Simitis: Turkey-Greece war would last 2 hours

[silko]

you are not well informed, Germany actually made money from Greece's bailout. The german taxpayers paid zilch .. i.e. nothing !!!

yeah right...

german tax payers payed 'zilch'.

that's why Germany and France keep making deals to "save" Greece from a bailout. they really have hope! idiots.

 

[silko]

you forgot the main points to add here,

-the bulk of Turkey (97%?) lies on the mainland Asia
-culturally and religiously Turks have more in common with Arabs, Iranians and other central Asian people than with Germans, Spanish or Norwegians.
-Turks are Muslims and Europeans will never allow a nation of 80 million odd Muslims (population still increasing) to join the EU.

and that means we aren't a part of Europe, even european countries aren't considered european anymore. 'hint' Faroe islands 'hint'

what we have in common doesn't determine what part of the world we belong to. Russia has more than 6/8 of it's land in Asia, yet it is considered a part of Europe.

i can make a list of why midget sarkozy and grandma merkele wont allow us. truth is, they are afraid of the power we will get if we join EU!

 

[amalakas]

yeah right...

german tax payers payed 'zilch'.

that's why Germany and France keep making deals to "save" Greece from a bailout. they really have hope! idiots.

I don't get you. Several german officials and finance people around the world has stated that clearly. The german taxpayers have paid nothing for the bailout of Greece.

If I am not mistaken, overall, Germany might have made 800 million to a billion in pure profit.

 

[Alienoz_TR]

Tell that a Turkish nationalist. Some people seriously still think that they're Turkic.

On the other hand our ancestors were (read the Quran folks) the enemies of Islam. Unfortunately we're not anymore.

You should have seen my mothers father. Ghenghis Khan's grand grand son )

 

[silko]

I don't get you. Several german officials and finance people around the world has stated that clearly. The german taxpayers have paid nothing for the bailout of Greece.

If I am not mistaken, overall, Germany might have made 800 million to a billion in pure profit.

i dont get you either.

how does this **** union thing work man! someone says this some other says that.

you keep making deals to save Greece and you earn money from it? it's like me giving someone 5 dollars and earning 5000 WTF?

 

[Gaara]

you forgot the main points to add here,

-the bulk of Turkey (97%?) lies on the mainland Asia
-culturally and religiously Turks have more in common with Arabs, Iranians and other central Asian people than with Germans, Spanish or Norwegians.
-Turks are Muslims and Europeans will never allow a nation of 80 million odd Muslims (population still increasing) to join the EU.

-Anatolia (especially Western parts) has always been considered as a part of Europe since ancient Greeks.
-I totaly agree and I don't think they will be ready for another 10 years (this is an optimistic guess, might be more than that) They are having troubles to accept such a huge muslim populated country because they subliminally believe Europe's religion is Christianity, which I don't understand. Christianity is a middle eastern religion just like Judaism and Islam.

 

[Porus]

and that means we aren't a part of Europe, even european countries aren't considered european anymore. 'hint' Faroe islands 'hint'

what we have in common doesn't determine what part of the world we belong to. Russia has more than 6/8 of it's land in Asia, yet it is considered a part of Europe.

What are you tlaking yout dude? Feroes Islands are in Europe and I have never seen anybody here in Europe claiming it otherwise.

The location of your country is crucial. Russia is more European than Turkey. 78% of Russia's population live in the European Russia, its capital and other major cities are located in Europe and it comprises almost 40% of Europe's landmass but still only that part is considered European that really lies within Europe. And I also don't see the Russians yearning to become a member of EU. I have few Russian friends and they prodly say that they are neither Europeans nor Asians and that they have no desire whatsoever of joing the EU. They have their own separate identity which they don't want to give up.

i can make a list of why midget sarkozy and grandma merkele wont allow us. truth is, they are afraid of the power we will get if we join EU!

And what is wrong with it. They built the EU out of scratch, they are holding it together and they are financing it. Therefore, they have every right to decide who comes in and who should be kept outside.

 

[what]

Well geographically speaking, Cyprus isn't Europe either. Plus Europe is not a continent per se. I think the old Greeks used the word first to describe Greece and the surrounding lands.

 

[Porus]

-Anatolia (especially Western parts) has always been considered as a part of Europe since ancient Greeks.
-I totaly agree and I don't think they will be ready for another 10 years (this is an optimistic guess, might be more than that) They are having troubles to accept such a huge muslim populated country because they subliminally believe Europe's religion is Christianity, which I don't understand. Christianity is a middle eastern religion just like Judaism and Islam.

hmmmm. If I am not wrong the ancient Greeks used to refer his region as Mikra Asia or Asia minor, right?

And here is an excerpt form Wiki which talks about the boundaries of the three continents drawn by the ancient Greeks.

Greek three continent system:
The original distinction between Europe and Asia was made by the ancient Greeks. They used the Aegean Sea, the Dardanelles, the Sea of Marmara, the Bosporus, the Black Sea, the Kerch Strait, and the Sea of Azov as the border between Asia and Europe. The Nile was often used as the border between Asia and Africa (then called Libya), although some Greek geographers suggested the Red Sea would form a better boundary.[7] Darius' canal between the Nile and the Red Sea introduced considerable variation in opinion. Under the Roman Empire, the Don River emptying into the Black Sea was the western border of Asia. It was the northernmost navigable point of the European shore.[citation needed] In the 15th century the Red Sea became established as the boundary between Africa and Asia, replacing the Nile. As exploration developed, the border between Asia and Europe had to be redefined, as the borders of the time did not extend to the arctic.[7]

---------- Post added at 04:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:47 AM ----------

Well geographically speaking, Cyprus isn't Europe either. Plus Europe is not a continent per se. I think the old Greeks used the word first to describe Greece and the surrounding lands.

Correct, but the Cypriots are basically Greeks and it has been allowed to join the EU for purely political reasons.

 

[amalakas]

hmmmm. If I am not wrong the ancient Greeks used to refer his region as Mikra Asia or Asia minor, right?

And here is an excerpt form Wiki which talks about the boundaries of the three continents drawn by the ancient Greeks.

Greek three continent system:
The original distinction between Europe and Asia was made by the ancient Greeks. They used the Aegean Sea, the Dardanelles, the Sea of Marmara, the Bosporus, the Black Sea, the Kerch Strait, and the Sea of Azov as the border between Asia and Europe. The Nile was often used as the border between Asia and Africa (then called Libya), although some Greek geographers suggested the Red Sea would form a better boundary.[7] Darius' canal between the Nile and the Red Sea introduced considerable variation in opinion. Under the Roman Empire, the Don River emptying into the Black Sea was the western border of Asia. It was the northernmost navigable point of the European shore.[citation needed] In the 15th century the Red Sea became established as the boundary between Africa and Asia, replacing the Nile. As exploration developed, the border between Asia and Europe had to be redefined, as the borders of the time did not extend to the arctic.[7]

---------- Post added at 04:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:47 AM ----------



Correct, but the Cypriots are basically Greeks and it has been allowed to join the EU for purely political reasons.

Israel is likely to join the EU , again for political reasons.

 

[amalakas]

i dont get you either.

how does this **** union thing work man! someone says this some other says that.

you keep making deals to save Greece and you earn money from it? it's like me giving someone 5 dollars and earning 5000 WTF?

Yes, welcome to the world of modern economics, or do you really think Greece gone bust because Greeks spent too much money in nightclubs and bouzoukia ?

12.5% of the entire German exports go to GREECE !!!!!!! do you get it? Naturally, Greece cannot pay for it, so it gets more money from Germany in loans.

So, think this out, you sell peanuts, I want to buy, they cost 10p, but I don't have to pay you, so you give me 10p with interest, in the end, you get the 10p, and another 15p in interest, and I have paid 25p for a peanut. net profit for you 15p.

but since I cannot make further payments on the 15p interest, you come to me and you give me another loan to pay the 15p, so I get 15p from you and I have to pay you back another 20! ..

get it now?

Germany has given us a billion, we owed them, 1.5billion, so the billion they gave us, goes back to them, plus another 500million from the Greek people, and the Greek people owes them now another interest for the the second billion they gave us.

get it now how they make profit ?

 

[Zulkarneyn]

What are you tlaking yout dude? Feroes Islands are in Europe and I have never seen anybody here in Europe claiming it otherwise.

The location of your country is crucial. Russia is more European than Turkey. 78% of Russia's population live in the European Russia, its capital and other major cities are located in Europe and it comprises almost 40% of Europe's landmass but still only that part is considered European that really lies within Europe. And I also don't see the Russians yearning to become a member of EU. I have few Russian friends and they prodly say that they are neither Europeans nor Asians and that they have no desire whatsoever of joing the EU. They have their own separate identity which they don't want to give up.




And what is wrong with it. They built the EU out of scratch, they are holding it together and they are financing it. Therefore, they have every right to decide who comes in and who should be kept outside.

The Turkish population has no desire to join the EU as well and we are proud of our nation and history. Plus no one indicated that we are "european". We just said that contemporary Turks are mostly Anatolian people, contrary to the belief that we came from the steps of the Altai mountains (Central Asia).

 

[Developereo]

Yes, welcome to the world of modern economics, or do you really think Greece gone bust because Greeks spent too much money in nightclubs and bouzoukia ?

12.5% of the entire German exports go to GREECE !!!!!!! do you get it? Naturally, Greece cannot pay for it, so it gets more money from Germany in loans.

So, think this out, you sell peanuts, I want to buy, they cost 10p, but I don't have to pay you, so you give me 10p with interest, in the end, you get the 10p, and another 15p in interest, and I have paid 25p for a peanut. net profit for you 15p.

but since I cannot make further payments on the 15p interest, you come to me and you give me another loan to pay the 15p, so I get 15p from you and I have to pay you back another 20! ..

get it now?

Germany has given us a billion, we owed them, 1.5billion, so the billion they gave us, goes back to them, plus another 500million from the Greek people, and the Greek people owes them now another interest for the the second billion they gave us.

get it now how they make profit ?

Except that Greece has no money to ever pay back. The talk RIGHT NOW in Brussels is about the near certainty of Greece defaulting. The German 'profit' is about as real as a dotcom business plan.

Germany is bailing out Greece, not because it makes any financial sense whatsoever, but because is is an ego thing. The entire raison d'être of the EU (and Euro) was a Franco-German attempt to challenge US (and USD) domination. On both counts, the attempt failed and any fissures within the EU would be unbearable to France and Germany.

 

[Zulkarneyn]

Except that Greece has no money to ever pay back. The talk RIGHT NOW in Brussels is about the near certainty of Greece defaulting. The German 'profit' is about as real as a dotcom business plan.

Germany is bailing out Greece, not because it makes any financial sense whatsoever, but because is is an ego thing. The entire raison d'être of the EU (and Euro) was a Franco-German attempt to challenge US (and USD) domination. On both counts, the attempt failed and any fissures within the EU would be unbearable to France and Germany.

I won't say that the euro failed as a whole. Euro € is a more valuable and solid currency than the american $, hence if the Euro's purpose of existence was to challenge the dollar, well it certainly succeeded in overwhelming the European market, plus keep in mind that the transaction between Euro countries and Asian countries including most of the Middle East is via the Euro. But i agree that Germany's bitter attempt to save or bailout Greece from total failure is to sustain the belief of EU's "success" story. Some consider the Union a success while others disregard it. I personally think that the EU has accelerated the economic growth of Europe drastically.

 

[Developereo]

I won't say that the euro failed as a whole. Euro € is a more valuable and solid currency than the american $, hence if the Euro's purpose of existence was to challenge the dollar, well it certainly succeeded in overwhelming the European market, plus keep in mind that the transaction between Euro countries and Asian countries including most of the Middle East is via the Euro. But i agree that Germany's bitter attempt to save or bailout Greece from total failure is to sustain the belief of EU's "success" story. Some consider the Union a success while others disregard it. I personally think that the EU has accelerated the economic growth of Europe drastically.

I don't know if those same economic benefits wouldn't have happened anyway with a simple free trade zone. I was referring to the intention behind the EU, which was to form a political block strong enough to challenge US dominance. On that score, the EU has failed; the US remains the spokesperson for the Western/developed world.

As for the Euro, the USD remains the world reserve currency, despite constant predictions of its demise. Only time will tell...