The People's Republic of Scandal - TIME cover

[Battle of Bach Dang River]

Here is a good article for everyone...

The Great Fall of China - Businessweek

These episodes have revealed to the world—and to a sizable portion of the Chinese people—a culture of greed, violence, and deceit at the highest levels of government. The Communists’ power is not in imminent danger, but their legitimacy is.

So-called mass incidents—riots, strikes, and protests—doubled in five years, to 180,000 in 2010, according to Sun Liping, a sociologist at Beijing’s Tsinghua University.

China already has inequality comparable to the Philippines and Russia and is far less egalitarian than Japan, the U.S., and even Eastern Europe, according to Li Shi, an economist at Beijing Normal University. The top 10 percent of urban Chinese earn about 23 times that of the poorest 10 percent, according to official figures—which are almost certainly understated. Even those whose lives have improved resent those who have climbed even higher by milking the system.

Hu’s “Harmonious Society” campaign, which he initiated in 2005, has curdled into something unwholesome. Harmony has become a synonym for uniformity, obedience, and censorship. In a dig at Hu’s slogan, Chinese whose electronic communications have been blocked or bleeped joke that they have been “harmonized.”

...economist Daron Acemoglu and political scientist James Robinson predict that China’s economic miracle will fade because the security-obsessed government will continue to resist the creative destruction that is crucial to innovation,...

Of about 300 U.S. companies surveyed last November and December by the American Chamber of Commerce in China for its 2012 annual report, 79 percent said enforcement of intellectual property rights was ineffective, up from 70 percent in last year’s report.

Investors are starting to act on their words. In March, foreign direct investment into China fell about 6 percent from a year earlier, the fifth straight month of decline. That was the longest streak of monthly declines since 2009, when the financial crisis caused multinationals to slow overseas investment. China doesn’t depend on money from abroad, but it does require the technology and know-how that foreign multinationals bring.

If CCP facing many internal problems inside China, it is also a real threat to its neighbors. To do "orient public opinion" of the Chinese people, CCP will seek to "export" internal problems to foreign countries. How do? CCP will have statement loudly that the countries around are infringing "territory" of China, and now it is time to Chinese get back "territory" of China... CCP will send warships to threaten its neighbors. Scarborough Shoal is now an example....

 

[gambit]

In fact, the name "People's republic..." is not true to the nature of a social one-party.
People don't have the right to vote leaders of their country as in the democratic society...
............................

The Sheeple's Republic...

 

[Battle of Bach Dang River]

Bo's scandal is just a small part knobbing of the iceberg of giants.

 

[Battle of Bach Dang River]

Back to the topic, relating to "Heroes is turning out to be a U.S. Diplomatic Compound" in the article, Chen:

The Washington Post: Chen says U.S. diplomats and friends are still barred from visiting him

BEIJING — Chen Guangcheng, the self-taught lawyer who has become the center of a diplomatic crisis between the United States and China, said Sunday that he has not been able to have a face-to-face meeting with American diplomats since Friday and that his friends and supporters, as well as journalists, are being barred from the hospital where he is confined.

Chen says U.S. diplomats, friends are still barred from visiting him - The Washington Post

 

[shuttler]

The case of Bo is a bad thing to have happened anywhere in developing countries. I am sure like kinds of scandals occur perhaps more frequently in india, less so in vietnam not because it doesn't have them but no one give too much of a damn to vietcongs until they turn nasty like what they are doing now in SCS.

The world is seeing more social unrests in last decade than anytime in history. China is not the only country that has the social issues of income disparity. Spain. France, uk, Greece .. are having strikes and riots every day perhaps if you put all the events into one single plate. The sum of their populations is a fraction of China's. Is the US out of all these where their own class struggle "Occupy Wall Street" is still raging on - another record in American history? india is peaceful with no social unrests, amen!

You know, I was thinking it was talking about us considering that we've more scams and corruption than China could ever put together.

I mean think about it; at least their leaders develop the country to some extent before taking bribes and stuff.. ours don't even do that.

wow, the drama queen in south asia who is sleeping with all kinds of men for over 60 years 24/7, 365 wakes up in the next morning saying she is still a vrigin!

The Sheeple's Republic...

exactly its the sheeple's republic of vietcongs! thank u!

 

[Great-M]

I have a question for MR. SHUTTER.
I am reading your posts from long time. When ever anything comes on the China you preffer to attack the source or the country of the poster. Why don't you defende the news on its value rather than to attack others ???
I am not flaming the things which are already hot. Just curacity.
It will be better defence if you prove the guy wrong and news wrong or accept. What's point in attacking others on the same line.

I personally don't hate china. But I kinda getting it hard to understand how showing Vietnam Nam/India/USA worst than Chian help your cause ??? Will it make China better ???
I am expecting a non troll answer. If not just igonare my comment. I am not interested in trolling

 

[northeast]

I have a question for MR. SHUTTER.
I am reading your posts from long time. When ever anything comes on the China you preffer to attack the source or the country of the poster. Why don't you defende the news on its value rather than to attack others ???
I am not flaming the things which are already hot. Just curacity.
It will be better defence if you prove the guy wrong and news wrong or accept. What's point in attacking others on the same line.

I personally don't hate china. But I kinda getting it hard to understand how showing Vietnam Nam/India/USA worst than Chian help your cause ??? Will it make China better ???
I am expecting a non troll answer. If not just igonare my comment. I am not interested in trolling

What's the point to prove trolls are trolling？

 

[Great-M]

What's the point to prove trolls are trolling？

Trolls will always troll no doubt. But trolling doesn't stand to the facts it's just imagination. Showing some reality will vaporise the troll not counter trolling.
I didn't read your comments that much as I have read of Mr. Shutter so I asked the questions. Don't get me wrong

 

[shuttler]

I have a question for MR. SHUTTER.
I am reading your posts from long time. When ever anything comes on the China you preffer to attack the source or the country of the poster. Why don't you defende the news on its value rather than to attack others ???
I am not flaming the things which are already hot. Just curacity.
It will be better defence if you prove the guy wrong and news wrong or accept. What's point in attacking others on the same line.

I personally don't hate china. But I kinda getting it hard to understand how showing Vietnam Nam/India/USA worst than Chian help your cause ??? Will it make China better ???
I am expecting a non troll answer. If not just igonare my comment. I am not interested in trolling

simple thing to answer troll! whenever there is an issue on China even no indian elements are involved, indian trumpeting trolls will most of the time group automatically in droves talking over the issue through trolling rubbish slanders libels whatever put-downs they would like to do as if their own country do not have the problems. Arguments have to draw examples and similarities. one of the best country that can be quoted as example for comparison, whether you like it or not, is india. indians are notoriously bad mouthing trolls on forums. so the natural subjects of counter arguments!

But I kinda getting it hard to understand how showing Vietnam Nam/India/USA worst than Chian help your cause ??? Will it make China better ???

if you can put forward this statement, can you ask yourself "by slamming China can you make india better? or anywhere nearly as good as China in vast majority of civilized indices?"

 

[Joe Shearer]

simple thing to answer troll! whenever there is an issue on China even no indian elements are involved, indian trumpeting trolls will most of the time group automatically in droves talking over the issue through trolling rubbish slanders libels whatever put-downsthey would like as if their own country do not have the problems. Arguments have to draw examples and similarities. the only country that can be quoted as example for comparison, whether you like it or not, is india. indians are notoriously bad mouthing trolls on forums. so the natural subjects of counter arguments!

So nobody has to admit fault, ever, anywhere, because somebody else has done it before? Or after?

Don't you feel this strategy is a little too obvious? Don't you feel even slightly stupid using it to defend yourself? Or are these misgivings not permitted to people's Internet warriors?

 

[shuttler]

So nobody has to admit fault, ever, anywhere, because somebody else has done it before? Or after?

Don't you feel this strategy is a little too obvious? Don't you feel even slightly stupid using it to defend yourself? Or are these misgivings not permitted to people's Internet warriors?

there is nothing about this troll! what I am saying is if you indian cheerleaders want to throw dirt at my country you should expect the dirts be thrown back to you! stupid!

 

[Great-M]

simple thing to answer troll! whenever there is an issue on China even no indian elements are involved, indian trumpeting trolls will most of the time group automatically in droves talking over the issue through trolling rubbish slanders libels whatever put-downs they would like to do as if their own country do not have the problems. Arguments have to draw examples and similarities. one of the best country that can be quoted as example for comparison, whether you like it or not, is india. indians are notoriously bad mouthing trolls on forums. so the natural subjects of counter arguments!



if you can put forward this statement, can you ask yourself "by slamming China can you make india better? or anywhere nearly as good as China in vast majority of civilized indices?"

No I didn't mean that. I personally don't troll but give hell of replies to trolls. But if anyone is sincere in question I reply honestly. If someone point out Indian economy is slowing I accept the fact I don't show them their economy unless they write the 2/3 % as our growth rate. If any one says commonwealth was a scam. It was. No doubt. We accept it.

Again it's a plain argument and NOT a intention of troll.
What I actually mean is if Mr. Bo is involved in currupt practices and is punished by your govt. you should explain your govts point of view. Don't you think that ???

there is nothing about this troll! what I am saying is if you indian cheerleaders want to throw dirt at my country you should expect the dirts be thrown back to you! stupid!

Calling someone stupid is not good idea when you know the same thing can came back to you.
I agree about the dirt thing. If anyone is throwing dirt to country you have full rights to return with interest. But why appy the same logic to honest questions and queries.
If ou don't want to ans those questions just ignore. I read mist of your posts. You seems knowledgable so I was expecting more constructive out put. We have more people for destructive work from all sides. We don't need more in that

 

[chauism]

Here is a good article for everyone...

The Great Fall of China - Businessweek

It is not even worth much replying. Just look at the comments left on the Businessweek is already showing the mentality of those people who are doing the cheerleading.

Farhang, 05/02/2012 11:13 PM

Why is it that the so called free and unbaised media always belittle and negative any anti establishment movement in the West specially in the USA and West despts such as Saudi Arabia,but always make a huge hype and show in positive light any anti establishment movement in China,Iran,Russia, etc

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Flag 59 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Mbeja Joseph, 05/04/2012 10:27 AM

It is amazing how we all predict doom to other countries and read catastophe's else where even when we are drowning. It is time the west learnt to respect other nations and accept that there is more that the West in this world.


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Flag 28 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Goh Lip, 05/03/2012 03:39 AM

If Bo's political power is strengthened, as was expected before his downfall, the west will say that it reflects China's corrupt, undemocratic, ruthless control of its population. Now that Bo met his deserved fate, the west will say, wait...the same thing! Now these Chinese keep saying the west just wants to belittle China, we all know that's not true, right?

As for the democracy, yes, the rulers of Greece, Italy are ruled by democratic means. Sure.....pinch me. And White House? Occupied by wall street, the same people who put these 'elected' people in Greece and Italy? Do Americans really feel their government is doing what the people want? Please wake up, an electoral process does not confer democracy nor exercise the will of its people. Otherwise, North Korea should be upheld as a paragon of democracy too. As Abraham Lincoln once said, "The care of life and happiness of its people is the sole legitimacy of governments." On this count, America loses out on 'dictatorial, autocratic' China.

As for human rights, please....I have enough nonsense for today.

For the Chinese, keep your dignity and your resolve. No point getting agitated by a crow pecking at your garden tree.

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Flag 41 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Jose Allan Tan, 05/03/2012 09:42 AM

Excuse accumulating weath in positions of power is no different than the wallstreet heads who get paid a fortune while ordinary employees lose their jobs or pension. The difference is Bo Xilai is facing disgrace. The CEOs in wallstreet got fat bonuses for driving their companies to the ground.

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Flag 29 people liked this. Like ReplyReply mc scrooge, 05/03/2012 09:10 PM

"a culture of greed, violence, and deceit"
That could also be said about some Western countries.


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Flag 22 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Wael S, 05/04/2012 03:55 AM

So many articles on China, yet how many can really understand China ?
Judge a 2000 year old country, with such rich history and culture.

Some 200 year old countries, with concepts of failing democracies want to impose themselves on a proven system.

China has been doing more than well, and will keep up.
The rise of China over the past 40 years has been thoroughly calculated by the Government.
The 5, 10 ,12 year plans have proven to be successful.

I would appreciate it, Western Media would be less interested in Chinese domestic political issues, and try to - at least - understand better Chinese History.

Best,

W

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Flag 17 people liked this. Like ReplyReply O_Pinion, 05/03/2012 01:40 AM

'China doesn’t depend on money from abroad, but it does require the technology and know-how that foreign multinationals bring'

Actually the Chinese are now bypassing the multinationals by just stealing technology at the source via internet hacking and overseas based Chinese working in host countries. The fact that the West built the internet that has aided this effort makes us look all the more stupid.


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Flag 22 people liked this. Like ReplyReply mc scrooge, 05/03/2012 09:11 PM

"a culture of greed, violence, and deceit"
I immediately thought about the GOP. China IS apparently becoming more like us.

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Flag 13 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Victor, 05/02/2012 11:23 PM

Well let's see what happens to China 5 years from now. Let me bet it, will continue growing and rising with some setbacks (political, economy etc) along the way. There are so many developmental milestones to fulfil. The same exaggerated, gloom and doom predictions by Gordon Chang and the likes dating decades still ring hollow till this day.

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Flag 17 people liked this. Like ReplyReply ageofknowledge, 05/03/2012 02:12 AM

China's not falling. It's blossoming... but at the expense of the U.S. middle and working classes who are falling into poverty.

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Flag 14 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Winderson, 05/03/2012 02:15 AM

China is heading where all controlled regimes ultimately end up. The mass revolts which spring up seemingly nowhere and will ultimately result in vast reforms or breakdown. Remember no one could have possibly thought that Soviet Union was going to collapse, it was standing tall and was a force to reckon with. And then just like that....

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Flag 13 people liked this. Like ReplyReply godfreeroberts, 05/03/2012 07:20 PM

The fall of Governor Rod Blagojevich did not threaten our government, even though its approval rating hovers around 9%.
Since the Chinese Government has a sustained approval rating of 85%-95% (depending upon whether we believe Pew, Edelman, or Harvard) my guess is that they are not exactly shaking in their boots.

It is WE who need to reform, on a massive scale, our governance policies and practices. We are being rapidly eclipsed by a well-governed country that is united socially, emotionally, and governmentally. Enough of this propagandistic nonsense. Do us some good by turning your talents and resources to examining the world as it is. Reality is intruding on us more forcefully every day. CCTV will soon become a media force to be reckoned with simply because they are hiring American journalists and encouraging them to report truthfully and professionally

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Flag 9 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Sandeep Saxena, 05/05/2012 11:40 AM

I think the name of the article should be "The Great Fall of Chinese Communist Party". And I agree CCP is falling - they can no more rule the people of China with power and deceit. The day CCP falls the whole world would celebrate including people of China. Chinese no more like the CCP - lakhs of people have quit CCP memberships in last few years.

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Flag 4 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Jose Allan Tan, 05/03/2012 09:44 AM

There are many others in political power in Asia who have amassed great wealth to the detriment of citizens... and those people remain unrepenting and unpunished.

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Flag 7 people liked this. Like ReplyReply 谷歌 王, 05/03/2012 12:45 AM

I think that the voice of the west didn't understand china clearly with great discrimination.

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Flag 6 people liked this. Like ReplyReply dark 8eyes, 05/04/2012 06:44 AM

Critics of the articles are actually telling us: "Just leave the killing of the Chinese People to the Chinese government. You don't understand how we do it here." lol.

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Flag 4 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Harry, 05/04/2012 05:01 AM

when you live in China for a long time,you will realize the truth

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Flag 3 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Alan Tracey Wootton, 05/03/2012 03:08 AM

O_Pinion says: "
The fact that the West built the internet that has aided this effort makes us look all the more stupid. "The internet is a 'tide that floats all boats'. The whole world is better off for it so there's no use complaining. The Chinese have 'the great firewall' and that is how they they hurt themselves (and how we, in the west, eventually win). It's too complex to explain here and I'm sad for the inadequacy of my words on this deep topic.

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Flag 3 people liked this. Like ReplyReply James, 05/03/2012 01:50 AM

Either propaganda material, or this this guy is just wishful.


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Flag 3 people liked this. Like ReplyReply Theron Smith, 05/04/2012 05:22 PM

This booard's near-unanimous equalization between China and the US in terms of corruption, human rights and effective economies is startling. It is common for young, uneducated college freshman to not know how to make distinctions, but this board purports to be on a higher plane. It's like a kid whose parents won't let them go out for the night and so they start comparing them to Hitler. China's human rights record is pathetic compared to the US. (And don't give me Oh Well Yeah What About, examples of less-than-perfect instances in the US. Overall, there is absolutely no comparison.) Chinese economic growth was dismal up until 15-20 years ago when they started adopting an economic model more like the US. They have strong growth because they have a low starting base, because they have so many people living in dire poverty that it doesn't take much of a move to raise per capita income, and because a managed economy always does well until the leaders make a mistake. Then it takes decades to get it right again.Remember the Soviet Union was for 20 years considered a serious economic threat to the US until..... Give me a free, flexible, agile economy anytime, and a country where people have freedom of speech, the vote and don't have the government telling them how many babies they can have. (Can you even believe that in a country that wants people to take it seriously as a human rights nation?!) Signing off from an imperfect but vastly superior location.

 

[Joe Shearer]

It is not even worth much replying. Just look at the comments left on the Businessweek is already showing the mentality of those people who are doing the cheerleading.

Nevertheless, it is replied in your post, and well-replied. If others had followed your example, and spoken about the defects in the article, rather than the defects in those who had raised it, this discussion would not have been this messy.

It is nice to see dignity return to the discussion. If you read post #101, I believe you will understand what I mean.

 

[VCheng]

Nevertheless, it is replied in your post, and well-replied. If others had followed your example, and spoken about the defects in the article, rather than the defects in those who had raised it, this discussion would not have been this messy.

It is nice to see dignity return to the discussion. If you read post #101, I believe you will understand what I mean.

GOLDEN WORDS!