South China Sea Forum

[TaiShang]

Now this "you know where" grabber sounds more like G. W. Bush than a legitimate president elect. Is he really the best Americans can come up with and deserve?

I think he fits well. If he fits, then it means people deserve him. In their political life, countries cannot produce better than the best of the country.

Trump is one of the best in his country. With Obama, race differences were reinforced. With Trump, class differences will be reinforced, along with race.

no wonder you americans are so ignorant ``` as you lot will take whatever nonsensical propaganda that your controlled media tells you gullible bunch


lets see whether it will come true or not````I recken Trump is a very very very bold man!


you sent a spying kit thousands miles away from home, doing dodgy 'researches' in SCS, and now it appears China is the 'aggressor' ? lol, `````

The spying could not be allowed to continue.

This is a gentle reminder and aimed at resetting the rules of the game. This is the new normal and the US has one option: To accept it. Otherwise, they will become more of a laughing stock of the world, worse than when Duterte rebuked the US for not paying off a meager 30 million Arbitration fee that the PH undertook on behalf of the US.

 

[AndrewJin]

After cozying up with Putin, now winking at Beijing?

Putin must have really gotten under Trump's skin.

When he becomes the president, it is really gonna be so much fun. I think there will a whole new brand of satire exclusively for Trump.

What a show!
I can't wait for his crazy presidency!

 

[TaiShang]

What a show!
I can't wait for his crazy presidency!

18.000 likes and 5000 retweets.

Now he is becoming presidential.

Once he hits 100.000 likes and 20.000 retweets, then he is the strongest man in the world.

(But he needs to study a bit more proper spelling and punctuation. He needs to be at least slightly better in English than the illegals he will kick out. Otherwise, people, Heavens forbid, may mistake him for one of those illegals.)

 

[Hindustani78]

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/587238/let-china-keep-us-underwater.html

In yet another swipe at China, President-elect Donald Trump today said the US should let the Communist giant keep the Navy's unmanned underwater drone after Beijing agreed to return in an "appropriate manner" the device it had seized in the disputed South China Sea.

"We should tell China that we don't want the drone they stole back - let them keep it!" Trump tweeted, hours after Pentagon announced it had reached an understanding with China for the return of the drone.

The Pentagon had alleged that the drone was unlawfully seized by China on December 15 in the SCS while it was being recovered by a US Navy oceanographic survey ship.

The US lodged a formal diplomatic complaint and demanded the drone back. The incident is among the most serious military confrontations between the two powers for decades.
China yesterday slammed the US for "making a fuss" over the seizure of its underwater drone and said it will return the device in an "appropriate manner".

Defence Ministry spokesperson Senior Colonel Yang Yujun dismissed the US allegations, insisting that China seized the underwater glider to ensure the safe navigation of passing ships.

Trump's latest tweet was the second time the President-elect blasted China for the seizure.

Earlier, he accused China of stealing American drone.

"China steals United States Navy research drone in international waters - rips it out of water and takes it to China in unpresidented (sic) act," Trump tweeted, misspelling unprecedented.

He later reissued the tweet, correcting the spelling.

Trump has repeatedly infuriated China in recent weeks, questioning decades-old US policy on Taiwan, making phone call to Taiwanese President Tsai Ing-wen and calling Beijing a currency manipulator.

The drone incident, the latest encounter in international waters in the South China Sea region, occurred earlier this week about 161 km off the Philippine port at Subic Bay.

The USNS Bowditch had stopped in the water to pick up two underwater drones. At that point, a Chinese naval ship that had been shadowing the Bowditch put a small boat into the water. That small boat came up alongside and the Chinese crew took one of the drones.

The US got no answer from the Chinese on the radio when it said the drone was American property, a US defense official was quoted as saying by the CNN.
As they turned away, the Chinese did come up on the radio and indicated they were returning to their own operations.

US oceanographic research vessels are often followed in the water under the assumption they are spying.

Although it is unclear what the motivation was for the Chinese action, the seizing of the drone comes on the heels of other provocative incidents that have happened since Trump received a congratulatory call from Taiwan's President, a violation of the US's agreement with China's "One China policy." China publicly voiced its disapproval of that incident and protested to the White House at the time.

Experts say the seizure of the drone was the most significant military incident between China and the US since a 2001 mid-air collision between a US Navy surveillance aircraft and a Chinese fighter jet that led to the death of a Chinese pilot.

The latest incident could add to US concerns about the growing military build-up by China in the South China Sea.

China has claimed territorial rights over parts of the region but its claims are disputed. It is not clear if China claims the territory in which the US drone was seized.

China has become more assertive over the South China Sea after an international tribunal this year struck down its claim over all most all of the area.

The Philippines, Vietnam, Malaysia, Brunei and Taiwan also have counter claims over the South China Sea.

Also, amid increasing tensions, China's first aircraft carrier conducted its maiden live fire drills on a massive scale along with a host of naval ships, aircraft and submarines, four years after it was commissioned.

A US think tank reported this week that aerial imagery shows that China has installed weaponry along seven artificial islands they have built at sea, despite US protests.

 

[TaiShang]

Navigation freedom can't threaten China's national security
Source: Global Times Published: 2016/12/18 18:58:39


According to the Pentagon and the US media, a Chinese Type 922 salvage ship on Thursday "seized" an unmanned underwater drone deployed by the US Navy in the South China Sea. Two unmanned gliders released by the USNS Bowditch, an oceanographic and surveillance ship, were coming to the surface when the Chinese navy vessel "grabbed" one of them before the US sailors could, the US side claimed.

The Pentagon said the incident happened about 50 nautical miles northwest of the Philippines' Subic Bay. But it was also reported by some US media that the distance was 100 nautical miles. The Pentagon accused the action by the Chinese navy of not being in "keeping with international law" and being "unprofessional," and it demanded the immediate return of the drone.

A Chinese military source told the Global Times Saturday that the Chinese navy lifeboat located an unidentified device in the South China Sea waters. In order to prevent navigation safety problems, it "verified and examined" the device. Then the Chinese side received a claim request for the equipment from the US side. The incident will be solved "smoothly," the source said.

We welcome that the Chinese navy is conducting regular "verification and examination" of devices dispatched by the US to collect intelligence in China's surrounding waters in future. This should go along with US sabotage activities in China's periphery.

The US claimed that the glider was collecting unclassified data such as salinity and water temperature, which are routine operations in accordance with international law. However, this argument is absurd.

The USNS Bowditch has appeared in the waters around China now and then. It caused a dispute between China and the US in the Yellow Sea in 2002. The surveillance ship has been engaged in maritime intelligence gathering, posing a long-term threat to the safety of Chinese navy vessels, especially submarines.

It's well-known that the South China Sea is an important area where Chinese strategic submarines conduct activities. Intelligence gathering activities by the US Navy in the region are very rampant.

China and the US have confronted each other over US intelligence gathering in China's periphery for a long time. In 2001, a US Navy intelligence aircraft collided with a Chinese jet. In 2009, several Chinese fishing vessels besieged US surveillance ship USNS Impeccable.

Many people worry that the US Navy has collected too much information about China's naval base in Hainan Island, and it may even have deployed underwater devices that can continuously send signals.

The US has always claimed its practices are consistent with international law and regards maritime reconnaissance operations targeting China as a key aspect of "freedom of navigation in the South China Sea." This is a typical hegemonic approach. It's common sense that freedom of navigation should not harm China's national security. With the increase in China's defensive capabilities, we believe such a common-sense approach will win more respect.

If one day Chinese navy ships conduct intelligence gathering around US coastlines and its surrounding waters, what will the US think? It's worth noting that it won't take a long time for the Chinese ships to develop such capabilities. Does the US want the two countries to engage in offshore intelligence gathering one-upmanship? China knows the strength of the US Navy. But no matter how powerful the US Navy is, it cannot act on the bottom line of China's security. Otherwise, misunderstandings and frictions are bound to occur.

 

[gambit]

18.000 likes and 5000 retweets.

Now he is becoming presidential.

Once he hits 100.000 likes and 20.000 retweets, then he is the strongest man in the world.

(But he needs to study a bit more proper spelling and punctuation. He needs to be at least slightly better in English than the illegals he will kick out. Otherwise, people, Heavens forbid, may mistake him for one of those illegals.)

From a communication perspective, you and your friends just made the same mistake that the American Democrats did -- underestimate Trump.

How many of us remember our thoughts and words in any conversation ? None of us.

Thoughts, yes. Exact words, no.

When you talk to an agent, in this case a reporter, your words are no longer your own. Your thoughts are still your own, but not your words. When your audience reads what they believes to be from you, some will know that what the reporter claims to be your words are actually the reporter's words, and some will genuinely believes those are your words. But the reality is that those are the reporter's words trying to convey your thoughts, and if the reporter have any biases about a particular subject, that subject will be tainted with that bias.

Trump is hardly a genius but his instincts are better than average. Instincts are observations and analyses working in concert. For most of us, we have to consciously observe and analyze most of the time. For the gifted few, that combination works seamlessly and in accelerated mode most of the time. That is why we sometimes compliment someone for his/her 'good' instincts.

Trump's instincts on how social media can work for him greatly contributed to his electoral rise and that rise was so fast that it shook the political and communication establishments. Trump's twitter activities bypassed any third party that can taint his words and thoughts with that third party's biases. His followers know that what they received from Trump are genuinely his and that it is up to them to think for themselves on what he meant. Trump has threatened to relegate mainstream media reporters to secondary status and that threat is being taken seriously by the mainstream media and communication experts. This is not censorship by any stretch of the imagination. In fact, it is the opposite because the reporter and his newspaper/radio/TV are censors in many ways. Trump's twitter actions are quite immediate and raw and people want that.

Mock Trump and you pretty much underestimated him.

 

[gambit]

If one day Chinese navy ships conduct intelligence gathering around US coastlines and its surrounding waters, what will the US think? It's worth noting that it won't take a long time for the Chinese ships to develop such capabilities.

We will return the favor.

Does the US want the two countries to engage in offshore intelligence gathering one-upmanship? China knows the strength of the US Navy. But no matter how powerful the US Navy is, it cannot act on the bottom line of China's security. Otherwise, misunderstandings and frictions are bound to occur.

Do we want ? No. But do we know how to handle it ? Yes.

Whoever wrote that article is ignorant of what went on during the decades of the Cold War, of which China contributed to the tensions.

 

[Penguin]

If one day Chinese navy ships conduct intelligence gathering around US coastlines and its surrounding waters, what will the US think? It's worth noting that it won't take a long time for the Chinese ships to develop such capabilities. Does the US want the two countries to engage in offshore intelligence gathering one-upmanship? China knows the strength of the US Navy. But no matter how powerful the US Navy is, it cannot act on the bottom line of China's security. Otherwise, misunderstandings and frictions are bound to occur.

This gives you a clue:

The head of the U.S. Navy said he's not particularly concerned that a Russian destroyer has joined a Russian intelligence ship off Hawaii during Rim of the Pacific exercises.
The destroyer arrived within the past few days coinciding with the start of the at-sea phase of the world's largest international maritime exercise, the Navy said.
"We've got to be ... alert to them, for sure, and aware ... but to be honest, (I'm) not too concerned," Chief of Naval Operations Adm. John Richardson said Friday.
"To be pretty straightforward, it's kind of what we expect, right?" Richardson added. "This is a very interesting exercise. There are a lot of things going on. We know there are a lot of people interested. Russia is among them."
Russia's AGI ship was outside the U.S. 12-nautical-mile territorial waters but within the U.S. 200-nautical-mile exclusive economic zone. The destroyer joined the Russian spy ship in international waters.
China, a participant in RIMPAC with five ships, has not sent a surveillance ship to monitor RIMPAC as it did in 2012 and 2014, Pacific Fleet said.
http://www.military.com/daily-news/2016/07/17/head-navy-not-worried-russian-ships-near-hawaii.html

Chinese navy ships off Alaska in recent days weren’t just operating in the area for the first time: They also came within 12 nautical miles of the coast, making a rare foray into U.S. territorial waters, according to the Pentagon.

Pentagon officials said late Thursday that the five Chinese navy ships had passed through U.S. territorial waters as they transited the Aleutian Islands, but said they had complied with international law and didn’t do anything threatening.

“This was a legal transit of U.S. territorial seas conducted in accordance with the Law of the Sea Convention,” said Pentagon spokesman Cmdr. Bill Urban.
U.S. officials said there was no known official communication to the U.S. from the ships.
The flotilla apparently traveled east from somewhere near Russia and entered the Bering Sea, navigating north of the Aleutian Islands before transiting south, where they undertook the “innocent passage” through U.S. waters between two islands, a defense official said.
That principle allows military ships to transit foreign territorial waters if they don’t conduct threatening activity. The Chinese didn’t give prior notification to the U.S. before doing so, but under international law, they don’t need to.
The Chinese don’t always acknowledge those laws, however, according to U.S. defense reports. For example, Beijing claims that U.S. warships should request permission before making their own “innocent passage” in Chinese territorial waters.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/chinese...sed-through-u-s-territorial-waters-1441350488

See also
https://www.rt.com/news/314386-amber-spy-ship-atlantic/
http://freebeacon.com/national-secu...hip-in-atlantic-near-nuclear-submarine-areas/

Clearly NO BIG DEAL was made out of any of this.

 

[Hindustani78]

PACIFIC OCEAN (Dec. 15, 2016)

Hide Caption
The Auxiliary General Oceanographic Research (AGOR) vessel R/V Sally Ride is currently underway conducting a series of science verification cruises in order to test its installed systems and ensure its readiness for conducting future research missions. Operated by Scripps Institution of Oceanography under a charter lease agreement with the Office of Naval Research (ONR), Sally Ride has multi-beam bottom-mapping and ocean current profiling sonars, advanced meteorological sensors and satellite data transmission systems, the latest navigation and ship-positioning systems and a specially designed hull that improves sonar acoustic performance. The Navy, through ONR, has been a leader in building and providing large ships for the nation's academic research fleet since World War II. U.S. Navy photo by John F. Williams (Released) 161215-N-PO203-134

 

[samsara]

China Responds: Will Return Stolen Drone, "Regrets US Hype"

ZeroHedge, 2016-12-17

"China decided to return it to the U.S. side in an appropriate manner, and China and the U.S. have all along been in communication about it," the ministry said on its website. "During this process, the U.S. side's unilateral and open hyping up is inappropriate, and is not beneficial to the smooth resolution of this issue. We express regret at this," it added.

A retired Chinese admiral, Yang Yi, quoted as saying China considered itself well within its rights to seize the drone.

"If China needs to take it, we'll take it. (America) can't block us," Yang was quoted as saying. Yang said he was unsure of the purpose of seizing the drone, but didn't think the matter qualified as a "military conflict."

However, he added that the chances of a confrontation had risen following Trump's recent comments, which were seen as testing China's bottom line on Taiwan and other sensitive issues. "It's natural for us to take possession of and research for a bit these types of things that America sends to our doorstep," Yang said. "The louder they shout, the more their protests ring hollow."

 

[Globenim]

U.S.A. should behave and take back their junk littering Chinese waters.

They should be happy China isn't unnecesarrily escalating their petty invasions and demanding officially for an apology, because it was just some insignificant junk that intruded.

 

[gambit]

I say the Pentagon sent the PLA a high definition picture of the Liaoning, complete with the captain's open mouth in shock, taken by a B-2 that the Liaoning's radar never detected.

 

[asia2000]

I say the Pentagon sent the PLA a high definition picture of the Liaoning, complete with the captain's open mouth in shock, taken by a B-2 that the Liaoning's radar never detected.

Are you saying a radar cannot detect a B2, even it can be seen by the captain's naked eyes?

 

[grandmaster]

Are you saying a radar cannot detect a B2, even it can be seen by the captain's naked eyes?

Guys like this say something about America issues with the mind, the ideologies of their original country like Vietnam and aim to benefit their original countries. Their thought like those is understandable.

 

[BuddhaPalm]

Guys like this say something about America issues with the mind, the ideologies of their original country like Vietnam and aim to benefit their original countries. Their thought like those is understandable.

It's called "going bonkers with humiliation" after a spanking of colonial master by PLA. Really funny to see him degenerate into foaming at the mouth spewing nonsense live on the internet