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Saudi Prince Mohammad optimistic about F-35 deal

The SC

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20 Jan 2016
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Saudi Deputy Crown Prince Mohammad Bin Salman Bin Abdulaziz, who also acts as Defence Minister, is said to be showing optimism about the possibility of concluding a deal with the Pentagon for the Lockheed Martin F-35 aircraft in favor of the Royal Saudi Air Force (RSAF).

http://www.tacticalreport.com/view_news/Saudi-Prince-Mohammad-optimistic-about-F-35-deal/4884
 
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If that is the case, then RSAF's strength will be quite substantial..

I see absolutely no reason for Saudiya not to get the F-35. She's been one of the top US economic partners for over half a century. What's the first country visited by firstly elected US presidents the last 3 times, or more?

The days of Israel taking temper tantrums are over. Ba- bye.

Not only get them, but get them in huge numbers AND, at a very reasonable price. No more top dollar rates, considering all the recent arms purchases.

$65 million per AC for 110 aircraft of the next batch that will have more of the bugs worked out (with an option for 100 more), 10 simulators, the entire package of weapons, training pilots and maintenance and a commitment to upgrade the software as it progresses in time.

Try to negotiate for the C model as it appears that will be the better of the trio.
This will ruffle some people's feathers, lol. @The SC
 
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I see absolutely no reason for Saudiya not to get the F-35. She's been one of the top US economic partners for over half a century. What's the first country visited by firstly elected US presidents the last 3 times, or more?

The days of Israel taking temper tantrums are over. Ba- bye.

Not only get them, but get them in huge numbers AND, at a very reasonable price. No more top dollar rates, considering all the recent arms purchases.

$65 million per AC for 110 aircraft of the next batch that will have more of the bugs worked out (with an option for 100 more), 10 simulators, the entire package of weapons, training pilots and maintenance and a commitment to upgrade the software as it progresses in time.

Try to negotiate for the C model as it appears that will be the better of the trio.
This will ruffle some people's feathers, lol. @The SC

Thanks. I think that it is somehow an indisputable foreign policy for the US to make sure that Israel's capabilities are always better than any other ME country. Therefore, if we will ever get the F-35, we will get them after Israel.
 
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Thanks. I think that it is somehow an indisputable foreign policy for the US to make sure that Israel's capabilities are always better than any other ME country. Therefore, if we will ever get the F-35, we will get them after Israel.

Do you mean when Israel gets her entire first batch of 20 - 75 something and has them for a while? She's already received 3 and 2 more on their way soon. Supposedly Israel is a SCP with Singapore in the JSF program, the lowest level and is paying close to 0 for these jets. All this and Turkey is just getting her first one assembled after contributing what, $11 billion as a level 3 partner?
 
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Thanks. I think that it is somehow an indisputable foreign policy for the US to make sure that Israel's capabilities are always better than any other ME country. Therefore, if we will ever get the F-35, we will get them after Israel.
but Israel is your friend. so why is there a problem?
 
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Warning, this article below is from Global Security.

Royal Saudi Air Force F-35
sa-rsaf.gif


As of 2017 the most significant Saudi air force modernization effort remained unmentioned in public. Saudi Arabia is one of the world's leading military powers. In 2015 Saudi Arabia overtook Russia for third place in military spending, partially due to its engagement in the Yemen conflict and the depreciation of the Russian ruble. The Saudis will covet fifth-generation stealth fighters, the coin of the realm for air combat.

The United States will not sell the F-35 stealth fighter to the Saudis. At some point in the 2020 timeframe, Saudi Arabia will turn to China, which has previously supplied the Suadis with long-range ballistic missiles. China is perfectly willing to sell their J-31 Stealth Fighter, along with no complaints about Saudi human rights practices. China needs Saudi oil, and the Saudis need a major security partner, now that the United States has decided to withdraw from East of Suez.

Initially there were projections that the Saudis might acquire as many as 100 F-35 Joint Strike Fighters. This would have been in line with prior acquisitions of the F-15, even though the Israeli Air Force also operated the F-15. The Israeli F-15s had capabilities that the Saudi F-15s did not, preserving Israel’s qualitative military edge (QME). The US has no committment to preserve a Saudi qualitative military edge. In late 2015, the Obama Administration made numerous statements that Israel would be the only recipient of the F-35 in the region.

The United States had served as the primary arms provider for Saudi Arabia until Britain supplanted it in 1988. Following the Gulf War, however, the United States again emerged as Saudi Arabia’s primary arms supplier. In 1998 US military exports to Saudi Arabia totaled US$4.3 billion, making Saudi Arabia the leading importer of US military goods.

When questioned on what the likely effect of British arms sale to the Saudi Arabia would mean to US marketing efforts, US-Saudi relations and the Middle East military balance, Richard Armitage, Assistant Secretary of Defense answered 13 July 1988:

"In my view there are four principal outcomes resulting from the replacement of the U.S. by other suppliers in major arms transactions with moderate, pro-Western Arab states.


    • Israeli "worst case" contingency planning becomes complicated by the delivery and deployment of advanced systems (aircraft and missiles) over which the United States has no residual control in terms of basing, configuration, and follow-on support,
    • The United States loses political influence with moderate Arab states when a third party assumes the role of principal supplier of defense equipment,
    • US contingency planning, based as it is on the necessity of regional friends to take the lead in their own self-defense, becomes complicated by the loss of systems interzperability.
  1. The loss of income and jobs to U.S. industry and American labor is a gratuitous, self-inflicteI wound which has absolutely no compensatory aspects."


Experience demonstrated time and again that when the US. is unable to respond, other governments are more than ready and able to do so-—whether it be with British Tornado fighter bombers, which Saudi Arabia bought when it could not get additional US F-15 fighters, even without ground attack capability, or the Soviet handheld SA-7 and SA-l4 antiaircraft missiles supplied to certain Gulf states when the US was unwilling to provide portable antiaircraft weapons, such as the Stinger.

If the Saudi government asked to buy the F-35, the question facing the US would not be whether the Saudis would acquire such weapons systems, but from which country they would buy it, and which country would have a dominant position in the Saudi military planning for several decades. While the American technology is superior, the US does not have a monopoly on high technology. Both China and Russia would be eager to take the place of the US as the principal supplier to the Saudi military, a position that had already been seriously eroded in the past decades.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/gulf/f-35ksa.htm

BTW I think it is a question of time before we will see a F-35 in the arsenal of RSAF. Even more convinced after MBS's recent appointment as Crown Prince.

Old article:

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-airshow-dubai-fighters-idUSBRE9AK14Z20131121

@Bubblegum Crisis see this thread. Thanks.

If that is the case, then RSAF's strength will be quite substantial..

It already is my friend.

but Israel is your friend. so why is there a problem?

Of course, genius.

Israel didn't know about the weapons sale ahead of time, says Lapid, and it gives the Saudis offensive cyber capabilities that could be directed against the Jewish state


Lapid: Entire Israeli security establishment is worried by Trump’s Saudi arms deal

Kowtowing to US president, Netanyahu left Israel vulnerable by failing to prevent or even criticize massive, dangerous DC-Riyadh accord, says Yesh Atid leader

http://www.timesofisrael.com/lapid-...ishment-is-worried-by-trumps-saudi-arms-deal/
 
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It isn't. Even if it is, both the US and Israel won't fully believe in it.

Indeed.

KSA and Israel might be neighbors (more or less) but we have literally no ties. No economic cooperation, no cooperation people-to-people, total opposite views of the Palestinian "question", competing against each other (along with the remaining GCC) on many fronts, for instance attracting businesses, investments etc.

The only thing that we have in common is the distrust and negative view of the Iranian Wilayat al-Faqih Mullah regime and their actions in the region which is something that the vast majority of Arab, Muslim and in fact world countries also have, hence why Iran and Iranians, aside from being sanctioned and isolated by much of the world and distrusted by all world powers, only are seen positively by one single country in the world, which is apparently Pakistan, which this forum certainly does not confirm but rather the opposite. So this says nothing really.

Israel will not look at any Arab country, not even those that have official ties to her (Egypt and Jordan), as friends or partners as long as the Palestinian question is not solved.

Israel knows perfectly well that the Arab people have very negative views of Israel for obvious reasons.

So I always laugh at this nonsense.
 
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I see absolutely no reason for Saudiya not to get the F-35. She's been one of the top US economic partners for over half a century. What's the first country visited by firstly elected US presidents the last 3 times, or more?

The days of Israel taking temper tantrums are over. Ba- bye.

Not only get them, but get them in huge numbers AND, at a very reasonable price. No more top dollar rates, considering all the recent arms purchases.

$65 million per AC for 110 aircraft of the next batch that will have more of the bugs worked out (with an option for 100 more), 10 simulators, the entire package of weapons, training pilots and maintenance and a commitment to upgrade the software as it progresses in time.

Try to negotiate for the C model as it appears that will be the better of the trio.
This will ruffle some people's feathers, lol. @The SC

Israel is front-and-center of US Middle East policy, no matter how much Saudi Arabia spends on buying US military equipment, past or present. Every sale to an Arab country in the Middle East has an Israeli stamp of approval on it. Truth be told, there is genuine bipartisan love for Israel in Washington. Saudi Arabia, on the other hand, not so much. They are merely tolerated.

As for Saudi Arabia acquiring the F-35, this will happen...and they will pay top dollar. The Saudis always do.
 
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Israel is front-and-center of US Middle East policy, no matter how much Saudi Arabia spends on buying US military equipment, past or present. Every sale to an Arab country in the Middle East has an Israeli stamp of approval on it. Truth be told, there is genuine bipartisan love for Israel in Washington. Saudi Arabia, on the other hand, not so much. They are merely tolerated.

As for Saudi Arabia acquiring the F-35, this will happen...and they will pay top dollar. The Saudis always do.

Yes, not everyone can receive free billion big military aid like Israel and have a carte blanche to act like an apartheid state. So of course we will have to pay. Like EVERY other country expect for the slimy leech that is Israel. KSA is not a leech. Rather the opposite.











Your hard-earned taxes are going to Israel.

Everything clear now?
 
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Israel is front-and-center of US Middle East policy, no matter how much Saudi Arabia spends on buying US military equipment, past or present. Every sale to an Arab country in the Middle East has an Israeli stamp of approval on it.

That's actually not true. The Israelis jumped up and down to try and block not only the first batch of 154 F-15's to Saudi Arabia, but the recent 72 F-15S frames and were basically ignored both times. The Israelis even had the audacity to try and prevent the upgrade package to the first batch of F-15's and were brushed aside. So this 'stamp of approval' might apply to some other states, such as Egypt, but not in Saudiya's case.

Truth be told, there is genuine bipartisan love for Israel in Washington. Saudi Arabia, on the other hand, not so much.

I don't think any rational person would deny that. But there are much more beneficial elements to arms deals that go well beyond D.C.'s bipartisan love for Israel's interests. Mainly the monopoly of these arms deals. The days where US arms were the better & only available choice in a business that involves hundreds of billions of dollars worth of contracts that can extend into decades worth of economic investments and returns, and the all-important strategic hegemony, has dwindled a little bit for the US. It needs to keep, not only Russia from re-entering the ME sphere, but the other elephant in the room, China. By default, Israels influence dwindles as a result.

They are merely tolerated.

Many would argue Israel is the one that's tolerated.
"In my view there are four principal outcomes resulting from the replacement of the U.S. by other suppliers in major arms transactions with moderate, pro-Western Arab states.

2. The loss of income and jobs to U.S. industry and American labor is a gratuitous, self-inflicted wound which has absolutely no compensatory aspects."

And what did the US do when Saddam invaded Kuwait? Hardly an act of toleration.

As for Saudi Arabia acquiring the F-35, this will happen...and they will pay top dollar. The Saudis always do.

And my point is they shouldn't. They have the leverage to negotiate a very favorable deal.
 
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