Taiwan aide vows defense against China

[jha]

^^^ why are you still entrapped in these two comments only when the thread is about your motherland..??

 

[faithfulguy]

And I respond in kind. Some people are here to derail the topic so I want to rerail their attemps first. You can go back to the topic now or just go.

 

[faithfulguy]

interesting to know. some exchange students are very patriotic.

but i dont think the people using racist words like 支那猪 are the 40 year olds.

nice to know you have a soldier in the family. the war against japan was the honor and contribution of all chinese. sadly, some taiwanese people write about how they wished japan succeeded. in fact, many natives of taiwan still think of themselves as japanese or american, as mr. chen did.

Many Taiwanese are proud of who their are today. As many Taiwanese words are not Southern Min any more but borrowed Japanese words. Taiwanese love Sushi, Udon, Soba, Monga, Anime, Karaoke, Japanese industry and Japanese cultural influence. The reality is that because Japan, in the post war years, has been the most infuencial asian culture and business that bring Asian pride to Taiwanese. A role no doubt will be taken over by China soon.

 

[jha]

And I respond in kind. Some people are here to derail the topic so I want to rerail their attemps first. You can go back to the topic now or just go.

yeah.. and that was the best way to RERAIL the thread by trying to bash india....

and i dont need your suggestion about going back to the topic or, just go

 

[faithfulguy]

And what is your reason for being here. As you have no knowledge or interesting in China/Taiwan related issues? Just follow the discussion and do not disturb. Try to make yourself useful for once by not harass others

 

[jha]

^^^ Lets stick to it and remember it as well....from now on any where you post OT, i'll use the same statement..

 

[below_freezing]

Does India claim Pakistan or vice versa. We are talking about Taiwan claims AP here. And the Taiwanese gov are nationalist. If for some reason the nationalist come back into power, they are more likely to forcefully take AP from India.

---------- Post added at 07:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:33 AM ----------



If you really love freedom, then you wont' still be in India and ben entrapment by your biased mind.

i don't think the "nationalists" are nationalist in anything but name.

1920: soviets take over outer mongolia. no response except a diplomatic protest against USSR. later nationalists take military aid from USSR in 1927.

1931: japanese take over northeast 3 provinces (the equivalent of taking over guangdong today since our heavy industries were all there). jiang orders Zhang Xueliang to NOT RESIST japan even though he outnumbered japanese soldiers in tanks, aircraft and soldiers!

1936: jiang still refuses to fight japan with full power even though the communist party has offered a truce so everyone can fight japan together. he refused, and was KIDNAPPED by Zhang Xueliang to force him to negotiate with the communists and fight japan! of course afterwards he didn't do much

1937: japanese attack shanghai in a small skirmish previous to full scale invasion. jiang fights them off but instead of declaring war on japan, he tries to negotiate!

1938: when negotiations fail and japan attacks, Jiang broke the dikes on the Yellow River, killing 500,000 people instantly due to flooding but slowing the Japanese Army down for only a few days!

1943: nationalist troops rob farmers in Henan so much that they cause a famine that kills 1 million in a few months. in response the farmers turn to JAPAN for aid.

this is why Nationalists lost the civil war. Sadly, ever since then most Nationalist supporters (and DPP too) don't think about their crimes on the mainland, but instead blame their loss on "communist conspiracy". they never blame themselves. they don't even ADMIT these crimes when all of mainlanders, Americans, Russians and Japanese recorded them. at least CPC textbooks say that the Nationalists bore the brunt of the fighting against Japan and admit past mistakes. But do Nationalist textbooks say even 1 good word about the CPC and its achievements? So don't bring "Nationalist" out like it means anything but a name, the Nationalists have sold out more chinese territory than even the Qing Dynasty.

 

[Sanchez]

i don't think the "nationalists" are nationalist in anything but name.

1920: soviets take over outer mongolia. no response except a diplomatic protest against USSR. later nationalists take military aid from USSR in 1927.

1931: japanese take over northeast 3 provinces (the equivalent of taking over guangdong today since our heavy industries were all there). jiang orders Zhang Xueliang to NOT RESIST japan even though he outnumbered japanese soldiers in tanks, aircraft and soldiers!

1936: jiang still refuses to fight japan with full power even though the communist party has offered a truce so everyone can fight japan together. he refused, and was KIDNAPPED by Zhang Xueliang to force him to negotiate with the communists and fight japan! of course afterwards he didn't do much

1937: japanese attack shanghai in a small skirmish previous to full scale invasion. jiang fights them off but instead of declaring war on japan, he tries to negotiate!

1938: when negotiations fail and japan attacks, Jiang broke the dikes on the Yellow River, killing 500,000 people instantly due to flooding but slowing the Japanese Army down for only a few days!

1943: nationalist troops rob farmers in Henan so much that they cause a famine that kills 1 million in a few months. in response the farmers turn to JAPAN for aid.

this is why Nationalists lost the civil war. Sadly, ever since then most Nationalist supporters (and DPP too) don't think about their crimes on the mainland, but instead blame their loss on "communist conspiracy". they never blame themselves. they don't even ADMIT these crimes when all of mainlanders, Americans, Russians and Japanese recorded them. at least CPC textbooks say that the Nationalists bore the brunt of the fighting against Japan and admit past mistakes. But do Nationalist textbooks say even 1 good word about the CPC and its achievements? So don't bring "Nationalist" out like it means anything but a name, the Nationalists have sold out more chinese territory than even the Qing Dynasty.

It does seem that you only read your history book in simplified Chinese. The defeat of KMT is a complicated history, and as a modern day Chinese, one should also have knowledge on the KMT version to make an unbiased judgement.

Talking about selling out territory what would you say about the border agreement with Russia in 2004? Even 海参威 was almost a gift to the Soviet by CCP. Check out the agreement between KMT and Soviet in 1945 on the far east territories.

There's no need for a discussion on Chinese history here, I think.

 

[below_freezing]

apparently you don't read the textbooks because you don't even know what they say.

yes, there was an agreement in 2004, and one in 1945. do you know why there was an agreement? it was because it is called admitting the facts. it had already been occupied by russia for 100 years. not signing the treaty to formalize it would not have had any impact whatsoever on russia, none whatsoever, zero, because they'll keep it anyways. understand that fact? Unless we go to war again like in 1969, which we weren't going to do, the probability of that land reverting to our control was ZERO.

you may ask, how is that different from Jiang selling the 3 northeast provinces to Japan and outer mongolia to USSR. It's different because Jiang actually had real administrative control over those provinces, and gave it up to Japan and Russia. Need a flow chart or something to understand this concept?

CPC didn't control Outer Manchuria, hell not even the Qing Dynasty did after 1860, the control was not ours to give up for over 100 years, only the CLAIM to control. Can you recognize the difference between the claim to control something being given up, and the actual control of an area being given up?

 

[no_name]

^^^ Jiang was not really in a position to fight against soviets, he had other warlords to worry about.

China did not become unified under jiang until 1928, after northern expedition.
Jiang considers communism to be more of a threat to Japan until they tried to take over shanghai.

This is china in 1926

http://www.paulnoll.com/China/History/history-warlord-control.jpg

KMT is the small pinky bit at the bottom.
You can say at that time mongolia is the least of Jiang's concern.

 

[below_freezing]

^^^ Jiang was not really in a position to fight against soviets, he had other warlords to worry about.

China did not become unified under jiang until 1928, after northern expedition.
Jiang considers communism to be more of a threat to Japan until they tried to take over shanghai.

This is china in 1926

KMT is the small pinky bit at the bottom.
You can say at that time mongolia is the least of Jiang's concern.

that is true. the KMT believed that foreigners were less of a threat than other chinese people (to their personal power). the real issue was how KMT failed to gain popular support, and even when it did gain popular support, lost it due to policy blunders.

 

[My-Analogous]

China should give up their thief claims on other nations' lands. If not, this will only aggravate the situation.

U Indian don't know any thing abt Taiwan's China history and came up with big idiotic comments. Just step a side and mind your own business

 

[My-Analogous]

but same logic can be applied for pakistan also

Don't worry even alone in the world, we still will be your nightmares grantee

 

[RAHUL INDIAN]

If you really love freedom, then you wont' still be in India and ben entrapment by your biased mind.

WHat is ur issue man...why bash India at every post....u r a chinese i know but at least be logical..

When the ppl of taiwan love freedom and independence no one can do anythng bout it....or u can let taiwan take over China...

(i thnk that is also a good option coz finally it is merger only....and am also happy that thhere will be democracy in China and there will be open will of 1.4 bilion Chinese and they will not be subjugated to follow what the politicians enforce with/without their will...)

 

[SXNJ]

Many Taiwanese are proud of who their are today. As many Taiwanese words are not Southern Min any more but borrowed Japanese words. Taiwanese love Sushi, Udon, Soba, Monga, Anime, Karaoke, Japanese industry and Japanese cultural influence. The reality is that because Japan, in the post war years, has been the most infuencial asian culture and business that bring Asian pride to Taiwanese. A role no doubt will be taken over by China soon.

You will always be chinese as long as you taiwanese still speak and write chinese words and language. There is also a lot of young people like Japanese cartoon and products, so what? even 沙发 is come from sofa，does that means US president take over the role of Confucius ？