South China Sea Arbitration News & Discussion

[soundwave1987]

Yet, China hasn't play fair? Why did you even go to school in England? why didn't you stay in China and study there? So obviously, you did think the Education in England was better. Thus, the west influence is more comfortable for you. You know it, but you didn't fit into the culture because it was more difficult for you to adapt. I can agree with you on that. Chinese major cities all adopted Western influences. Tall buildings, roads, highways, speed trains, planes, etc. If China didn't absorb those things into Chinese culture, there would still be old ancient brick buildings and mud/straw houses. Your government has a bigger motive.



lol, go tell that to the VCP. I have nothing to do with that. Go blame them.

I went to england because there was a research program...England has better education for sure, but I’ve only been there for a year, my major education was in China. I don't know if it's fit to say this, I don't want to sound like racist but...like I said about the western medias, I kind of feeling about some sort of stereotype toward us Chinese maybe even eastern asain... I made westerner friends personally and they are really really nice ppl but to the public opinion,well, deep down, sometimes they misunderstand us, sometimes they underestimate us, and sometimes when we got achivements they sort of fear us. I met this Japanese guy at a meeting and talking about it man even the Japanese can feel the difference between "us" and "them", so it's really really hard to trust the intention of the Western (like the US) government, I feel like as a whole race they always want to "put us down"(not only China, but also the east subjects to the west), again that's only my personal opinion and I could be terribly wrong. But in case of that, anything that invloves the US we will keep an eye on it.

 

[barbarosa]

Well done by Pakistan.

 

[Zero_wing]

Am not one to generalize but people from this particular country can get real boastful at times. Impossible to discuss anything with them.

Well the chinese imperials saw themselves as superior to other people since they are an older civilization kuno as we filipinos would say but that just neo nazi thing for them let them do what they want as they say pride before a fall with the fast rate this arrogant fools stepping on other people toes they have whats coming to them.

 

[Reashot Xigwin]

India last years accepted an arbitration ruling wrt Bangladesh. Not exactly a glasshouse in this sense.

You guys also stopped the shipment of gas to Bhutan for reasons you don't approve. I mean how petty the indian government have to be to be that much of a dick to their neighbor?

China & India are cut from the same the cloth in these regard. Both of you are bullies.

 

[Solomon2]

China has 14 border sharing neighbors. India is the only country which China has land disputes with. It is India that has disputes with almost every neighbor. as for sea neighbor, Japan is the country who has island disputes with every single neighbor, China, Russia, N.Korea, S.Korea and Taiwan.

So in thirteen out of fourteen cases China negotiated its land borders, yes? But here we have a sea border that China has merely declared - and that in opposition to the obligations of the treaty China itself signed.

 

[+4vsgorillas-Apebane]

I must admit the legal team on the Philippines side was very strong.

One of the important things that the Philippines had won was that it made the Tribunal officially rule that China’s claims are invalid, both historically and legally.

The more interesting implications, that many people haven’t raised yet, is that how will China respond to other disputes like the one with Japan, or even if countries like the US send ships near its territoty water. Will China still invoke UNCLOS or laws like it had previously done?

Strong legal team? The Chinese side didnt even bother to send representation let alone acknowledge the legality of the court.

The Phillipines was preaching to the choir.

Once the SCS is settled Japan will be dealt with next. The Laws of the sea were created when China had no say or was in no position to question the slanted international order. No member of the P5 have ever allowed soverign issues to be settled by international courts. To expect China to adhere to European rulings is absurd.

China will fish in waters disputed by Japan while escorted by colossal coast guard vessels. The dispute will be settled by the larger ships for ramming, the strongest water cannons and the most fishing boats.

First your regional power not world power well not yet second you're not the US you ust another cheap sweatshop factory that is about to go down and lasty your screwed this well have long term effect for china so give it up your drone reasoning will not change peoples mind and china made a lot of enemies and they capitalized on this so please you're screwed

Here since 2012 and your writing still havent improved! You do know its extremely difficult for people to understand you right?

Still no punctuation, spelling and sentence structure.

 

[jha]

You guys also stopped the shipment of gas to Bhutan for reasons you don't approve. I mean how petty the indian government have to be to be that much of a dick to their neighbor?

China & India are cut from the same the cloth in these regard. Both of you are bullies.

You probably meant Nepal. Technically its their internal situation which forces trucks to not cross India-Nepal border. That matter may be discussed in another thread as this is off-topic for this thread.

 

[salarsikander]

Saying “unilateral imposed on you”, are you refering to the ruling made by the Tribunal?

If that is what you are referring to then its not truly unilateral because China had agreed to the UNCLOS with clause that says if there is a certain dispute, then a Tribunal can be set up to issue a legally binding ruling, even if one party does not participate. China claims that the Tribunal does not have jurisdiction over the case, but the UNCLOS also have a clause that say if any party don’t agree that the Tribunal has jurisdiction, then its still the Tribunal that gets the final say in having jurisdiction. Yep, thats what China had agreed to when it ratified UNCLOS.

So its not something unilaterally imposed on China, its actually something that China had previously agreed to when it ratified UNCLOS.

By same logic US too agreed to south sea china claim after ww2 and now its backing off

 

[beijingwalker]

So in thirteen out of fourteen cases China negotiated its land borders, yes? But here we have a sea border that China has merely declared - and that in opposition to the obligations of the treaty China itself signed.

China negotiated and solved all those land disputes directly with individual relevant countries and never accepts outside arbitration. That's the principle China holds from the very first day that PRC was established.

 

[beijingwalker]

First your regional power not world power well not yet second you're not the US you ust another cheap sweatshop factory that is about to go down and lasty your screwed this well have long term effect for china so give it up your drone reasoning will not change peoples mind and china made a lot of enemies and they capitalized on this so please you're screwed

China is the biggest industrial country , biggest manufacturing nation, biggest trading nation.... in the world, if you mean the world itself is a region then China is a regional power but still powerful enough to kick your butt whenever we want.

 

[William Hung]

Strong legal team? The Chinese side didnt even bother to send representation let alone acknowledge the legality of the court.

China had already acknowledge the legality of the court when it first ratified UNCLOS, because it has a clause that says the court/Tribunal gets the final say in whether it has jurisdiction over disputes.

Once the SCS is settled Japan will be dealt with next. The Laws of the sea were created when China had no say or was in no position to question the slanted international order. No member of the P5 have ever allowed soverign issues to be settled by international courts. To expect China to adhere to European rulings is absurd.

Deal with Japan? By appealing to UNCLOS?

http://interaksyon.com/article/432...row-with-japan-before-unclos-amid-war-jitters

HEADLINE: China brings islands row with Japan before UNCLOS amid war jitters

China will fish in waters disputed by Japan while escorted by colossal coast guard vessels. The dispute will be settled by the larger ships for ramming, the strongest water cannons and the most fishing boats.

Just a few weeks ago, Chinese Coast Guard ship that outsized the Indonesian ships, could only sit and watch as the Indonesian counter-part arrests chinese fishermen. China then later argues that Indonesia violated UNCLOS.

 

[salarsikander]

China negotiated and solved all those land disputes directly with individual relevant countries and never accepts outside arbitration. That's the principle China holds from the very first day that PRC was established.

Exactly never accepted anything imposed by a country that Can protect an illegal state of UN resolution and then go on to Destroy an entire country based on false pre-text of WMD

 

[Solomon2]

China negotiated and solved all those land disputes directly with individual relevant countries and never accepts outside arbitration. That's the principle China holds from the very first day that PRC was established.

Here, it is not merely the arbitration China rejects but the very content of a treaty it negotiated with its neighbors. For the ruling states, "to the extent China had historic rights to resources in the waters of the South China Sea, such rights were extinguished to the extent they were incompatible with the exclusive economic zones provided for in the Convention."

So it's not a dispute over borders at all. The argument of "historic fishing grounds", etc. that the Chinese gov't uses to justify itself to its people are themselves null and void.

 

[Jlaw]

Trust me, you will never understand until you leave China and live in USA. You will understand what freedom means. I'm sure you get your freedom in China and I'm sure they treated you well there. But the trade off is your thoughts to think freely for the freedom to live. Whereas, USA you retain the freedom to think freely and express openly and still live.

 

[Indos]

Newer generation should not become a follower of their anchestor into such fanatic. Use commont sense to break that bad mentality in order to adopt. But I think it is difficult to do so in a dictatorial regime.

Indonesia history has this kind of case when Soekarno want to grab Malaysia and Singapore since both nation were part of Majapahit kingdom long before the West invation and we were very powerful militarily at that time. British and other commonwealth nations come and prevent that happening. Many people then oppose him because of this and other reason (ideology)

Soeharto then let go this effort and set up ASEAN instead to grow our nation economy and geopolitics influence.A right decision.

The question is why China needs to do this...?

My answer:

China leadership get pressure from their own people, they need to look tough to preserve their power since it has already become powerful economically and militarily.

They clever people In the leadership get trapped and cannot play smart anymore as nationalist people in the leadership will take benefit if the smart ones do that. Its decision to include Indonesia ZEE is the prove of that since even though it is actually a very small area without real economic and strategic reason they still try to grab that by saying its traditional fishing ground retoric.

The resulth than can give more reason for the clever guy in the leadership to play smarth without too much risk. So the resulth is actually good for China. It will lift some political burden on leadership shoulder to play aggressive due to their people aspirations (which is derived from psychological needs)