The Future of Kashmir? "Seven" Possible Solutions!

[FreekiN]

I've seen this before somewhere. I think #7 is the most likely to happen but of course we all want scenario 2.

So what happens to the Chinese controlled Kashmir? No one ever talks about that. D:

 

[ejaz007]

Ruckus in Indo-Pak peace moot as speakers urge Kashmir settlement

* Group of Kashmiri pandits objects to JKLF chief Yasin Malik’s presence in the moot
* Malik suggests joint body of Indo-Pak political parties on Kashmir

By Iftikhar Gilani

NEW DELHI: Commotion broke out at a conference of India-Pakistan peace activists when a group of Kashmiri Hindu pundits belonging to Panun Kashmir and Roots in Kashmir (RIK) organisations objected to the presence of Jammu and Kashmir Liberation Front chief Yasin Malik as a speaker.

Holding placards, they hurled abuses and called Malik a rapist and a murderer before police intervened and escorted majority of them out of the India International Centre (IIC) auditorium.

Malik orated his speech amongst the commotion and challenged the protesters to prove the charges against him.

He accused the pundits of working at the behest of Indian intelligence agencies. “I want migrant Kashmiri pundits to return to their homeland. It is my wish. We are incomplete without them. They are our blood. But some vested interests keep these weeping boys active in Delhi to stop us from raising our concerns,” the JKLF chief said.

Joint body: Amidst the protests, Malik suggested a joint committee of political parties across the borders involving representatives of Congress, BJP, the Pakistan People’s Party, the Pakistan Muslim League and Jamaat-e-Islami to sit down with Kashmiri leaders to draw a road map for the resolution of the Kashmir dispute.

He also asked media to “grow up” and play a constructive role in the peace process.

Malik said that since 1947, the people of Kashmir had only received conflicts, pointing out that the people of Kashmir did not have a history of violence otherwise.

The JKLF leader said despite his abandoning violence and declaring ceasefire at the behest of Indian civil society activists, he lost some 600 colleagues and bore several attempts on his life.

Suggestion: Peoples Conference Chairman Sajjad Ghani Lone said although a majority of Kashmiris favoured independence, they had an emotional bond with Pakistan. Therefore, he proposed a Nepal-India type arrangement between Kashmir and Pakistan as well, where the people from each country could freely come and work in the other area.

He stressed the time had come to go beyond autonomy and self-rule which were limited to discussing power sharing formula between Srinagar and New Delhli.

Lone also called for eschewing “extreme positions” and asked for “economic sovereignty” for Jammu and Kashmir. He suggested dismantling of trade barriers between Srinagar and Muzaffarabad.

Independent MLA from Langate, Engineer Rashid, said India and Pakistan were “commercialising” and “communalising” the Kashmir issue. He asked both the countries to show respect towards the sufferings and sacrifices of Kashmiri people and rejected autonomy and self-rule as possible solutions for the Kashmir problem.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

 

[Abhiras]

For indian point of views india should delay the issue.....

about 45% of people of J&K lives in south kashmir...& about 3% in Ladakh.......which would never agree to independent kashmir or joining pakistan....
& %age of the people living in jammu area is increasing..& power is shifting from Srinagar to Jammu.....

even the hindu right wing party(BJP) is performing very good in J&K as in 2008 electing it scores 11/83 seats compared to last election where it scores only 1 or 2 seats.....

So , let the pro indian population rise & 25 or 50 years afterword Election should occur......then It will remains will india

the increase of jammu influence is good for india....

 

[PAFAce]

For indian point of views india should delay the issue.....

about 45% of people of J&K lives in south kashmir...& about 3% in Ladakh.......which would never agree to independent kashmir or joining pakistan....
& %age of the people living in jammu area is increasing..& power is shifting from Srinagar to Jammu.....

even the hindu right wing party(BJP) is performing very good in J&K as in 2008 electing it scores 11/83 seats compared to last election where it scores only 1 or 2 seats.....

So , let the pro indian population rise & 25 or 50 years afterword Election should occur......then It will remains will india

the increase of jammu influence is good for india....

Why do you think the state transferred land to the Hindu organization? For this very reason; to neutralize the vast majority of Muslims in the region with Hindus from all over India, particularly in Jammu and Ladakh. This will offset the currently most populous territory, the Valley, hence stopping any hope of self-determination (making it impractical).

Kashmir is the only Muslim majority state in India, and that doesn't sit well with the central government and the rest of the states. Nobody in India wants to discuss the actual most practical solutions; (i) either hold a plebiscite, or (ii) Kashmir Valley (at least most of it) goes to Pakistan with Jammu and Ladakh remaining with India.

That is the only scenarios that will satisfy the other two parties, Pakistan and Kashmir, and it's something you guys are unwilling to discuss as it will require giving up territory. Anybody who discusses turning the LoC into an international border is being unjust to the people of the Valley, even though this seems to be popular amongst the populations of the two countries.

 

[Valiant_Soul]

Why do you think the state transferred land to the Hindu organization? For this very reason; to neutralize the vast majority of Muslims in the region with Hindus from all over India

If that was the case, India could simply allow people from rest of the country to settle in Kashmir.

Nobody in India wants to discuss the actual most practical solutions; (i) either hold a plebiscite

Meaningless now - the population demographic has changed of both sides. Moreover, the land belongs to the nation and not to the ethnic population. They can have all the rights under the constitution, but no one can play with national integrity.

(ii) Kashmir Valley (at least most of it) goes to Pakistan with Jammu and Ladakh remaining with India.

How can you be so naive and expect this to ever happen? No country can compromise with its territorial integrity. So please get over with your Kashmir obsession, it will take you no where.

Anybody who discusses turning the LoC into an international border is being unjust to the people of the Valley

How come? Does India not guarantee them every freedom in the constitution? What freedom you seek? If that is something to do based on religion, then that is totally an unacceptable cause.

What can Pakistan do to free Kashmir? Either wage a full fledged war or continue to encourage cross-border terrorism. In either case, India has the capability to withstand both, but Pakistan will move towards a path of no return. Now it is for you to decide whether it is Kashmir of more importance or Pakistan.

 

[Trichy]

India only make decide on J&K there is NO HELL here to make to say do this and that to make peace... we know what to do @ what time... we don't bother about others...

Note: the 7 ways never happen @ any point and the only hope is LoC to b'com IB, nothing else in the century...

 

[PAFAce]

If that was the case, India could simply allow people from rest of the country to settle in Kashmir.

As you have. It is the will of the central government to offset the anti-Indian Muslim majority, and it's done everything it can to do that. Why else would the people of Kashmir oppose land transfer to a Hindu organization?

Meaningless now - the population demographic has changed of both sides. Moreover, the land belongs to the nation and not to the ethnic population. They can have all the rights under the constitution, but no one can play with national integrity.

They are a disputed territory, not an "unbreakable part of India" no matter how much you scream. Therefore, the people have every right to "play with national integrity" because they don't believe in it. Freedom is the right denied to them in your constitution, and the presence of half a million soldiers, frequent curfews, violations of human rights etc. is the way that is accomplished. To say that they have every right under the constitution other than the freedom to choose their allegiance is self-contradictory.

How can you be so naive and expect this to ever happen? No country can compromise with its territorial integrity. So please get over with your Kashmir obsession, it will take you no where.

I'm not saying it will happen, but yes, I do believe that it's the best option. First and foremost, it satisfies the people of the Valley, Ladakh and Jammu, secondly it satisfies Pakistan and, most of all, it allows India to keep a major chunk of Kashmir. It's the best possible win-win-win situation, but Indians will end up losing territory, which is unacceptable to any occupying force. I am proud of my obsession with Kashmir, I believe their freedom is every bit as important as yours or mine, even if you and your friends don't. You, on the other hand, should get over your obsession with this occupation and the constant denial; it will be better not only for you, but for the peace of this region. Tough ask, but please do try.

How come? Does India not guarantee them every freedom in the constitution? What freedom you seek? If that is something to do based on religion, then that is totally an unacceptable cause.

It is more than just religious, but that's the way most of you prefer to see it. It's based on many principles. Kashmir, at various times, has been a political, economic and moral struggle. Like I said, you can't deny them the most basic right and then claim they are "free".

What can Pakistan do to free Kashmir? Either wage a full fledged war or continue to encourage cross-border terrorism. In either case, India has the capability to withstand both, but Pakistan will move towards a path of no return. Now it is for you to decide whether it is Kashmir of more importance or Pakistan.

Like I've said before, Kashmir's freedom is every bit as important as Pakistan's, and many Pakistanis have shed their blood alongside Kashmiris for this very reason. Pakistan can support Kashmir's cause for as long as possible, in whichever manner possible. The ball, however, has always been in India's court, and continues to be. As long as their is no awakening of the collective Indian conscience, Kashmir will never be resolved the way it should be. Full-fledged war should be a last resort, but if it's necessary for our brothers in Kashmir, then so be it. I do not love war, but I love the people for whom war may become necessary.

India only make decide on J&K there is NO HELL here to make to say do this and that to make peace... we know what to do @ what time... we don't bother about others..

Yes, it's been very clear that Indians only care about themselves, you don't have to re-iterate it. You also don't have to beat the "we'll do whatever the heck we want and you can't do sh*t about it" drum, because many of your brethren are already doing so.

 

[Valiant_Soul]

PAFAce

I ask you just this - what principle is it to promote killing of unarmed and unprepared people, even if you believe in oppression of Kashmir by India? You should wage a properly declared war, even I in your assumed enemy nation would respect you for that. But just because you scream oppression, we cannot consider it so. Kashmiris are free to choose their allegiance, but the land belongs to the nation. If you think otherwise, you should either convince the world and put pressure on India or wage a properly declared war. But killing of innocents is not justified by any means and that will gain you respect neither here nor in the next world.

 

[PAFAce]

I ask you just this - what principle is it to promote killing of unarmed and unprepared people, even if you believe in oppression of Kashmir by India

When did I say I support this? Why is it that anybody who speaks for the rights of Kashmiris is declared a terrorist by Indians?

You should wage a properly declared war, even I in your assumed enemy nation would respect you for that.

There are various types of warfare, you should turn to History books before asking me that question. As for respect, your Armed Forces respects us plenty, because they know what we're capable of. That's all the respect we need.

Kashmiris are free to choose their allegiance, but the land belongs to the nation.

In other words, the Kashmiris can go to hell, the land belongs to India. Once again, you show no regard for the people of Kashmir with this statement. All you want to do is occupy a piece of land without its people. That is why they want independence in the first place; it's their land a lot more than it is yours (or even mine for that matter).

If you think otherwise, you should either convince the world and put pressure on India or wage a properly declared war.

Like I said, there are many forms of warfare. The pressure waxes and wanes, and right now, it's pretty low. It's a waiting game for Kashmiris, nobody can sustain an occupation forever. This is why every Kashmiri says "when we attain freedom" and not "if we attain freedom" in the documentary Jashn-e-Azadi.

killing of innocents is not justified by any means and that will gain you respect neither here nor in the next world.

You're absolutely right. Which is why you should be lecturing your soldiers who recently shot killed two teenage boys for simply protesting (without weapons). You should also be lecturing your government who took their land and gave it to a Hindu organization to attract more Hindus into the region. BSF soldiers are, at the very least, as unpopular in the Valley than militants, if not more. Killing innocents and denying basic rights has a lot to do with that.

Speaking of the next world, maybe you should be more concerned about the Kashmiri blood on you hands when you support this occupation.

 

[Abi]

Why do people always forget about China when discussing Kashmir? China has a lot of Kashmir land as well.

 

[EjazR]

@PAFAce

Are you referring tot he Amarnath land controversy as land being given to attract Hindus from outside J&K? I think that this is a misplaced view.

It was specifically handed over to provide for Hindu pilgrims but communal elements both Hindu and Muslim were able to capitalize on the religious based politics that followed.

However, please note that the land deal was revoked by the J&K govt. Which shows that the J&K govt. has the power to take hard decisions if needed. Thus, the locals can get their griviances resolved under the present setup.

The land is now only leased out for the period of the pilgrimage. Please note that the Shrine board also consists of local Hindus, the J&K CM and governor.


Killing of innocents and harsh measures that results in deaths for protesters is wrong. However, political parties like the PDP and NC also take up this issue and there is no reason why the J&K govt. can take action against them as well as they have in the past. If there is proof that any security personnel had deliberately and intentionally targeted teenagers to kill them they should be punished as per law. Again, this is well within the power and responsibility of the J&K govt.

Also please note that there are around 35% Muslims in Jammu and 47% Muslims in Ladakh, which are significant Muslim populations. Don't these Muslims matters? Even in Kashmir valley, the districts that are in highlighted during protests are 95% of the time shopian, sopur and old city Srinagar. The rest of the 6-7 districts in the valley hardly have the scale of unrest and law and order issues as compared to these districts. The opinion of these quiet people matter as much as the loud hurriyet groups. And also lets not discount the popular opinion in the valley that Jammu and Ladakh should be not be separated from the valley and that J&K should remain united.


Lets get one thing straight, local kashmiris who have a sepratist point of view and want to put forward this to the GoI and the local populace can do so without the use of violence. But militants mainly Pakistani nationals under groups like LeT, HUJI, Hizb and other assorted groups under the United Jihad Council based in Muzaffarabad are terrorists just like the TTP. They have killed more Kashmiri Muslims civilians (about 15000) than any other community including Hindu civilians (around 2000). Moreover they have been involved in enforcing a similar Taliban style parallel govt. where people are beheaded for being "spies" women are attacked with acid for not wearing proper "Islamic dress" and any local Kashmiri and his family who works to counter them is fair game to be killed and tortured. There have even been cases of ears and noses being cutoff of these alleged "spies".

Lets differentiate between these two groups.
There are separatists who have abjured violence such as Yasin Malik (JKLF founder), Mirwaiz (his father was killed by a militant) e.t.c [ironically the Indian security forces at times have provided them with a security detail to protect them from militants].

Then you have the TTP clones like LeT, Hizb, HUJI and the umbrella organization UJC. This should not be given any support by any sane person as they have actually been responsible for bringing the IA and paramilitary forces in J&K as well as killings of a large number locals opposed to their ideology.

 

[hindustan]

well you guys are taliking about kashmir let talk on Balochistan what soultion you want for them

they are fighiting for freedom

Baloch Independence Movement 4

 

[FreekiN]

Like 1 percent of Balochistan supports seperation. And you government happens to be arming that 1 %. Totally understandable as we did the same thing in Khalistan.

 

[Xeric]

Freekin, just ignore the troll, would you?

 

[PAFAce]

well you guys are taliking about kashmir let talk on Balochistan what soultion you want for them

How do you concluded that 1% balochistan supports separation? did pakistan conduct poll/referendums in balochistan?

Stop your whining, trolls. Before we even begin to speak about Balochistan, we should first speak about Assam, Khalistan, Telangana, Tamil Eelam etc. But I'm sure you don't want to do that, so let's cut the crap and concentrate on the "disputed territory" of Kashmir. Oh, and by the way, Balochistan was not forced to become a part of Pakistan, they did so at their own will, which is why it has never been contested as disputed territory.

If you can't talk sense, then it is best to shut up and let grown men like EjazR do the talking, at least that guy knows what we're talking about. Every time someone like you opens his mouth, all you do is hurt India's case (even your countrymen are probably ashamed at your ignorance).

Freekin, just ignore the troll, would you?

Sorry sir, for not following your order. It was best to shut their mouths first.