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Windjammer

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We don’t see Pakistan speaking in one voice very often; different stakeholders react differently to a given situation depending upon their interest and political leaning. However, the killing of 24 Pakistani soldiers at the hands of Nato a few weeks ago united the Pakistani population in their collective grief. People sick and tired of the western design demanded in one voice a complete overhaul of the relationship with the US.

But this development has elicited varied reactions in India. Some vocal sections have reacted with glee at the discomfort of its western neighbour. Below is an excerpt from a blog published in the Hindustan Times on the Nato attck:

‘Normally, I feel strongly against such blatant violations of the sovereignty of independent nations. But, and only as an exception, I must confess, the US action is giving me immense pleasure.

Adding to my satisfaction, even unconcealed glee, is the decision of US President Barrack Obama not to tender an apology for the attack.


A respected colleague is aghast at my reaction. He accuses me of being intrinsically anti-Pakistani.

I’m not.

But I also don’t believe, even for a minute, that it (Pakistan) is a friendly country; that engagement with it is the best way forward for us; that a strong and stable Pakistan is in our best interest; and that we must do our bit to strengthen its democratically elected government and the civil society from which it draws its authority.

And that’s why I feel vindicated when the US gives Pakistan a solid hiding and a very visible black eye – something that the Indian government seems singularly incapable of doing.’

Those who are in the habit of seeing Islamabad with the prism of prejudice and paranoia are celebrating the humiliation of the Islamic republic. Most media debates and reports hover around “who is to be blamed” and “who is responsible” without focusing on the larger issue of such a blatant violation of the sovereignty of a nation and the impact of the presence of foreign powers in the region.

One section justifies it by saying “what goes around comes around” meaning that Pakistan is getting what it deserves. The problem is that such sick thought has many takers in this healthy democracy which prides itself as the voice of the third world countries.

Pakistan’s present trouble poses discomforting questions to us – how can, as an independent nation, we support intrusion into a sovereign country’s territory and pride? How far are we okay with the presence of western troops at our door step? Can we afford to be silent when the independence of our immediate neighbour is being violated so blatantly? Can we get away by being indifferent? Can our strategic proximity with the US guarantee us peace in the region?

These questions demand an answer which the present political and geo-strategic narrative can’t give. The answers to these questions also determine the long-term relationship between the two inseparable neighbours.

If six decades of the proximity with the US could not bring good to the people of Pakistan, how can we live in the false belief that New Delhi’s strategic friendship with Washington will serve the people of India better?

Bruce Riedel, a former CIA officer, who has been a senior advisor to four US presidents and a close aide of Obama on Afghanistan till 2009 in his recent book, “Deadly Embrace” writes:

The present plight of Pakistan is, therefore, a byproduct of its association with the western power. No doubt the army and the political leadership in Islamabad have also been playing in the hands of its ally. But more importantly, the USA played with the sentiments and fear of its South Asian ally. By posing as saviour of the country against the larger India, and by pretending to be its strongest ally the West nurtured its own agenda and design at the cost of its own friend.

America never took care of Pakistan’s security- it always advanced its own security agenda and strategic depth in the volatile region. It would be wrong to blame Pakistan solely for the present volatility in South Asia. The presence of the western power has been a major reason for the chaos in South Asia today.

If democracy could not take firm route in India’s neighbourhood, the West is responsible to a great extent. As a friend, America never tried to promote enlightened democracy in Pakistan. It has always sided with the reactionary elements in Islamabad.

Can such a selfish ally be of any use to India? Today when the heat is on the US and its power is in decline, why should New Delhi give shelter to such force which would always be a disturbing element in region? It would be a major hurdle in the emergence of India as a big player at an international level. Aside from this, by siding with an alien country we would be antagonising and re-enforcing the fear of a neighbour which has always seen New Delhi as a threat to its stability.

It’s the proximity with the US which is keeping the larger India silent about Pakistan’s trouble. If we fail in condemning the killing of Pakistani soldiers in the Nato attack we are missing a wonderful opportunity to win the sympathy and hearts of our close neighbour; we would be losing an opportunity to strike a chord with those forces within Pakistan which India perceives are working against its interest.

If we believe that the presence of the US is important in the territory of Pakistan to checkmate the Taliban, then we are all prisoners of myopic vision. It’s easy to fall prey to this narrative that drones can eliminate insurgents and Pakistan can’t act against them because they serve as strategic assets. The reality is different today; an overwhelming majority of the people of Pakistan are sick and tired of this chaos and want to live a normal peaceful life. The presence of foreign troops is a spur and cause to the Taliban activism. The new generation of Pakistan wants a change – they want to assert their identity and defy the popular narrative of the country in a siege and at the brink of failure.

It makes sense for India to empathise with the prevailing popular mood in its neighbourhood. Political and economic engagement with Islamabad will work only when we connect emotionally with people.

We have to go beyond the present geo-strategic thinking put forward by the western world which states that the Nato troops are needed to stabilise South Asia. No where in the world has such presence of alien troops and their sphere of influence served the cause of peace.

West Asia is perennially disturbed because of the US interference there. The chaos in the Mid-East is engendered by western design; there are many other instances all across the world.

Pakistan has learnt its lesson the hard way. It’s time for all the stakeholders in Islamabad and Rawalpindi to understand the existential threat that donors of dollars pose to the country. No amount of money can buy the self respect of a sovereign nation.

It’s time India also realises the folly of falling into the trap of strategic alliance to corner its neighbour. If we laugh at them today, we might be mocked in the future.

Pakistan
 
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Nothing makes the Indians here happier, than to see Chinese and Pakistani people suffering.

Every time there is a fatal accident in China, Indian members start threads on it, with plenty of ''smiley/laughing faces" added.

The greater the number of people who died, the more smiley faces are used.

And of course, we all saw the Indians trolling that thread about the 24 innocent Pakistani soldiers who died. Needless to say, there was a mass banning after that.
 
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Another title change. The pakistani mindset at work.

I see the resident chini victim drama queen is already here.

@ Topic
Suddenly everyone is concerned India is going to do west's dirty work. History is against that idea, we have maintained our independence and we have surely learned from the example of Pakistan. Just because we have good relations with the west, does not mean west owns us.

And about India's glee at Pakistan's suffering, nobody's happy over individual suffering and loss (except all the happy posts y'day over the death of 6 americans in heli crash, or the 42% pakistani who think LET are heroes!). Well Pakistanis need to get over this sense of self pity.
 
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Interesting bit.. Actually the comment from an Indian that has been used as an example by the writer of the above article (who himself seems to be an Indian) is pretty representative of what most Indians I know feel about the current hapless state of Pakistan in front of NATO/USA, with an exception of feeling glee at the death of 28 soldiers..

---------- Post added at 02:39 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:39 PM ----------

Another title change. The pakistani mindset at work.

LOL.. Thats the free keep out of jail card Pakistani members have here :)
 
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Nothing makes the Indians here happier than to see Chinese and Pakistani people suffering.

Every time there is a fatal accident in China, Indian members start threads on it, with plenty of ''smiley/laughing faces" added.

The greater the number of people who died, the more smiley faces are used.

I don't think so, If it is for real, I am really very sorry.... That group of people does not represent India.

I think you don't like Indians, I know from your posts... May be it is because of the perception which you already had!

I work with Chinese on a daily basis... I have many Chinese colleagues an customers who don't even know anything about India. We enjoy each others company.
 
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Nothing makes the Indians here happier, than to see Chinese and Pakistani people suffering.

Every time there is a fatal accident in China, Indian members start threads on it, with plenty of ''smiley/laughing faces" added.

The greater the number of people who died, the more smiley faces are used.

And of course, we all saw the Indians trolling that thread about the 24 innocent Pakistani soldiers who died. Needless to say, there was a mass banning after that.

Hahahaha. We can see the reaction after every maoist attack in india from Chinese and pakistani. BTW. Don't spoil the thread because nobody is Innocent here
 
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Another title change. The pakistani mindset at work.

I see the resident victim drama queen is already here.

And what does exactly the subject touches here......surely not the Indian habits of digressing from real issues.!!
 
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It goes both ways, 9/10 Pakistanis on this forum won't hesitate to call 26/11 Mumbai attacks as a drama, false flag operation and what not and have a laugh about it, even when their own Government has accepted that the terrorists were from Pakistan :hang2:

The relationship Pakistan had with the US in the past 60 or so years, is not the same as Indo-US relationship.
 
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And what does exactly the subject touches here......surely not the Indian habits of digressing from real issues.!!

@Windjammer

I always enjoy ur posts though sometimes they tend to be too cryptic to understand.

I like the amount of bickering you bring in. Good.
 
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It goes both ways, 9/10 Pakistanis on this forum won't hesitate to call 26/11 Mumbai attacks as a drama, false flag operation and what not and have a laugh about it, even when their own Government has accepted that the terrorists were from Pakistan :hang2:

The relationship Pakistan had with the US in the past 60 or so years, is not the same as Indo-US relationship.

Exactly! Pakistan got their islamic constitution in 1956 IIRC, and before 1960 american spy planes were taking off from pakistani soil.

And now this rona dhona about india's future plight due to the west :lol::lol::lol:
 
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It goes both ways, 9/10 Pakistanis on this forum won't hesitate to call 26/11 Mumbai attacks as a drama, false flag operation and what not and have a laugh about it, even when their own Government has accepted that the terrorists were from Pakistan

Yes, they came from Pakistani soil, but they were not aided by the Pakistani authorities, & they have taken action against these groups. These groups have been banned post 2001.

The relationship Pakistan had with the US in the past 60 or so years, is not the same as Indo-US relationship.

India is irrelevant to the US in terms of the bigger picture, just like Pakistan was/is. The bigger picture is China, & India is only a means to counter this bigger picture, just like Pakistan was/is.
 
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Some other articles written by this Sanjay Kumar guy, looks like we have another Arundhati Roy wannabe jholawadi from JNU :lol:

-Pakistan’s trouble can never be India’s gain

-Slaps won’t get us anywhere

-Anna Hazare’s movement: An invitation to anarchy

-Does terror have a religion?

-Can Rahul Gandhi prove his worth?

-An Indian view on Kashmir: Do we deserve this valley?

-Frisky business: Why Indian diplomats should be checked at airports

-Gagging dissent won’t silence Arundhati Roy

-Obama is not a balm for India


---------- Post added at 08:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:29 PM ----------

Yes, they came from Pakistani soil, but they were not aided by the Pakistani authorities, & they have taken action against these groups. These groups have been banned post 2001.

Still almost all Pakistanis think that 26/11 Mumbai was a false flag staged drama.
 
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