South China Sea Forum

[HongWu]

What is happening between China and Vietnam? It's very difficult to solve a problem when one or both the party are lying.

PLAN is using Vietnam for target practice against just like 1974 and 1988

 

[scorpionx]

PLAN is using Vietnam for target practice against just like 1974 and 1988

Don't live with arrogance.Sometime it back fires.

 

[Viet]

Lost arguments primate? VN went after Cambodia and not China proofs VN never had the power to attack us in the first place.

Who says that Vietnam never had the power to attack China?

In the Sino-Vietnam war of 1075, the Vietnamese army launched a preemptive strike on Guangdong and Guangxi. And again in the war of 1979, when our army conducted raid in China´s border regions and destroyed supporting PLA artillery installations.

Sure there were only two raids, nothing if compare to your attacks on Vietnam.


History of Vietnam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Lý Dynasty had two major wars with Song China, and a few conquests against neighboring Champa in the south. The most notable battle took place on Chinese territory in 1075 AD.

Upon learning that a Song invasion was imminent, the Lý army and navy totaling about 100,000 men under the command of Lý Thường Kiệt, Tông Đản used amphibious operations to preemptively destroy three Song military installations at Yong Zhou, Qin Zhou, and Lian Zhou in present-day Guangdong and Guangxi, and killed 100,000 Chinese.

The Song Dynasty took revenge and invaded Đại Việt in 1076, but the Song troops were held back at the Battle of Như Nguyệt River commonly known as the Cầu river, now in Bắc Ninh province about 40 km from the current capital, Hanoi. Neither side was able to force a victory, so the Lý Dynasty proposed a truce, which the Song emperor accepted.

Champa and the powerful Khmer Empire took advantage of the Lý Dynasty's distraction with the Chinese to pillage the south of the country. Together they invaded Vietnam in 1128 and 1132. Further invasions followed in the subsequent decades.

 

[HongWu]

China is establishing itself as a major player in the world. If China wants the whole world to listen, she should not bully its neighbors.

We prefer to bully and make ourself richer and more powerful. Don't care whether you listen or not.

 

[Viet]

Chinese navy exercises 'surprise' neighbours
China has deployed some of its most sophisticated Navy vessels to the eastern coast of Malaysia.

Wednesday's report from the Xinhua news agency is thought to be a play by Beijing to reinforce territorial claims to part of the South China Sea.

Al Jazeera's Rob McBride, reporting from Hong Kong, said military exercises, beginning on Saturday, have "taken many Asian neighbours and military analysts by surprise".

The exercises included the landing of amphibious craft just off the James Shoal, 80 kilometres off the Malaysian coast.

The James Shoal is China's most southerly territorial claim.

It is among several disputed parts of the South China Sea, including the Spratly Islands, that the People's Republic says belong to Beijing.

Our correspondent said the exercise culminated in a ceremony on James Shoal where soldiers and marines promised "to defend Chinese sovereignty".

The move, said Al Jazeera's McBride, could also be Beijing's answer to Washington's so-called "pivot strategy", which would see the US move more resources to East Asia.

Chinese love provocation, I see. On one side, they claim to be peaceful, but on the other side they act aggressive on the ground. Though China must know that others will take counteraction, especially the Vietnamese government. Tit for tat.

Anyway this navy exercise off the James Shoal, 80 kilometres off the Malaysian coast, can only anger Malaysia, and not Vietnam. Why? first, nobody in VN is impressed by such show of force. Second, this exercise occured out of the Vietnamese claim (including EEZ) in the SC sea:

200 miles based on UNCLOS

Vietnam EEZ

 

[Soryu]

Chinese love provocation, I see. On one side, they claim to be peaceful, but on the other side they act aggressive on the ground. Though China must know that others will take counteraction, especially the Vietnamese government. Tit for tat.

Anyway this navy exercise off the James Shoal, 80 kilometres off the Malaysian coast, can only anger Malaysia, and not Vietnam. Why? first, nobody in VN is impressed by such show of force. Second, this exercise occured out of the Vietnamese claim (including EEZ) in the SC sea:

200 miles based on UNCLOS
Vietnam EEZ

Well, They just fire on our fishmen ship, we were protest very strong in my view and Maybe they were predict that and made exercises on other way. Like I know, the ships used to went our EEZ was CMS ship, their navy never dare to step that close.

In case of Jame shoal if they went to there and went off, so not so serious but surprise because they allowed their media report that action. They want check ASEAN countries.

 

[Malaya]

Greed and arrogance does not satisfy

James Shoal is only 80 km from the Malaysian coast and about 1800 km from the Chinese mainland.

 

[Malaya]

Tell me, who gave fairness and justice when 8 countries invaded China together in 1900? And who gave you fairness when US and Spain fought against each other for the control of your land and people? This world is just so cruel indeed!

And you really don't know why there are so many voices against China? Because of its arrogance? Why don't you blame Americans then? US starts 3 wars in past 15 years and killed millions of people and you still think it is a nation of "fairness" and "justice". So it really teaches us what is the exact definition of this two terms.

We are now in the 21st century, living in a civilized world and governed by laws.

China must honor the territorial rights of other countries. We are no longer living in the ancient times where there is no law exists and countries were not yet discovered. Wake up! Your claim over your neighbors' exclusive economic zones is grave blunder. You pushed all your neighbors around in the area. You’re the only one doing all the provoking, waddling about showing off how mighty you think you are, but the fact remains, your posturing is all because of your insatiable greed for more natural resources in areas clearly you don’t own.

The world will know further how arrogance by reason of economic and military superiority is not the proper way to insist an old and decaying argument of the nine dash line. Remember Hitler what he did in Germany, You are following that line by insisting your supposed "indisputable" sovereignty on a territory that is so far away from your nearest seashore. It defies logic that you don't possess.

 

[Malaya]

We prefer to bully and make ourself richer and more powerful. Don't care whether you listen or not.

Did you missed taking your medications?

Your greed will soon backfire in your face.

 

[Malaya]

Is China Bullying Its Neighbors Over Some Rocks in South China Sea?
Jinyoung Parkin
World, Asia

Signs of escalating tension are shoring up in the South China Sea as Hanoi and Beijing go head to head over a “trawler attack.” Vietnam accused a Chinese vessel of chasing and firing on a Vietnamese fishing vessel near Paracel Islands on March 20, lodging a formal complaint with the Chinese Embassy in Hanoi and demanding punishment of those responsible of this “very serious” incident. China responded by stating that the unspecified actions by the Chinese vessel were “legitimate and reasonable” against illegal fishing activity by Vietnamese fishermen.

This incident and its diplomatic handling bear more significance than its seemingly trivial cover, since any small event can flare up the decades-long brawl over contested islands in South China Sea. Both China and Vietnam claim the Paracel islands and the Spratly islands in South China Sea, along with the Philippines, Taiwan, Malaysia, and Brunei that also claim and/or occupy some parts of the disputed territory. This instance of Beijing-Hanoi back-and-forth, which might either escalate further or subside, we are yet to see, is not an isolated incident. We have seen more small-scale incidents around the disputed islands over the last few years, especially between China and Japan over Senkaku/Diaoyu Island.

There have been many analyses regarding why China and other countries are so protective of these islands, which in fact are no more than small rocks that are either too small to be inhabited by people or submerged under water half of the time. Some say it’s about gas or oil underneath the islands, fishing rights, or securing Sea Lines of Communications (SLOCs) for overseas trades. Others say it’s about growing nationalistic sentiments in the region, China trying to be the regional hegemon, or China reacting to Obama’s “pivot to Asia.” While no conclusion can be made in this short article, the answer is probably some combination of all these factors.

What we can conclude for sure, though, is that these acts of muscle-flexing in the South China Sea fundamentally clash with China’s vital interests of maintaining stable and productive relations with its neighbors. After all, Beijing’s first and foremost goal lies in keeping its people happy and therefore democratic-revolution-free by sustaining its unprecedented economic growth. And Beijing can do that only if it continues its flourishing trade relations within the Southeast Asian region and secure the sea routes through which most of its overseas trades are done. Indeed, much of Beijing’s diplomatic capital has been invested on this mission.

Last Thursday, after a phone conversation with Vietnamese Communist Party chief Nguyen Phu Trong, President Xi Jinping stated that China will “work with Vietnam to enhance bilateral exchanges and cooperation in various fields.” Trong responded by emphasizing the great importance of the “traditional friendship with China” and vowing to “push forward ties as to contribute to peace and development in the region and the world at large.” Underlying these high-level schmoozing are, however, decades-long territorial disputes that can crumble these efforts for peace and development by just one or two military altercations in the sea.

To be fair, China was only exercising its legitimate rights, according to its Foreign Ministry, and other countries would have probably done the same if a foreign vessel approached one of the islands they occupy. In fact, generally speaking, China has shown much restraint in using violence. However, China cannot help looking like a bully in most of its conflict situations with its neighbors, especially with its naval power growing at the speed and magnitude that has been making other Asian countries very nervous. It’s about time that China reevaluates its long-term and short-term priorities, understand the discrepancy between its actions and how they appear to others, and take tangible measures that are dedicated to maintain peace and stability in the region.

Is China Bullying Its Neighbors Over Some Rocks in South China Sea?

 

[Malaya]

South China Sea dispute getting hot
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS MARCH 27, 2013

Vietnam has accused a Chinese vessel of firing a flare on a Vietnamese fishing boat that set its cabin alight in the disputed South China Sea, where rival claims to gas-rich waters have strained relations between the countries.

The Vietnamese government did not say if anyone was injured in the incident last Wednesday but called it "very serious." It lodged a formal complaint with the Chinese Embassy in Hanoi.

The United States also said it was concerned by the incident, and was seeking information about it from both sides.

The fishing boat was near the Paracel islands when an unidentified Chinese vessel chased it and fired the flare, the government said in a statement issued late Monday. Hanoi demanded that China punish those responsible and pay reparations to the fishermen whose boat was damaged.

Chinese Foreign Ministry spokesman Hong Lei said China had taken unspecified but "legitimate and reasonable" actions against Vietnamese boats working illegally in Chinese waters. He denied that any boats had been damaged, but gave few other details.

There have been other clashes in the waters, often related to claims of illegal fishing or violations of Chinese unilaterally imposed fishing moratoriums.

Vietnam and China each claim large parts of the South China Sea. The Philippines, Malaysia, Taiwan and Brunei also maintain that parts of the sea are theirs.


Read more: http://www.theprovince.com/South+China+dispute+getting/8157717/story.html#ixzz2OqTHmoVb

 

[longyi]

I wonder it has anything to do with the Sabah conflict:

1) has an understanding with Malaysia if Philippines claims Sabah they'll be on the same side, or

2) taking advantage of the conflict to reiterate her position vis-a-vis James Shoal.

Just thinking out loud.

 

[zxmint]

We are now in the 21st century, living in a civilized world and governed by laws.

China must honor the territorial rights of other countries. We are no longer living in the ancient times where there is no law exists and countries were not yet discovered. Wake up! Your claim over your neighbors' exclusive economic zones is grave blunder. You pushed all your neighbors around in the area. You’re the only one doing all the provoking, waddling about showing off how mighty you think you are, but the fact remains, your posturing is all because of your insatiable greed for more natural resources in areas clearly you don’t own.

The world will know further how arrogance by reason of economic and military superiority is not the proper way to insist an old and decaying argument of the nine dash line. Remember Hitler what he did in Germany, You are following that line by insisting your supposed "indisputable" sovereignty on a territory that is so far away from your nearest seashore. It defies logic that you don't possess.

So tell me if it is reasonable to get your belongings from gangsters and thieves? Don't pretend to be bullied and attempt to keep your stolen property forever. That is what Chinese people think: we just take what belongs to us originally. We never ask for other countries' territories and won't accept them even if you send us.

And tell me how far away that Hawaii locates from US's nearest seashore? It is a funny way to judge the ownership of territories. You have made enough numbers of jokes, go ahead if you wanna go on.

 

[zxmint]

The fact out there in SCS is about several thieves don't want to return their stolen property and claim to be bullied when the owner ask them to return. It seems like that the owner really need to take some actual actions. No words work toward thieves.

 

[zxmint]

Who says that Vietnam never had the power to attack China?

In the Sino-Vietnam war of 1075, the Vietnamese army launched a preemptive strike on Guangdong and Guangxi. And again in the war of 1979, when our army conducted raid in China´s border regions and destroyed supporting PLA artillery installations.

Sure there were only two raids, nothing if compare to your attacks on Vietnam.


History of Vietnam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Lý Dynasty had two major wars with Song China, and a few conquests against neighboring Champa in the south. The most notable battle took place on Chinese territory in 1075 AD.

Upon learning that a Song invasion was imminent, the Lý army and navy totaling about 100,000 men under the command of Lý Thường Kiệt, Tông Đản used amphibious operations to preemptively destroy three Song military installations at Yong Zhou, Qin Zhou, and Lian Zhou in present-day Guangdong and Guangxi, and killed 100,000 Chinese.

The Song Dynasty took revenge and invaded Đại Việt in 1076, but the Song troops were held back at the Battle of Như Nguyệt River commonly known as the Cầu river, now in Bắc Ninh province about 40 km from the current capital, Hanoi. Neither side was able to force a victory, so the Lý Dynasty proposed a truce, which the Song emperor accepted.

Champa and the powerful Khmer Empire took advantage of the Lý Dynasty's distraction with the Chinese to pillage the south of the country. Together they invaded Vietnam in 1128 and 1132. Further invasions followed in the subsequent decades.

Yeah, you are damn right, Viet is a real big actual threats to China and we should not look down you so much. Does that make you satisfied and feel better?