Secularists should 'mend ways or leave country', says PTI lawmaker

[Verve]

Khilafat based electoral system (Presidential system), select one leader directly, needs to happen.

Interest based economy needs to be demolished.

Minorities given full protection.

Land reforms (out goes vadera system) and wealth redistribution.

And much more that's already in the Constitution but those parts discarded by the vadera ruling elite.

Fear of targeting minorities is just propaganda? Please tell that to the survivors of Joseph Colony. And many others besides.

The system is not in place yet. I'm talking of when it is.

Don't be so bloody impatient.

 

[VCheng]

Yeah, when utter perfection will be achieved. There will be rainbows in the skies every day too, I bet. 70 years, and nobody has a frigging clue as to what they want.

Select a Khalifa? Not elect, select. Right. I need to see this happen.

 

[T-Rex]

Yeah, when utter perfection will be achieved. There will be rainbows in the skies every day too, I bet. 70 years, and nobody has a frigging clue as to what they want.

Perfection can never be achieved but one has to strive for it and that makes us who we are. Pessimists have no place in the fold of Islam.

Khilafat based electoral system (Presidential system), select one leader directly, needs to happen.

Interest based economy needs to be demolished.

Minorities given full protection.

Land reforms (out goes vadera system) and wealth redistribution.

And much more that's already in the Constitution but those parts discarded by the vadera ruling elite.



The system is not in place yet. I'm talking of when it is.

Don't be so bloody impatient.

Yes, something like that is worth living for, fighting for.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

SAH sb,

So national consensus on the nature of Pakistan will be determined by Hindu extremists next door?

An interesting point you make, sir. I hear echos of this thought here too- India must be a Hindu state, because Pakistan is a Muslim state, if Hindus are oppressed there, Muslims must be oppressed here.

It is extraordinary. The whole purpose of Partition was that "Muslim" Pakistan and "Hindu majority" India could attain and define statehood without interference from the other. If the state of affairs in Pakistan/India were to be determined by state of affairs in the significant Other, what was the point of it all.

Regards

 

[VCheng]

So the OP wanted those with different views to leave the country. The uberzealots wants them to leave Islam. How boringly predictable!



Let's see an all ulema conference agree on a draft Islamic Constitution and present a plan to actually implement it.

SAH sb,

So national consensus on the nature of Pakistan will be determined by Hindu extremists next door?

An interesting point you make, sir. I hear echos of this thought here too- India must be a Hindu state, because Pakistan is a Muslim state, if Hindus are oppressed there, Muslims must be oppressed here.

It is extraordinary. The whole purpose of Partition was that "Muslim" Pakistan and "Hindu majority" India could attain and define statehood without interference from the other. If the state of affairs in Pakistan/India were to be determined by state of affairs in the significant Other, what was the point of it all.

Regards

What was the point of it all? Great question!

It is up to both Pakistan and India to realize the answers to that question.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

Verve,

Minorities given full protection.

Good point. But first we must have a consensus on who minorities are. Do Ahmedis qualify as minority? or majority?

Regards

 

[Verve]

70 years, and nobody has a frigging clue as to what they want.

Your job is to spread despair. Country you live in now didn't turn around in 70 years. Pakistan is a young country. Look what happened to secular India - Fascists have taken over in 70 years!

Issue is people like you, the vaderas and the mullah brigade who oppose such a system. Grid rid and it'll work out just fine.

Majority population, if given an honest chance, wouldn't hesitate to opt for the new system.

It'll happen. Vaderas are in trouble. Mullahs are being muted gradually and your kind is too small and will easily be managed in due course.

 

[VCheng]

If fascists have taken over India, then Islamists have taken over Pakistan, equally.

And does anyone think the vaderas will let such changes happen? Even the Army will not let the existing system change.

My job is only to show the reality, good, bad or ugly, but reality. Somebody has to do it since everyone is lock step marching with eyes closed.

 

[Verve]

Verve,

Minorities given full protection.

Good point. But first we must have a consensus on who minorities are. Do Ahmedis qualify as minority? or majority?

Regards

Now that their Prophet/Messiah is dead and it has been proven that he wasn't Jesus, there needs to be a conversation with their current leaders.

I do not think they should claim to be Muslims whilst claiming their dead leader to be a Prophet reincarnated.

If that's allowed, we will have many more claiming be Prophets. Distortion of Islam in such a way is a No Go area, in my opinion.

If fascists have taken over India, then Islamists have taken over Pakistan, equally.

And does anyone think the vaderas will let such changes happen? Even the Army will not let the existing system change.

My job is only to show the reality, good, bad or ugly, but reality. Somebody has to do it since everyone is lock step marching with eyes closed.

No scope for Hope?

No scope for Allah's rehmat?

Doom only?

 

[VCheng]

May be it is Allah's qaher that has made Pakistan the way it is?

 

[Verve]

And Allah's rehmat will fix it too, how it is destined to be.

Past 70 years have been a lesson, because we didn't follow Jinnah and Iqbal. And now we have one leader who is a strong believer in Jinnah and Iqbal, more will be born too.

It's not too late but you are a Doom Preacher so you will disagree, naturally.

 

[VCheng]

All evidence seems to indicate that absolutely no lessons have been actually learned in the past 70 years, despite claims to the contrary.

 

[Verve]

All evidence seems to indicate that absolutely no lessons have been actually learned in the past 70 years, despite claims to the contrary.

Were there any such improvement signs in Mecca?

Were there any signs before Iqbal and Jinnah that Pakistan would be (other than those foretold a muslim country much before them)?

Keep looking for signs with a Doom bias and go crazy in the process

 

[VCheng]

It's okay. Events will show who is right or not, soon enough. I am patient.

 

[M. Sarmad]

Past 70 years have been a lesson, because we didn't follow Jinnah and Iqbal.

People need to come back to the message Jinnah and Iqbal gave and work on that.

''''''
Message is of Quran being the source of all laws and that every aspect of LIFE is covered in there.

Exactly,

In Jinnah's Muslim Pakistan, the Law Minister was a Hindu, the Foreign Minister was an Ahmadi, and the Commander in Chief of Army was a Christian.

Jinnah categorically stated that Ahmadis were Muslims if they said they were Muslims, and no one, not even the sovereign legislature had a right to say otherwise. So in Jinnah's Muslim Pakistan, Ahmadis are Muslims.

In Jinnah's Pakistan religion is not the business of the state. And everyone is the equal citizen of the state regardless of what religion he/she is.

Are you sure that Jinnah's Muslim Pakistan (based of course on Qur'anic principle of absolute equality of mankind) is acceptable to you ?

Land reforms (out goes vadera system) and wealth redistribution.

Bro, do you know who did not let ordinary peasant in Pakistan benefit from Land Reforms introduced by different governments ?? ..... The Mullahs !!! ........ Land Reforms have been declared un-Islamic by the Shariat Appellate Bench of the Supreme Court of Islamic Republic of Pakistan (Qazalbash Waqf v. Chief Land Commissioner, Punjab and others – reported as PLD 1990 SC 99) ..................