The end of the deal, hopes, delusions and treasons

[drmeson]

I like to do geo-political deductive work and try and deduce things from that. Not really rely on technical or secret documents. But that's some good recommendation, I will try to read it if I have time.

very nice. We would like to know your opinions, post them here when you reach a conclusion.

 

[Bengal71]

Iran has no nukes cause Iranian leader has forbidden it, and no fucking soul in Iran can go against his decision. based on his calculations, we are good without nukes and that will continue.

For your info, US even tried to give Iran some flawed nuclear bomb blueprints so that they could use it later against us.

Several years ago, all US intelligence agencies said that Iran has no nuclear bomb program, to this day, there is zero proof that would prove the otherwise, all the rest are just Zionists propaganda machine and Iranophobia to justify sanctions against an independent country.

The fatawa is fake for sure. It could be just to deceive them. Nukes are defo not haram.

very nice. We would like to know your opinions, post them here when you reach a conclusion.

Conclusion on what?

 

[Hack-Hook]

The fatawa is fake for sure. It could be just to deceive them. Nukes are defo not haram.



Conclusion on what?

we don't have fake fatwa , in Iran no government won't build nukes until that religious decree get lifted

 

[mohsen]

The fatawa is fake for sure. It could be just to deceive them. Nukes are defo not haram.

In theocratic system, there is no such thing as fake fatwa, His fatwa is public and he can't lie either, such a lie not only will disqualify him, but even will destroy the whole concept of this velayat-e-faqih theocratic system.

As I said, it was the report of all the US intelligence agencies as well. that's the reality, regardless of what's going on in your mind!

 

[Bengal71]

In theocratic system, there is no such thing as fake fatwa, His fatwa is public and he can't lie either, such a lie not only will disqualify him, but even will destroy the whole concept of this velayat-e-faqih theocratic system.

As I said, it was the report of all the US intelligence agencies as well. that's the reality, regardless of what's going on in your mind!

It's permitted to lie in Islam to deceive the enemy of Islam in war. Iran is at war with the kafir enemy.

Abu Hurairah and Jabir (May Allah be pleased with them) reported:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "War is deception."

[Al-Bukhari and Muslim].

 

[Hack-Hook]

It's permitted to lie in Islam to deceive the enemy of Islam in war. Iran is at war with the kafir enemy.

Abu Hurairah and Jabir (May Allah be pleased with them) reported:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "War is deception."

[Al-Bukhari and Muslim].

its only permissible to lie if by telling the truth your life become endangered, that's the principle of Taqya , sadly enemies of Islam misrepresented it in course of history so now the people in west think its allowed to li in Islam

 

[Bengal71]

rt of all the US intell

its only permissible to lie if by telling the truth your life become endangered, that's the principle of Taqya , sadly enemies of Islam misrepresented it in course of history so now the people in west think its allowed to li in Islam

Taqyia is a different thing, it applies to personal level of self protection.

I am talking about war/jihad against enemy of Islam or Muslims. In war/jihad, deceiving the enemy by falsehood is halal. Prophet (SAW) himself made it halal. Khamenie is a qualified alim, he knows the fiqh and the rulings related to jihad very well. It is perfectly halal for him to issue a false fatawa by declaring nukes haram to deceive the enemy while developing nukes secretly because it has been made halal by the Prophet (SAW) himself for war situations. Iran is engaged in a strategic long-term war against the zionists and it's backers US/EU.

In theocratic system, there is no such thing as fake fatwa, His fatwa is public and he can't lie either, such a lie not only will disqualify him, but even will destroy the whole concept of this velayat-e-faqih theocratic system.

As I said, it was the report of all the US intelligence agencies as well. that's the reality, regardless of what's going on in your mind!

I don't take anything said by US intel at face value, not because they are incompetent but because they say many things for many reasons. We do not know the underlying motive behind what they say.

 

[drmeson]

The fatawa is fake for sure. It could be just to deceive them. Nukes are defo not haram.

 

[mohsen]

It's permitted to lie in Islam to deceive the enemy of Islam in war. Iran is at war with the kafir enemy.

Abu Hurairah and Jabir (May Allah be pleased with them) reported:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "War is deception."

[Al-Bukhari and Muslim].

First of all, that sentence is not a permission for lie, it means you will hide your tactics from the enemy.

secondly, even if we accept it as a permission for lie, it's limited just to the battlefield and doesn't apply to peace or ceasefire, cause then it would mean breaking the oath. Qur'an mandates the Muslims to keep their oath even with enemies. in Syria, whenever the terrorists wanted to make a deal with Syrian government, all they wanted as a guarantee was a verbal promise from Iranian commanders.

thirdly, even during Iran-Iraq war, when Saddam was widely using chemical weapons, Iran didn't use chemical weapons. Couldn't Iran use it and then deny it ( as you suggest)? but we didn't, cause our leaders have forbidden the use of mass destruction weapons, it's a fatwa for Muslims, not enemies.

 

[aryobarzan]

First of all, that sentence is not a permission for lie, it means you will hide your tactics from the enemy.

secondly, even if we accept it as a permission for lie, it's limited just to the battlefield and doesn't apply to peace or ceasefire, cause then it would mean breaking the oath. Qur'an mandates the Muslims to keep their oath even with enemies. in Syria, whenever the terrorists wanted to make a deal with Syrian government, all they wanted as a guarantee was a verbal promise from Iranian commanders.

thirdly, even during Iran-Iraq war, when Saddam was widely using chemical weapons, Iran didn't use chemical weapons. Couldn't Iran use it and then deny it ( as you suggest)? but we didn't, cause our leaders have forbidden the use of mass destruction weapons, it's a fatwa for Muslims, not enemies.

You have some good points..so I ask a lawyer type question...in your religious interpretations does "owning" a forbidden weapon equates to "Using" a forbidden weapon...may be the fatwa only is about "using" nuclear weapon" on your enemy and not on "owning a nuclear" weapon...just curious.

 

[mohsen]

You have some good points..so I ask a lawyer type question...in your religious interpretations does "owning" a forbidden weapon equates to "Using" a forbidden weapon...may be the fatwa only is about "using" nuclear weapon" on your enemy and not on "owning a nuclear" weapon...just curious.

Khamenei's fatwa is against production, storing and use of nuclear weapons. so no, Iran hasn't built a nuclear weapon for sure.

 

[drmeson]

You have some good points..so I ask a lawyer type question...in your religious interpretations does "owning" a forbidden weapon equates to "Using" a forbidden weapon...may be the fatwa only is about "using" nuclear weapon" on your enemy and not on "owning a nuclear" weapon...just curious.

If we were running our defenses on fatwas trust me we would have been invaded four times by now.

 

[aryobarzan]

If we were running our defenses on fatwas trust me we would have been invaded four times by now.

I put my lawyer 's hat (I hate this profession)..and say this..

If I have an "engine"..a "chassis " a "cabin" and some "fuel"...do I have a car... NO.....am I storing a car...NO...do I drive the car...NO..so I have no car and not storing that either

SO: if my ayatollah (or my Rabbi or priest) has given a rulling against a car then I am ok..lol
And that.... my dear is the story of Iran's nuclear device..in my opinion..

 

[mohsen]

I put my lawyer 's hat (I hate this profession)..and say this..

If I have an "engine"..a "chassis " a "cabin" and some "fuel"...do I have a car... NO.....am I storing a car...NO...do I drive the car...NO..so I have no car and not storing that either

SO: if my ayatollah (or my Rabbi or priest) has given a rulling against a car then I am ok..lol
And that.... my dear is the story of Iran's nuclear device..in my opinion..

Your story fails to answer one key question.

To make it more accurate, you don't have the engine, but the required alloys, no gasoline, but white oil, but you do have refineries, the industry, plus enough brains. so it's all a matter of decision AND TIME.

Israeli officials have estimated it would take Iran two years after attaining a breakout capacity to develop, if it wanted, a nuclear-armed missile that could reach Israel.
https://www.voanews.com/a/as-iran-n...-us-mulls-bomb-making-scenarios-/6413958.html


But what's the use of a two years away nuclear bomb!? If you answer it, you will see that indeed you all have been making stories!

 

[mohsen]

If we were running our defenses on fatwas trust me we would have been invaded four times by now.

Actually Iran's defenses is exactly the place which has been run on fatwas. ie when the head of missile program aims at something, and the leader aims at something else.

And so today thanks to fatwas, our missiles can enter their toilet vent accurately!