defense of “Islam is in danger”

Your entire leadership corrupt, academic system in doldrums which is all because of mediocrity, nepotism and ethnofascist ideals - did those come from Islam which you defend so?

Or, as suspected you went all in for Hoodboy without even reading the context, without even looking at the text because he wrote some other stuff (which I likely don’t agree with) only because you needed to defend your “Islam”.

That who is a Pakistani, will oogle at women and pass pithy comments but let his sister ask to go to university and “Deen Khatray mein hai”

Deen Khatray mein nahin hai magar ziada tar Pakistanio ke liye deen sirf Khatnay mein hai

When focus is only on DHA then sciences can go take a hike. It's not about Islam vs Liberalism. Hoodboy conveniently forgets all Muslim contributions to science in the golden ages.

Great - those people are dead and will inshallah be in Jannah.
And also, none of them were Pakistanis.

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

This man is a distraction.. the real issue with science and education in pakistan are the corrupt civilian governments of past.. and the corrupt minds we have as a society..

 

[Maula Jatt]

This man is a distraction.. the real issue with science and education in pakistan are the corrupt civilian governments of past.. and the corrupt minds we have as a society..

 

[-blitzkrieg-]

Yes dear.. you can't just make Mullah a scapegoat..

 

[imadul]

How could we progress in S&T, when Muslims reject Theory of Evolution without understanding it.

When Darwin first presented his Theory of Evolution in his book “On the Origin of Species, he was blamed he plagiarized it from Muslims, it was called Mohammadn Theory.
Now guess! Who first presented the real theory of evolution?
He was an Arab Biologist, author, scientist, and researcher.

Free lunch from me whi gets his name

 

[AlKardai]

How could we progress in S&T, when Muslims reject Theory of Evolution without understanding it.

When Darwin first presented his Theory of Evolution in his book “On the Origin of Species, he was blamed he plagiarized it from Muslims, it was called Mohammadn Theory.
Now guess! Who first presented the real theory of evolution?
He was an Arab Biologist, author, scientist, and researcher.

Free lunch from me whi gets his name

AL JAHIZ!!!