The Indian Islam - Deen i Ilahi

[Hamza913]

Well the caliphate was the result of conquests was it not? If you conquer a population and decree that anyone not of the same religion will be subjugated, then you will suddenly find that everyone is very faithful. I'm not saying that's what happened with the Islamic caliphate, but I think Islam played a stabilizing role after unification rather than be the cause of unification. The actual propagation of the religion was spread by conquest, not by passive means.
The right or proper example would be multiple countries joining together on the basis of religion alone, for the sake of being with similar minded people. Like if Pakistan, Indonesia and the Middle East joined as a union of states.

If you want similar example from Christianity, I guess you could try the crusades. The crusades managed to unite Europe under Christianity, but only for the purpose of driving back Muslim rule. Here again, religion was a means to an end, the easiest chain that could be yanked. Before that, they were happy fighting each other.
I'm not sure about Hinduism, but Hinduism was always more localized than either of the other religions.

The conquests didn't force people to convert (most of the time), so that objection doesn't quite work. You also have had means of spreading which were totally passive, e.g Indonesia.

Pakistan itself is a combination of different ethnic groups who united on the basis of all believing in some form of Islam. Most of the Middle East itself has tried under a unified Arab state (Arabs aren't all the same, many have huge differences in culture), and you also have prominent examples of Muslims from across the world helping each other, e.g Palestine.

Nothing yours here..The context of the discussion in Islam in India and how it has been evolved with course of time.

You said Islam, so yes it is very relevant since I'm Muslim. In fact, it's more relevant to me since you are quite clearly not Muslim.

What evolution? Most Muslims in Hindustan still wouldn't marry or drink from the same utensils as a non Muslim, and still have their own legal system.

 

[El Sidd]

Nothing yours here..The context of the discussion in Islam in India and how it has been evolved with course of time.

So what is your opinion on this. Like purely from an Indians pov.

@SOUTHie you have often claimed you are Indian Muslim

@jamahir

@1ndy

 

[Chhatrapati]

@SOUTHie you have often claimed you are Indian Muslim

Deen ilahi is not Islam. Period.

 

[El Sidd]

Deen ilahi is not Islam. Period.

Define it first lady

 

[Chhatrapati]

Define it first lady

Why do you need me to define it, sire. Those who claim to be descendants of Mughals can also have their claim on it. We got nothing to do with Mughals. They never ruled over this part.

 

[El Sidd]

Why do you need me to define it, sire. Those who claim to be descendants of Mughals can also have their claim on it. We got nothing to do with Mughals. They never ruled over this part.

I want to know how you define Deen i Ilahi......... Just curious

 

[AfrazulMandal]

So what is your opinion on this. Like purely from an Indians pov.

@SOUTHie you have often claimed you are Indian Muslim

@jamahir

@1ndy

Quote me too.

The conquests didn't force people to convert (most of the time), so that objection doesn't quite work. You also have had means of spreading which were totally passive, e.g Indonesia.

Pakistan itself is a combination of different ethnic groups who united on the basis of all believing in some form of Islam. Most of the Middle East itself has tried under a unified Arab state (Arabs aren't all the same, many have huge differences in culture), and you also have prominent examples of Muslims from across the world helping each other, e.g Palestine.



You said Islam, so yes it is very relevant since I'm Muslim. In fact, it's more relevant to me since you are quite clearly not Muslim.

What evolution? Most Muslims in Hindustan still wouldn't marry or drink from the same utensils as a non Muslim, and still have their own legal system.

All true. Except the conversion part. Our forefathers did convert. And mostly it was not entirely peaceful. Even when it was done in peace, it was often to avoid jizya. But we should not be apologetic about it.
We introduced light to a people engulfed in darkness. In a sense we were liberated. By force. But it was necessary. Else we would still be dancing for false Gods in temples.

Just my two cents.

 

[Doctor Strange]

Then Pakistani Islam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya
Iranian Islam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahá'í_Faith

BTW Deobandi, Berelvi, Jamaati, Local Sufi variants; all are Indian Islam. Its impossible to echo perfect Islam of prophet's time. All texts of Islam were compiled after Muhammad (PBUH) with local present realization.

 

[Chhatrapati]

I want to know how you define Deen i Ilahi......... Just curious

Shirk

 

[El Sidd]

Shirk

Howzzzzzzzz

 

[Hamza913]

Quote me too.


All true. Except the conversion part. Our forefathers did convert. And mostly it was not entirely peaceful. Even when it was done in peace, it was often to avoid jizya. But we should not be apologetic about it.
We introduced light to a people engulfed in darkness. In a sense we were liberated. By force. But it was necessary. Else we would still be dancing for false Gods in temples.

Just my two cents.

Asalamu Alaikum

Forceful conversion simply isn't possible, one would simply fake being Muslim father than actually believing in it.

Then Pakistani Islam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ahmadiyya
Iranian Islam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahá'í_Faith

BTW Deobandi, Berelvi, Jamaati, Local Sufi variants; all are Indian Islam. Its impossible to echo perfect Islam of prophet's time. All texts of Islam were compiled after Muhammad (PBUH) with local present realization.

There is no such thing as Iranian or Hindustani or even Arab Islam, there is only Islam.

It's very possible to echo it, follow a madhab or become a Salafi.

 

[Shamsher1990]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Din-i_Ilahi

How does it matter, in the end all of them are following some fairy tales.

 

[El Sidd]

How does it matter, in the end all of them are following some fairy tales.

that is a different debate all together now.......

 

[Shamsher1990]

All true. Except the conversion part. Our forefathers did convert. And mostly it was not entirely peaceful. Even when it was done in peace, it was often to avoid jizya. But we should not be apologetic about it.
We introduced light to a people engulfed in darkness. In a sense we were liberated. By force. But it was necessary. Else we would still be dancing for false Gods in temples.

Thats fun! How do you know you are following the right 'Religion'?

that is a different debate all together now.......

Well then does it matter that it is 'Deen' -e-illahi or Deobandi or some other form of subcontinental Islam? Its still closer of Islam than Hinduism will ever be.

 

[El Sidd]

Well then does it matter that it is 'Deen' -e-illahi or Deobandi or some other form of subcontinental Islam? Its still closer of Islam than Hinduism will ever be.

not to me hahaha
but i am asking the Enndians here..........for a Canadian to get all tissuey over it is beyond my understanding