SRI LANKA PRESSES AHEAD WITH NEW FIGHTER PLANS

[Deepika Maheshwari]

get over it that we designed the jet as much as China did we decided to partner with china because it had the infrastructure in place and thus sped up the process otherwise it would have been a late combat aircraft like yours

Here I disagree with you. Most of the design work on the plane was done by Chengdu specifically Yang Wei and his team. Pakistan provided 'inputs' however most of the design was Chinese. From your answer it appears you are implying that your aerospace engineers went to china and designed an Aircraft with some inputs from Chinese experts.

That said, manufacturing a fighter aircraft is not an easy job and Pakistan is manufacturing JF-17 like sausages. Thats commendable!

LCA for India is/was more like a classroom project. Indian designers learnt a lot but outcome was too little too late. I agree, a better idea might had been to collaborate with some friendly nation in a join project. Even UK does that. Making a new fighter is too expensive these days for one nation to do. Unless you are US, Russia or China. Not to mention India's lethargic manufacturing like HAL.

This is a real problem with Indian arms development. They go for flashy projects without doing their homework. An airframe, an engine and a missile. Very few have done this alone and still fewer in one single project. I guess history is repeating with AMCA. Again the same deal - new airframe, new engine, new radar all in one project, WTF! Doubt they will be able to deliver.

if that was the case then this jet would have been yet another MiG 21 derivative.

Actually some non-expert once commented that JF-17 was the ultimate Mig-21. It started from Chengdu F-7 which was chinese clone of Mig-21.

 

[New World]

@hussain0216 @ebrahym @Irfan Baloch

no matter how much you want to educate our eastern neighbor, they can't understand its their nature..

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

I appreciate your idea of replying directly, but it still leaves my main point - with JF-17 you are still dependent upon vendors from different countries - for engine and weapons atleast. As far as customization goes, sure that is a good idea, but then Russia and china are equally good if not better than Pakistan at that. Remember, China did a lot of customization for Pakistan and Russia, in its own time did a lot for India in Su30-MKI.

I will only reply to what is in blue.
To understand why JF-17 has a chance to fly in SLAF.
1) Russia does not manufacture single engines multi-role aircraft.
If the order is for 500 aircraft then they might design one.

2) USA can provide F-16's block 40 \ 50\52 but those aircraft are considered far advance for the needs of SLAF.
Threat of sanction is only for those countries that might use these aircraft to start an international conflict i.e War.

3) Sweden Gripen is too expansive first to procure and it also uses a US engine. Though it can be modified to have EJ200 engine that EFT uses. This upgrade would cost even more.

4) France Mirage 2000. SLAF might consider these but in the same price new jets are available i.e JF-17 or Tejas.
Why would SLAF consider older air-frames that have limited life remaining?

5) Israel Kafir block 60. SLAF is already operating these aircraft they can be upgraded and stored aircraft can be added but the design is of 3rd generation. Kafir have US engines.

6) China J-10 B \ C these aircraft do not have a reliable engine. The engine is Russian again.

7) India Tejas unfortunately the delivery will take 3 to 5 years because it can only start once the Indian orders are complete or a new private factory is allowed to export. These aircraft have US engine and French \ Israeli systems.

8) Pakistan JF-17 is the only option remaining. New aircraft in the same price of older aircraft delivery from the existing PAF orders... The problem of getting engines from Russia is not a problem as Pakistan and China have reexport option available. All the weapons that have been incorporated also provide flexibility of procuring from multiple sources at times of war. So threat of sanctions does not effect in that way as it might.

 

[ebrahym]

This is a real problem with Indian arms development. They go for flashy projects without doing their homework. An airframe, an engine and a missile. Very few have done this alone and still fewer in one single project. I guess history is repeating with AMCA. Again the same deal - new airframe, new engine, new radar all in one project, WTF! Doubt they will be able to deliver.

nope their biggest problem is not a few failures , everyone have few failures their mistake is bragging about their programs way in advance and making them a tiger without any design work

some non-expert once commented that JF-17 was the ultimate Mig-21. It started from Chengdu F-7 which was chinese clone of Mig-21.

i take that non expert is you?
well there is a something called concept evolution
even F-15 has its roots in mig-25

I doubt design and other modifications can be done without involving China

as a matter of fact they can be
once you can create a whole platform by yourself
a little R&D is only the matter of money
however Pakistan have not practiced it yet
i've heard blk 3 will provide us a practice of that
remember ROSE?
yeah we did all that

Ofcourse with funding and work sharing with Pakistan

first of all super-7 project was cancelled
second F-7pg is the upgraded mig-21 all by Pakistan
third try understanding concept evolution

Actually Sri Lankan President himself thanked India for helping Lanka defeat LTTE.

i seriously dont know how to respond to that

 

[Gregor Clegane]

@Ace of air Lanka will buy Mig-29M.
They nearly purchased them in 2008 but cancelled because war with latte needed more funds.

 

[ebrahym]

Pakistan provided 'inputs'

Pakistani engineers were in china and directed chinese about their desires and modifications but yes most of work was china

of air Lanka will buy Mig-29M.
They nearly purchased them in 2008 but cancelled because war with latte needed more funds.

their money
their will

 

[Deepika Maheshwari]

i take that non expert is you?
well there is a something called concept evolution
even F-15 has its roots in mig-25

No my knowledge about Aviation is not that much. Non expert is someone called David Axe at a site called "War is boring"
https://warisboring.com/this-is-the-ultimate-mig-21-715bb9297261#.oe5whu6jq

 

[ebrahym]

No my knowledge about Aviation is not that much. Non expert is someone called David Axe at a site called "War is boring"
https://warisboring.com/this-is-the-ultimate-mig-21-715bb9297261#.oe5whu6jq

here are some lines from the article you posted
Over a decade of work, the side-intake MiG-21 variant evolved into something much more sophisticated: the JF-17. Chinese, Pakistani and Russian engineers added a better wing—similar to the U.S. F-16’s wing—plus so-called “divertless” intakes that work equally well while the plane is flying fast or slow.
the JF-17 the only jet fighter in the world actually manufactured by an air arm
the JF-17 is an outlier—a highly evolutionary plane that doesn’t try to be revolutionary.
That means the JF-17 is probably a much better close-range dogfighter than the F-35 and many other current jets
It might be a descendent of the 60-year-old MiG-21, but the JF-17 is a thoroughly modern warplane—and an affordable one. The same can’t always be said of the F-35 and other current fighters.
for you answer read the last line of the article
and dont quote an article with just reading the header

 

[Beast]

here are some lines from the article you posted
Over a decade of work, the side-intake MiG-21 variant evolved into something much more sophisticated: the JF-17. Chinese, Pakistani and Russian engineers added a better wing—similar to the U.S. F-16’s wing—plus so-called “divertless” intakes that work equally well while the plane is flying fast or slow.
the JF-17 the only jet fighter in the world actually manufactured by an air arm
the JF-17 is an outlier—a highly evolutionary plane that doesn’t try to be revolutionary.
That means the JF-17 is probably a much better close-range dogfighter than the F-35 and many other current jets
It might be a descendent of the 60-year-old MiG-21, but the JF-17 is a thoroughly modern warplane—and an affordable one. The same can’t always be said of the F-35 and other current fighters.
for you answer read the last line of the article
and dont quote an article with just reading the header

What nonsense is it talking?

 

[ebrahym]

What nonsense is it talking?

the article is not from a reliable website nor written by a reliable source
i just quoted these lines that even this bullshit article claims JF-17 to be sate of the art

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

@Ace of air Lanka will buy Mig-29M.
They nearly purchased them in 2008 but cancelled because war with latte needed more funds.

Mig 29 can be an option if SLAF is looking to have a multi-tier AF, otherwise they can do with single engine aircraft IMO.

 

[Deepika Maheshwari]

first of all super-7 project was cancelled
second F-7pg is the upgraded mig-21 all by Pakistan
third try understanding concept evolution

I seriously hope you don't mean that F-7P was upgraded by Pakistan herself into F-7PG. I hope you know what G stands for and where it comes from. What you call F-7PG was F-7MG, evaluated by your two PAF pilots in Chengdu. Being used to F-16s they were quick to point out few modifications to the cockpit especially in terms of ergonomics. This led to the development of F7-PG which was delivered to Pakistan. It is decent plane but it is dated now.

remember ROSE?
yeah we did all that

Yes, project ROSE was a successful project extending the life of Mirage. However it took 3 years (1992 - 1995) of planning and design work to start that project at Kamra and few planes were actually upgraded in France, AFAIK. You dont have that kind of time for fulfilling 12 planes to SL.

 

[ebrahym]

few planes were actually upgraded in France

3 or five yes

You dont have that kind of time for fulfilling 12 planes to SL

the capabilities are not the same as that time plus iit is not mirage but homebuilt

now i think you are stuck in this thread this thread has been over discussed and deviated from OP a bit
let me draw my conclusion from this
of all the available aircrafts to SLAF JFT is not the best but the most Right platform
not over-capable not under capable
have least strings attached
rest is upto SLAf to decide
i would like to distinguish myself from the thread
be kind and dont tag me further
apologies for wrong reference of f7pg