Should Pakistan sign an early deal for the Type-55 Destroyer ?

[kaonalpha]

Bhai 16-18 frigates??itna zaida??? 12 frigates mean at every 50 km u will 1 frigate at every 50km.....do u know what will happen???Indian navy will order 7+4 frigates of p 17 class + they will order another batch of 6 modern talwar class from russia that is equal to 12 present+12 p17a+ 6 talwars= to 30 major frigates just to save its face and if Pakistan gets type 55 then indian navy will try to get this

Its the latest russian destroyer baap of type 55


Kabhi chicken aur mutton bhi mana lia kar kutte saala hamari mata ki leraha hai.....sharaap lagega tujhe

You're referring to the Leader class destroyer nuclear powered. Russia is still in process of developing 12 of the destroyers for their Northern Fleet. China is also assisting them in that project. Type 55 will also be nuclear powered . Plus the leader class looks like a D***o fixed on top of that giant
Listen no offense to your Gao matta but jo maza beef me heh wo mutton or chicken me kahan ?

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

Bhai 16-18 frigates??itna zaida??? 12 frigates mean at every 50 km u will 1 frigate at every 50km.....do u know what will happen???Indian navy will order 7+4 frigates of p 17 class + they will order another batch of 6 modern talwar class from russia that is equal to 12 present+12 p17a+ 6 talwars= to 30 major frigates just to save its face and if Pakistan gets type 55 then indian navy will try to get this

Its the latest russian destroyer baap of type 55


Kabhi chicken aur mutton bhi mana lia kar kutte saala hamari mata ki leraha hai.....sharaap lagega tujhe

Well India can get what it likes, Pakistan would find a way to counter it. In a few years Indian Ocean would also be China's back yard. Myanmar Navy and Pakistan Navy is going to invest more and more on the Chinese Ships and Submarines. China would have its own Ships and Submarines bases in Sri lanka & Maldives. May be they would also get some more is yet to be known.

The current Ship building rate that China is much higher than India.

 

[abtank10]

You're referring to the Leader class destroyer nuclear powered. Russia is still in process of developing 12 of the destroyers for their Northern Fleet. China is also assisting them in that project. Type 55 will also be nuclear powered . Plus the leader class looks like a D***o fixed on top of that giant
Listen no offense to your Gao matta but jo maza beef me heh wo mutton or chicken me kahan ?

Sorry to say but this is not leader class......this is project 23560E SHKVAL destroyer, its conventional and will displace around 18000 tons will carry around 60-70 cruise missiles+ 128 SAM and that too S500, and also will have a 130mm forward Super rapid gun Mount......China is helping them with leader class.......this class will have an effective aegis system far better than chinese aegis........type 55 will be COGAG (combined gas and gas) and if its nuclear, then it will never be given to Pakistan thread close....... aur har din kya beef hi khata hai??? Kabhi shakahari bhi khaa liya kar...... Beef or pork chod ke sab khata hun mein aur ek baar meine bhi galti se bade ka meat khaa liya tha accha tha

Well India can get what it likes, Pakistan would find a way to counter it. In a few years Indian Ocean would also be China's back yard. Myanmar Navy and Pakistan Navy is going to invest more and more on the Chinese Ships and Submarines. China would have its own Ships and Submarines bases in Sri lanka & Maldives. May be they would also get some more is yet to be known.

The current Ship building rate that China is much higher than India.

China will be countered by USA if they enter IOR beyond their limits, india has a tri services command in A&N, p8 and brahmos have been placed their......US ship building capability in war cannot be matched by china even in 100 years........Myanmar and Pakistan cannot compete against indian navy in IOR u need to have main surface combatants.....u cannot keep ur ships far away from home ports without stretching ur logistics...... Chinese military ports in IOR is nightmare for Indian.....will not happen that easily......also IOR will remain indias backyard until India falls completely and that will be dooms day for south asia

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

China will be countered by USA if they enter IOR beyond their limits, india has a tri services command in A&N, p8 and brahmos have been placed their......US ship building capability in war cannot be matched by china even in 100 years........Myanmar and Pakistan cannot compete against indian navy in IOR u need to have main surface combatants.....u cannot keep ur ships far away from home ports without stretching ur logistics...... Chinese military ports in IOR is nightmare for Indian.....will not happen that easily......also IOR will remain indias backyard until India falls completely and that will be dooms day for south asia

Well at present PN or Myanmar Navy is not as lethal as it should be but what do you think about 10-15yrs down the line?
An you are agreeing that Chinese build up in Indian Ocean is a nightmare.

These would be interesting for you to read
U.S. Navy Take Notice: China is Becoming a World-Class Military Shipbuilder | The Diplomat

The link below is a pdf file which is of Gabriel Collins and Lieutenant Commander Michael C. Grubb, U.S. Navy.
Lieutenant Commander Michael Grubb is a submarine officer currently stationed in Bangor, Washington. He worked on this study as a student at the Naval War College during 2006–2007. Another of his student papers, entitled “Merchant Shipping in a Chinese Blockade of Taiwan,” was published in the Winter 2007 edition of Naval War College Review. He received a BSE degree in naval architecture and marine engineering from the University of Michigan and has previously served aboard the USS Miami (SSN 755) and on the staff of Destroyer Squadron 22.

https://www.usnwc.edu/Research---Ga...ublications/documents/CMS1_Collins-Grubb.aspx

 

[Humble Analyst]

Oh brother how about some super sonic missles???
Go to scorpene submarine section.....Exocet and harpoon's are of no use now.....they are subsonic missiles and can be intercepted by modern SAM's, even china has made a supersonic missile, and barak 8 is worlds best SAM......and welcome if new member and welcome back if old member
When did i say that jodhpur sukhoi's will go and fight over nepal??? They are closer to karachi and can be used to bomb harbour...... Thats what i said


Hahahahahhaah kya bana hai???
Mujhe nahi bulayega???

Thank you for welcoming and I am a new member.
We count on SU30MKIs being used however after initial sorties it will be fun to get them back in the air. The will be welcomed properly and please do not assume that they will use stand off weapons as if visiting Jehangir Art galley or flying over Nepal. Now looking at your previous posts I know your answer but that makes it fun.
Pakistan is aware of missiles and you will enjoy the responses. Weapons are always effective provided appropriate tactics are used considering the target and its defenses. What we do need is to increase interceptors and especially some planes which can counter Rafales. Thank you very much for the concern

Oh brother how about some super sonic missles???
Go to scorpene submarine section.....Exocet and harpoon's are of no use now.....they are subsonic missiles and can be intercepted by modern SAM's, even china has made a supersonic missile, and barak 8 is worlds best SAM......and welcome if new member and welcome back if old member
When did i say that jodhpur sukhoi's will go and fight over nepal??? They are closer to karachi and can be used to bomb harbour...... Thats what i said

Thank you for welcoming.
Sure thank you for asking we will get supersonic missiles do not really need if proper tactics are used but just for your sake we will get supersonic if that is what you like.

Hahahahahhaah kya bana hai???
Mujhe nahi bulayega???

 

[abtank10]

Thank you for welcoming and I am a new member.
We count on SU30MKIs being used however after initial sorties it will be fun to get them back in the air. The will be welcomed properly and please do not assume that they will use stand off weapons as if visiting Jehangir Art galley or flying over Nepal. Now looking at your previous posts I know your answer but that makes it fun.
Pakistan is aware of missiles and you will enjoy the responses. Weapons are always effective provided appropriate tactics are used considering the target and its defenses. What we do need is to increase interceptors and especially some planes which can counter Rafales. Thank you very much for the concern

you can do anything as per your requirement, but what if u can not see the enemy, Karachi is hardly 319 kilometers from rajasthan and 210 from Gujarat......as u must be knowing brahmos is terrain hugging missile, it would be hard for u to intercept and also simultaneous attack from navy and air force would ensure that if some missiles are intercepted rest all hit their targets.........like i said before subsonic missiles give a lot of time and can be easily targeted by fighter jets....its useless to use until it holds very close to ground like Pakistani RAAD.....its a very fine cruise missile....but still u need to have an ace up-to ur sleeve and we have many of them

Well at present PN or Myanmar Navy is not as lethal as it should be but what do you think about 10-15yrs down the line?
An you are agreeing that Chinese build up in Indian Ocean is a nightmare.

These would be interesting for you to read
U.S. Navy Take Notice: China is Becoming a World-Class Military Shipbuilder | The Diplomat

The link below is a pdf file which is of Gabriel Collins and Lieutenant Commander Michael C. Grubb, U.S. Navy.
Lieutenant Commander Michael Grubb is a submarine officer currently stationed in Bangor, Washington. He worked on this study as a student at the Naval War College during 2006–2007. Another of his student papers, entitled “Merchant Shipping in a Chinese Blockade of Taiwan,” was published in the Winter 2007 edition of Naval War College Review. He received a BSE degree in naval architecture and marine engineering from the University of Michigan and has previously served aboard the USS Miami (SSN 755) and on the staff of Destroyer Squadron 22.

https://www.usnwc.edu/Research---Ga...ublications/documents/CMS1_Collins-Grubb.aspx

yes i completely agree that Chinese buildup is a nightmare for Indian navy because China has 3 times ships in every department like 24 destroyers vs 10, 47 frigates vs 15, and yes 69 submarines vs just 15...........Chinese armada is massive they can put in half of their fleet in war and still win the war this is only if they get proper replenishment and logistics.....thats why India is trying every possible way to not let them have any base outside china........
ship building capabilities are very much advance but still it would take china 15 years to come to the level of sophistication US navy got....... They stand second to non......I as an Indian respect what they have done till now, but I don't like their expansionist ideology......lalch badi kutti cheez hai saali dubake chodegi.....

 

[ACE OF THE AIR]

yes i completely agree that Chinese buildup is a nightmare for Indian navy because China has 3 times ships in every department like 24 destroyers vs 10, 47 frigates vs 15, and yes 69 submarines vs just 15...........Chinese armada is massive they can put in half of their fleet in war and still win the war this is only if they get proper replenishment and logistics.....thats why India is trying every possible way to not let them have any base outside china........
ship building capabilities are very much advance but still it would take china 15 years to come to the level of sophistication US navy got....... They stand second to non......I as an Indian respect what they have done till now, but I don't like their expansionist ideology......lalch badi kutti cheez hai saali dubake chodegi.....

Well there is always a limit to what one can do...India is trying desperately in improving her own defenses where as China is one step ahead. Even though India is trying to find a way to stop neighboring countries from giving their territories to China for naval ports and rights to naval ships.

What ever ones says to the economy of India can not spent USD 100 billion on other countries and send her troops and naval ships because they require these USD 100 billion for improving their on population safety and security. Unfortunately this is a reality.

China is willing to spend USD 500million in friendly countries so if they give Pakistan & Myanmar each USD 100 Billion, 50 bill each to Maldives & Sri Lanka still 300 bill is available for naval expansion in the Indian Ocean. This my friend would became much more that night mare.

India is going to make Chabahar a naval hub but that is only till July because that is the time the sanctions are lifted. What will this do is that China would jump in and take on this port as well linking it with Gawader. The Airforce Army and Navy of Iran would also be provided by various equipment bringing it in line with the world. The revolutionary guards would be brought up to par with the help of Russia, Turkey and Pakistan. The Influence of this force would increase so that it can control the ISIS threat in Iraq and Syria.

The Global economy works on wars other wise it slows down and the world is still trying to recover from that slowdown, so it must go to war. NATO is rearming, China is flexing, Russia is developing, India is reeling to find a true partner, the Arab's are in local conflicts, Latin America is finding the true potential and Pakistan is seeing gimps of day light at the horizon in the fight against the Terrorist. Welcome to the new frontier...

 

[abtank10]

Well there is always a limit to what one can do...India is trying desperately in improving her own defenses where as China is one step ahead. Even though India is trying to find a way to stop neighboring countries from giving their territories to China for naval ports and rights to naval ships.

What ever ones says to the economy of India can not spent USD 100 billion on other countries and send her troops and naval ships because they require these USD 100 billion for improving their on population safety and security. Unfortunately this is a reality.

China is willing to spend USD 500million in friendly countries so if they give Pakistan & Myanmar each USD 100 Billion, 50 bill each to Maldives & Sri Lanka still 300 bill is available for naval expansion in the Indian Ocean. This my friend would became much more that night mare.

India is going to make Chabahar a naval hub but that is only till July because that is the time the sanctions are lifted. What will this do is that China would jump in and take on this port as well linking it with Gawader. The Airforce Army and Navy of Iran would also be provided by various equipment bringing it in line with the world. The revolutionary guards would be brought up to par with the help of Russia, Turkey and Pakistan. The Influence of this force would increase so that it can control the ISIS threat in Iraq and Syria.

The Global economy works on wars other wise it slows down and the world is still trying to recover from that slowdown, so it must go to war. NATO is rearming, China is flexing, Russia is developing, India is reeling to find a true partner, the Arab's are in local conflicts, Latin America is finding the true potential and Pakistan is seeing gimps of day light at the horizon in the fight against the Terrorist. Welcome to the new frontier...

India if forced or threatened can pull its budget to 5.4% of economy, that is close to around $115 billion....but since India at present does not count china as a fierce enemy it does not directly involves in an arms race......india is the only country which can replace china as the world manufacturer of cheap goods, as china is growing old, india is the only option world will have after china surpasses 2035.....we have resources, land, labour and everything required to be manufacturing hub within next 20 years...... Indian navy is planning to build a navy with 200+ major warships excluding petrol boats , auxiliary ships and LST's.......at present only 4 shipyards are working and rest 6 have no work at all.....if these 6 too get orders.....we will be able to produce 3/4 amount of what China produces......CSL is asking navy if they want another aircraft carrier of 40000 tons......they will make it within 4 years including commissioning of the ship by 2020.......if navy nods we will have 3 carriers by 2020 and another 2 within 2025

 

[Zarvan]

Bhai 16-18 frigates??itna zaida??? 12 frigates mean at every 50 km u will 1 frigate at every 50km.....do u know what will happen???Indian navy will order 7+4 frigates of p 17 class + they will order another batch of 6 modern talwar class from russia that is equal to 12 present+12 p17a+ 6 talwars= to 30 major frigates just to save its face and if Pakistan gets type 55 then indian navy will try to get this

Its the latest russian destroyer baap of type 55


Kabhi chicken aur mutton bhi mana lia kar kutte saala hamari mata ki leraha hai.....sharaap lagega tujhe

After Gawader we need to have bigger role also in case of helping a Muslim country we need bigger Navy

 

[abtank10]

After Gawader we need to have bigger role also in case of helping a Muslim country we need bigger Navy

Chinese navy would ensure that their power supplies and national commodities are not compromised.......pakistan would first have to control or finish terrorism until this happens.....neither will the economy grow nor will navy get a good budget...... Long term solution “leave Kashmir and settle down for good"........otherwise ye sab aur 200 saal tak chal sakta hai.......somebody has to compromise and it is a law that weaker person sorts the thing out after compromising.....think about it just for a piece of land u country would loose it existence....... And if China goes to war with USA in near future “GENTLE MEN INDIA WOULD BE STANDING WITH RUSSIA AND CHINA".........

 

[Humble Analyst]

you can do anything as per your requirement, but what if u can not see the enemy, Karachi is hardly 319 kilometers from rajasthan and 210 from Gujarat......as u must be knowing brahmos is terrain hugging missile, it would be hard for u to intercept and also simultaneous attack from navy and air force would ensure that if some missiles are intercepted rest all hit their targets.........like i said before subsonic missiles give a lot of time and can be easily targeted by fighter jets....its useless to use until it holds very close to ground like Pakistani RAAD.....its a very fine cruise missile....but still u need to have an ace up-to ur sleeve and we have many of them


yes i completely agree that Chinese buildup is a nightmare for Indian navy because China has 3 times ships in every department like 24 destroyers vs 10, 47 frigates vs 15, and yes 69 submarines vs just 15...........Chinese armada is massive they can put in half of their fleet in war and still win the war this is only if they get proper replenishment and logistics.....thats why India is trying every possible way to not let them have any base outside china........
ship building capabilities are very much advance but still it would take china 15 years to come to the level of sophistication US navy got....... They stand second to non......I as an Indian respect what they have done till now, but I don't like their expansionist ideology......lalch badi kutti cheez hai saali dubake chodegi.....

Lalach baree kuttee cheez hay agree, that is why instead of expansionist attitude the region should try to improve the condition of their people. It is amazing that instead of accepting the fact that neighbors especially nuclear neighbors should live like neighbors we are always flexing muscles. So as long as India will continue this approach the region will be under the threat of nuclear war. But if humans were wise the History would not have flaws.

 

[abtank10]

Lalach baree kuttee cheez hay agree, that is why instead of expansionist attitude the region should try to improve the condition of their people. It is amazing that instead of accepting the fact that neighbors especially nuclear neighbors should live like neighbors we are always flexing muscles. So as long as India will continue this approach the region will be under the threat of nuclear war. But if humans were wise the History would not have flaws.

Its high time that all of us start solving the border problems, but Kashmir ka problem bhut complex hai.......the people change their mind every year, sometimes they with Pakistan and sometimes they are with India.......if Kashmir came into our territory....china will have to give back all territory which was given to them during their reign..... Aksai chin and AP ka bhi bhut complex problem hai.....we need to have some final conclusion to this problem.... Either we have to leave AP or we leave aksai chin.....both are possible...... China will never leave their stance.....

 

[BetterPakistan]

I feel improved Type 052B destroyer will be a good option. We can go for 2 of these destroyers.

 

[Arsalan]

I feel improved Type 052B destroyer will be a good option. We can go for 2 of these destroyers.

Nice!

And thank you for sharing your views on a thread that is TWO YEARS OLD.

Bahi last post ke date to dekh lea krain.

 

[m3milk]

No offense, but I just don't understand why Indians are so proud of their Kolkata class destroyers. It took the Indians more than 10 years to build one ship. And today Indian navy only has 3 Kolkata. This speed is totally unacceptable in China. We already have six 052c and six 052d serving in our navy, and seven more 052d are coming in less than 2 years. And four 055 is under construction, and at least one of them will hit the water in this year.

And let us take a closer look of the Kolkata: radar(made in Israel), air missile(made in Israel), VLS(made in Russia), engine(made in Ukraine), steel(made in Russia), command system(Canada), design(Italy). Only assembled in India. I am wondering what Indians gonna to do when they lost one ship during the war time, they definitely are not able to build a new one immediately at their own factory.
It is no shame to use other country's technology, but make sure you can manufacture them at your home, weapons are not smart phones. I highly suspect that the Indian high officials took large amount of commissions in arm trade with foreigners.

And for my Pakistan brothers, I don't think 055 is suitable for PN. It is too large and too expensive to buy and operate, it was designed to protect aircraft carriers. I guess China would like to export Aegis destroyers 052c/d to Pakistan in the foreseeable future.
Honestly we really hope Pakistan could have a strong military and become the leader of the Sunni muslim world. We don't have any positive feelings regarding the Saudis and Turks. Especially the Turks, they detained the Varyag for more than a year when the ship was towing back to China, and they gave us the permission to passed their sea only after we offered a huge amount of money and military technology. Their action delayed the service of our first aircraft carrier 001 for at least a year. No wonder people in Chinese navy dislike the Turks today.