South China Sea Forum

[Viet]

Thank you Indonesia!



By Tito Summa Siahaan on 04:42 pm May 10, 2014
Category News, Politics
Tags: Asean, diplomacy, Marty Natalegawa, South China Sea

Naypyidaw, Myanmar. Foreign Minister Marty Natalegawa said on Saturday that Indonesia was “disappointed” with China’s decision to build oil rigs in the South China Sea, threatening regional stability.

“These kinds of acts should not set a legal precedence for the South China Sea,” he said, speaking after a meeting with Vietnamese Foreign Minister Pham Binh Min at the Asean Summit in Myanmar’s capital. “The issue can only be resolved through negotiations between related parties.”

China claims sovereignty over much of the resource-rich sea, home to vital shipping lanes, but Asean members including the Philippines, Vietnam, Malaysia and Brunei have overlapping claims. Tensions are high due to a collision between Chinese and Vietnamese vessels in the disputed area last week after Chinese vessels were found installing rigs in an area claimed by Vietnam.

“The risk of an incident is very real. I hope the current meetings in Myanmar will reinforce further recognition of that fact,”Marty said yesterday.

Marty urged the Chinese government to acknowledge the sensitivity of the issue and exercise self restraint.

“We are very concerned and disappointed by the acts of the Chinese government,” he said.

He reiterated Indonesia’s neutral stance on the territorial claims.


Indonesia 'Disappointed' With China Over South China Sea Oil Rigs: Marty | The Jakarta Globe

 

[Viet]

unbelievable but true, greedy china claims a part of indonesia, too.
backing our stance will help indonesia in defending their territories.

 

[Established_1965]

One good advise, Never mess with Indonesians and Vietnamese -_-

 

[Established_1965]

In this dispute, China will be the winner. Vietnam is doomed to fail.

Thats what Uncle sam said during Vietnam War.

 

[Battle of Bach Dang River]

I see Natuna Islands' EEZ overlaps with china's illegal claim "nine dash line"...

china's illegal claim SCS

 

[Raphael]

Indonesia is the most influential member of ASEAN. If they really cared, why didn't they incorporate this into the ASEAN joint statement? In the end, no ASEAN statement made mention of China. The most important observation to make is that Indonesia took pains to stress its neutrality. Everything else about "concern", "feelings", or "disappointment" is just pathetic lip service to assuage a certain screaming baby. When a baby screams in your ear, you have to give up your candy; it's impossible to reason with it or calm it down.

 

[Mr Second Back]

Indonesia disappointed? Lovely, should China remind Indonesia what happened in 1998? Actrully, two countries' relation is quite good now and cooperation in many areas run very smooth. No need to do some "more" thing. "no zuo no die"

 

[ephone]

No need to talk with those ph bastards. Let's grab some ph fishermen and tit for tat.

You grab one of ours and we will grab ten of yours. Let's see how long that will last.

You want that, China government soon will give you that.

 

[mike2000]

The obvious solution to this is simple: sign a joint exploration agreement and share of resources in the area with join patrols. This is the only solution i see here, short of a shooting war, which we all know serves nobody interests( Huh....maybe our governments in the west.).
Well on a serious note, i don't know why china hasn't solved this issue with its ASEAN neighbors(the dispute with Japan is a different issue altogether). China should know that its Big country/world economic power now(and in a decade or two from now it will be a world military power) . so i think its in its interest to solve this issue by calling for a joint share/exploration between the various parties and it. This will be the best deal and will also create enough good will in the region. China should know that it is a big/influential country and as such its actions attracts more global scrutiny/attention than small/almost insignificant countries like Vietnam/Philippines who have no world or even regional influence. So this small countries can afford to create trouble and stand their ground even though they know they are outclass/stand no chance of a military victory. China has more to loose internationally. so will be good if China can solve its problems with its neighbors peacefully than through force/unilateral moves, this applies to Russia as well.
However, Vietnam and Philippines should also know that its in their interest to solve this issue as soon as possible peacefully and put more effort not to over provoke China as well, because In a decade or two from now, China will be so powerful so much so that it will have less inclination to make small concessions/or even joint explorations. and I'm afraid by then, even the U.S/west would be incapable to say/do anything. After all, Big powers never fight directly, but through small proxies, and i'm sure small countries don't want to be at the receiving end. Especially Vietnam, since it has no real allies who will stand by it firmly when push comes to shove( Russia is more close and has more converging world interest/issues with china, so count them out), ASEAN countries have their own economic interests to protect(some don't even have any dispute in SCS),
At least the Philippines/japan has the U.S umbrella/defense treaty. So Vietnam should thread carefully here, the only other option is ton that it can ally with the U.S/allow the U.S military base/sign a defence treaty(though it will anger its patron Russia). But then again you cant eat your cake and have it. sometimes you have to make sacrifices and choose sides..

 

[xunzi]

We want to remind our friend, Indonesia, to use careful words as the rig is within our Paracel's Continental shelf water that we own and administer. Under no circumstance should Indonesia be drag into Vietnam's dirty tactic to strengthen its own territorial claim. Remember Vietnam, not too long ago, scared all Southeast Asian states, including Indonesia, when they expanded into Cambodia during Soviet-back Vietnamese expansion. It took a global sanction, led by USA-China, to stop them. So this is not some "innocent" country as some believe.

 

[xunzi]

The obvious solution to this is simple: sign a joint exploration agreement and share of resources in the area with join patrols. This is the only solution i see here, short of a shooting war, which we all know serves nobody interests( Huh....maybe our governments in the west.).
Well on a serious note, i don't know why china hasn't solved this issue with its ASEAN neighbors(the dispute with Japan is a different issue altogether). China should know that its Big country/world economic power now(and in a decade or two from now it will be a world military power) . so i think its in its interest to solve this issue by calling for a joint share/exploration between the various parties and it. This will be the best deal and will also create enough good will in the region. China should know that it is a big/influential country and as such its actions attracts more global scrutiny/attention than small/almost insignificant countries like Vietnam/Philippines who have no world or even regional influence. So this small countries can afford to create trouble and stand their ground even though they know they are outclass/stand no chance of a military victory. China has more to loose internationally. so will be good if China can solve its problems with its neighbors peacefully than through force/unilateral moves, this applies to Russia as well.
However, Vietnam and Philippines should also know that its in their interest to solve this issue as soon as possible peacefully and put more effort not to over provoke China as well, because In a decade or two from now, China will be so powerful so much so that it will have less inclination to make small concessions/or even joint explorations. and I'm afraid by then, even the U.S/west would be incapable to say/do anything. After all, Big powers never fight directly, but through small proxies, and i'm sure small countries don't want to be at the receiving end. Especially Vietnam, since it has no real allies who will stand by it firmly when push comes to shove( Russia is more close and has more converging world interest/issues with china, so count them out), ASEAN countries have their own economic interests to protect(some don't even have any dispute in SCS),
At least the Philippines/japan has the U.S umbrella/defense treaty. So Vietnam should thread carefully here, the only other option is ton that it can ally with the U.S/allow the U.S military base/sign a defence treaty(though it will anger its patron Russia). But then again you cant eat your cake and have it. sometimes you have to make sacrifices and choose sides..

The question is not whether there should be negotiation. It is a question of which style of negotiation. We said before that dispute should be resolved bilaterally between relevant parties but these troublemakers like Vietnam and Philippines, insisting on multilateral forum to resolve the dispute, such ASEAN-China settlement. What's fair in this situation in your opinion? Why should we negotiate with 3rd party in our bilateral dispute? You see, these Vietnamese and Filipino want to bring other nonrelevant parties, like ASEAN, to strength its claim so they get more leverage against us but we will not fall for that trick because we understand various ASEAN states have conflicting interest and some are good friend with us. There is no reason for them to risk antagonizing us over Vietnam and Phillipines' self-interest.

 

[xunzi]

If this is how the Phillipine want to play this game by arresting fishermen to strengthen its claim in dispute area, then we will play.

 

[rott]

@Krueger, you seem pretty interested in Asian topics. Are you sure you're American or are you a Filipino under the pretense of an American flag? I see most of your topics are everything to do with the Philippines.

 

[k_arura]

ASEAN countries are not interested in Vietnam and Pinoy BS. They are more interested in having more cooperation with China to help their own countries prosper. This is what I called, Good Government!

Thats what Hitler was counting on and in the beginning he did manage to cower down opposition. But ultimately? Rest is history

The question is not whether there should be negotiation. It is a question of which style of negotiation. We said before that dispute should be resolved bilaterally between relevant parties but these troublemakers like Vietnam and Philippines, insisting on multilateral forum to resolve the dispute, such ASEAN-China settlement. What's fair in this situation in your opinion? Why should we negotiate with 3rd party in our bilateral dispute? You see, these Vietnamese and Filipino want to bring other nonrelevant parties, like ASEAN, to strength its claim so they get more leverage against us but we will not fall for that trick because we understand various ASEAN states have conflicting interest and some are good friend with us. There is no reason for them to risk antagonizing us over Vietnam and Phillipines' self-interest.

But if they are smart they will stand united. Good thing Japan is in the middle of a sort of alliance/block with Vietnam and Manila

We are. Its the world's business

 

[UnChosen]

Why would countries that have no territorial disputes with China risk their relatively friendly relationships for Vietnam and the Philippines?

Despite ASEAN the SE Asian countries do not benefit from each other all that much because they all sell mostly the same stuff and are close competitors with each other, with Singapore being the sole exception.