Saudi Arabia, Russia sign nuclear power cooperation deal

[Saif al-Arab]

I really wonder why KSA needs Nuclear Energy considering ''oil being cheaper than water'' there, at least we have an excuse that we have almost no fossile energy and heavily dependent on foreign imports but you on the other hand.


Hmm, very interesting, why is KSA investing in Nuclear energy considering it wont be much cheaper than its own energy reserves.

On the other hand your geographical location is very strategic. Let alone in terms of pipeline transport. Crucial for the oil and gas industry. Aside from that you have much arable land and a long coastline (just like KSA) and just like KSA you border two different seas although some say that the Black Sea is a big lake, lol. You are the only country in the world that borders the Black Sea and Mediterranean Sea just like KSA is the only country that borders the Red Sea and the Gulf.

This thread should explain why that is.

KSA taps the sun to meet a third of its energy needs

Simply it's due to money (more will remain for exports - oil extraction is cheaper in KSA than anywhere else and unlike other big oil exporters KSA's population is not as big so more is left for export), because renewable energy will be the future energy source alongside nuclear energy once the fossil era ends and because KSA has a very big potential for solar and wind energy and other alternative energy sources.

Also being reliant on 1 energy source (fossils) is not good for your security on the long run. Diversification is almost always better hence the investments in nuclear energy, renewable energy (solar and wind mainly) aside from fossils such as oil and gas.

That's the short story and most precise story unless they have other plans that I have no clue about.

In any case as I wrote many times before then Turkey on many fronts is a model for other Muslim countries to follow although you might dislike Erdogan. Of course the reforms Ataturk kickstarted almost 100 years ago help here, the big population (80 million is no small number) and the central location. But each state has it's strengths and weaknesses.

 

[IR-TR]

What are you talking about? Iran a "much bigger power"? In what terms? Sanctions, isolation, poverty, bad economy? Anyway you are back to trolling I see. Not interested.

But anyway you already know that you have been milked by Russia and others (India, China, West etc.) exactly due to your isolation and sanctions. That does not mean that Russia, India or China are crooks. They don't "milk" the GCC for instance or other partners despite GCC-Chinese trade reaching almost 300 BILLION dollars on a yearly basis.

Iran is a much bigger power in terms of power projection, influence and production. Anyway, that's not the point. Much of that trade you're talking about, is acting like the middle man for Iran-China trade btw. But that's not the point either. Call me when a reactor is being built. Heck, I'm all for peaceful civilian nuclear proliferation. But I don't think the world wants a nuclear capable Saudi Arabia.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

Iran is a much bigger power in terms of power projection, influence and production. Anyway, that's not the point. Much of that trade you're talking about, is acting like the middle man for Iran-China trade btw. But that's not the point either. Call me when a reactor is being built. Heck, I'm all for peaceful civilian nuclear proliferation. But I don't think the world wants a nuclear capable Saudi Arabia.

Not more one can say, sadly. Excellent bit of comedy though.

I already told you that I am not interested in trolling. I am engaged in a serious discussion.

Anyway keep living in "Mullah land" if that makes you happy. Nor has this thread anything to do with Iran. Nobody cares here.

@xenon54

Here is an article that sets light on why focus on renewable energy resources is a very good idea for KSA given the enormous potential in terms of solar and wind energy.

Even if all the numbers are not fully accurate (I assume they are) it's still pretty insane numbers.

Saudi Arabians Could Export Solar for the Next Twenty Centuries

​

Every square meter of Saudi Arabia produces an extraordinary 7 kilowatt hours of energy daily in each 12 hours of sun power. If the Saudis were to use up each days solar energy supply, or 12,425 TWh of electricity, it would be a 72 year supply.

Put another way, in just one day, enough solar energy hits Saudi sands to power the kingdom for 72 years, according to a study made by the World Academy of Science, Engineering and Technology.

That is an extraordinary resource. It is significantly more than the rest of the world. For example: as a Californian who used a typical 15 kilowatt hours of energy a day, this means my entire home could have been fully solar powered by just 2 square meters – or about 3 feet by 6 feet – of solar panels in Saudi Arabia!

And Saudi Arabia has over 2 trillion square meters able to produce 14 trillion kilowatt hours of solar energy every sunny day – that is enough to power the world.

But of course, no country wants to be entirely devoted to energy production, least of all one that is still making good money from digging up oil, but it is indicative of the kind of money the Kingdom could be earning from solar exports rather than oil exports.

Just as it earns its vast income from oil now, it could equally well earn a similarly vast income from solar in the future. And for vast eons of time.

Transitioning to solar from oil would take an initial investment in the infrastructure, and then would yield an income stream regardless of fuel depletion, because solar is there for the long run, unlike the oil which is getting harder and harder to get out of the ground.

But it is Saudi Arabia itself which is in the best position in the world to make that transition and invest in a replacement for oil. With oil prices at $102 a barrel at today’s market price, the Saudis have over $30 trillion in underground assets.

With that much money in huge (but depleting) assets in petroleum and natural gas reserves, now is the time that Saudi Arabia should invest and become the world’s largest producer of green solar energy.

Saudi Arabia could export solar for centuries either as electricity into the Desertec grid, or as hydrogen fuel, using its tankers and pipelines.

Desertec, which will be shipping billions of kilowatt hours of desert solar energy across to Europe in the near future is becoming a reality in more MENA region nations with the addition of Morocco, Tunisia and Egypt, but the Saudis are not members of the visionary project.

Even though; unlike its poorer neighbors, it has tremendous financial assets – enough to become a leader in the project along with the giant German energy companies RWE and E.On – because it could self-fund its own Desertec infrastructure investment.

With over 250 hours of sunshine each month, Saudi Arabia is ideally located to make the most of solar power.

It even has the infrastructure already in place to be a leader in the solar-powered hydrogen economy of the future. Increasingly hydrogen researchers are turning to sustainable long term sources – wind or solar – for hydrogen production.

Solar powered hydrogen could be transported in the same pipeline and tanker infrastructure that now moves our climate-destroying oil energy around the world.

Saudi Aramco – 100% owned by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia – through its affiliate, Vela Marine International Ltd, owns and operates the world’s second largest tanker fleet to help transport its crude oil production, which amounted to 3 billion barrels a year. It is a world leader in exploration, producing, refining, distribution, shipping and marketing.

Most of this infrastructure and expertise could be repurposed to transform Saudi Arabia into a solar hydrogen economy.

This infrastructure could be re-engineered to become a gigantic carrier fleet for hydrogen made with sustainable solar energy and shipped worldwide. New solar infrastructure could be added, as it has begun to do in making polysilicon from its sand.

It is Saudi Arabia that holds the key, with its unique combination of natural and financial resources, to creating a huge long-term future for the world that is based on a sustainable permanent source of energy: our sun.

- See more at: Saudis Could Export Solar for the Next Twenty Centuries | Green Prophet

Saudi Arabia aims to be world’s largest renewable energy market​

By 2032, Saudi Arabia strives to generate as much as a third of the country's energy demands using renewable energy.

Saudi Arabia aims to become the world’s foremost market for renewable energy with an aggressive investment budget of $109 billion. By 2032, the country strives to generate as much as a third of the Kingdom’s energy demands using renewable energy (54 GW).
Following the publicity surrounding the country’s major investment drive, King Abdullah City for Atomic and Renewable Energy (KACARE) released a series of documents detailing the revised National Energy Plan. In addition to the 41 GW of solar power, 25 GW of CSP and 16 GW of PV, the Kingdom is aiming to generate 18 GW of nuclear energy, 3 GW of waste to energy, 1 GW of geothermal and an additional 9 GW of wind power, specifically for water desalination plants.
Impressive and noble though the country’s renewable energy goals maybe, the question remains how will the world’s largest exporter of oil, so dependent on conventional energy sources for their power demand, achieve such a transformation.
Establishing a time-line with long-term policies is at the top of the list.
According to Keisuke Sadamori, director of the energy markets and security directorate, International Energy Agency (IEA), "One of the key messages from the Medium Term Renewable Energy Market Report 2013 by the IEA is that policy uncertainty is the largest risk for renewable investment. Every country, including Saudi Arabia, should introduce long-term policies to provide a predictable and reliable framework to support renewable deployment."

Sadamori, alongside various other international and regional renewable energy experts, will be discussing the key challenges faced by Saudi Arabia and the steps toward overcoming them at the upcoming 3rd Annual Solar Arabia Summit. Taking place on Sept. 29-30 in Riyadh, the summit is hosting 35 experts who will each share their experience in the industry and discuss the latest market trends and policy development in the Kingdom.
Rasheed M. Alzahrani, CEO, Riyadh Valley Company, is also speaking at the summit to discuss joint ventures, partnerships and investments in renewable energy in the Kingdom.
He also acknowledges that "high level plans are already in place, but the major challenge in the Kingdom lies in the absence of a detailed time-line for a clear and gradual shift to renewable energy in the country and the slow adoption and advancement in renewable energy initiatives."
When asked about his company’s participation in the summit, Alzahrani said: "We intend to invest in this sector both in early and late stage opportunities that will add value to the local needs. We will use this platform to introduce RVC and its initiatives and to help foster the development of an energy ecosystem in KSA."
Alongside the summit’s conference agenda, 250 Saudi energy stakeholders are attending to have one-to-one business meetings with up to 40 international solution and service providers.
Confirmed participants include Schneider Electric, Total, Sterling and Wilson, SMA Technology and Trishe Renewables.

Saudi Arabia aims to be world’s largest renewable energy market | Arab News

See more in this thread:

KSA taps the sun to meet a third of its energy needs

 

[IR-TR]

Ask our Turkish friend here who has more influence. Iran or Saudi Arabia. He'll answer it for you. No trolling here. And finally Saudi Arabia is going to harvest the sun for energy. Kudos.

 

[xenon54 out]

On the other hand your geographical location is very strategic. Let alone in terms of pipeline transport. Crucial for the oil and gas industry. Aside from that you have much arable land and a long coastline (just like KSA) and just like KSA you border two different seas although some say that the Black Sea is a big lake, lol. You are the only country in the world that borders the Black Sea and Mediterranean Sea just like KSA is the only country that borders the Red Sea and the Gulf.

This thread should explain why that is.

KSA taps the sun to meet a third of its energy needs

Simply it's due to money (more will remain for exports - oil extraction is cheaper in KSA than anywhere else and unlike other big oil exporters KSA's population is not as big so more is left for export), because renewable energy will be the future energy source alongside nuclear energy once the fossil era ends and because KSA has a very big potential for solar and wind energy and other alternative energy sources.

Also being reliant on 1 energy source (fossils) is not good for your security on the long run. Diversification is almost always better hence the investments in nuclear energy, renewable energy (solar and wind mainly) aside from fossils such as oil and gas.

That's the short story and most precise story unless they have other plans that I have no clue about.

In any case as I wrote many times before then Turkey on many fronts is a model for other Muslim countries to follow although you might dislike Erdogan. Of course the reforms Ataturk kickstarted almost 100 years ago help here, the big population (80 million is no small number) and the central location. But each state has it's strengths and weaknesses.

Very good analysis but still, dont you think that solar energy would make more sense in KSA due to unlimited sunny days and the fact that KSA doesnt lack of money to invest in it.
So why going for cheap, renevable but still dangerous Nuclear enegry?

Turkey and KSA signed NPT but that doesnt mean they arent allowed to have the capability to be able to make the bomb in ''48h'' in case of a big war much like Japan or probably Iran soon?

To be honest, there is more behind it than just caring for environment, at least thats what i think about Turkey considering that Turkey also started a project for a indigenous launch platform.

 

[IR-TR]

Very good analysis but still, dont you think that solar energy would make more sense in KSA due to unlimited sunny days and the fact that KSA doesnt lack of money to invest in it.
So why going for cheap, renevable but still dangerous Nuclear enegry?

Turkey and KSA signed NPT but that doesnt mean they arent allowed to have the capability to be able to make the bomb in ''48h'' in case of a big war much like Japan or probably Iran soon?

To be honest, there is more behind it than just caring for environment, at least thats what i think about Turkey considering that Turkey also started a project for a indigenous launch platform.

Neither Iran, Turkey nor Saudi Arabia will ever be allowed to come anywhere NEAR those '48' hours. Iran has had to pay dearly for 30 years to be able to get to it's current level of civil nuclear power. Turkey is an in betweener, the West really doesn't like it, but Nato etc. It will be closely monitored. Saudi I think will become a case of 'give me your money, I'll give you a shiny half completed building'. Time will tell.

 

[The Last of us]

Not more one can say, sadly. Excellent bit of comedy though.

I already told you that I am not interested in trolling. I am engaged in a serious discussion.

Anyway keep living in "Mullah land" if that makes you happy. Nor has this thread anything to do with Iran. Nobody cares here.

You're too dumb to even try and counter his point but instead post ghiberish which has nothing to do with the his points.
Afro arab sauds cannot even deal with Yemen whom is overrun by Iranian houthi proxies and this guy is talking about influence

Instead of posting nonsense, at least try and counter his points. Where is your influence? in Somalia?

 

[Saif al-Arab]

Very good analysis but still, dont you think that solar energy would make more sense in KSA due to unlimited sunny days and the fact that KSA doesnt lack of money to invest in it.
So why going for cheap, renevable but still dangerous Nuclear enegry?

Turkey and KSA signed NPT but that doesnt mean they arent allowed to have the capability to be able to make the bomb in ''48h'' in case of a big war much like Japan or probably Iran soon?

To be honest, there is more behind it than just caring for environment, at least thats what i think about Turkey considering that Turkey also started a project for a indigenous launch platform.

KSA is investing a lot of money into not only solar energy (see the articles I posted or the link to the thread I linked to) but wind energy too and other alternative energy sources. The potential is very big.

Nuclear energy is very safe.

Take a look at this link.

Safety of Nuclear Reactors

We can't rule that out but we have to remember that nuclear energy does not equal nuclear weapons. Many countries in the world have nuclear energy but no nuclear weapons and many of those are incapable of building a nuclear weapon in the first place. At least currently.

Sure, you are right about that.

 

[xenon54 out]

Neither Iran, Turkey nor Saudi Arabia will ever be allowed to come anywhere NEAR those '48' hours. Iran has had to pay dearly for 30 years to be able to get to it's current level of civil nuclear power. Turkey is an in betweener, the West really doesn't like it, but Nato etc. It will be closely monitored. Saudi I think will become a case of 'give me your money, I'll give you a shiny half completed building'. Time will tell.

KSA is investing a lot of money into not only solar energy (see the articles I posted or the link to the thread I linked to) but wind energy too and other alternative energy sources. The potential is very big.

Nuclear energy is very safe.

Take a look at this link.

Safety of Nuclear Reactors

We can't rule that out but we have to remember that nuclear energy does not equal nuclear weapons. Many countries in the world have nuclear energy but no nuclear weapons and many of those are incapable of building a nuclear weapon in the first place. At least currently.

Sure, you are right about that.

Not claiming anything, just sharing my opinion, there are so many secrets when it comes to nuclear weapons, do we really know which countries are already capable of building the bomb? Even Libya was working on it before giving it up, who says Japan and South Korea arent capable of? And the most shocking is what most people dont know is Switzerland was working on nuclear bomb in 40s-80s, now you are surprised arent you?


But when doing something like this then surely not the Iranian way with open threatenings.

 

[Saif al-Arab]

You're too dumb to even try and counter his point but instead post ghiberish which has nothing to do with the his points.
Afro arab sauds cannot even deal with Yemen whom is overrun by Iranian houthi proxies and this guy is talking about influence

Instead of posting nonsense, at least try and counter his points. Where is your influence? in Somalia?

Why don't you keep quite Farsi Kawli? Genetic tests have already confirmed that you Farsis have more Sub-Saharan African admixture than Arabians (excluding Yemenis) and I already posted those DNA tests and you ran away. I can do that again. Not that there is anything wrong with having some percentage of African ancestry as we are all from Africa originally apparently.

There is no need to counter anything as every sane person can see that Iran cannot compete with the GCC on any front other than supporting terrorist proxies. What's your influence exactly? Your economy is smaller than 10 million big UAE and 5 times smaller than the GCC, your relations with world powers is in shatters (unlike GCC), your GDP per capita is lower than Angola of all countries and your society is highly fragmented.

Houthi's have almost nothing to do with Mullahstan and they are being dealt with. Over 2000 of them have been killed and less than 30 Saudi Arabian soldiers have been killed. The whole international community (UN) has also condemned the Houthi's and their illegal takeover of Yemen that is now confined to Northern Yemen and some central areas of Yemen.

KSA' economic, religious, cultural and political power is many times bigger than that of Mullahstan.

This camel jokey was claiming yesterday that saudi are more advanced than Ian in science and industry
This is the type of people you're dealing with. Desert dwellers talking about science and industry.

What's your obsession about camels Farsi Kawli? You have plenty of those in Iran. Camels are not even native to the Arabian Peninsula.

I prefer the world famous Arabian horse that we conquered you entity with militarily and later religiously, culturally and linguistically. Something that has lated for 1400 years. Of course, KSA universities rank higher than yours and nobody is impressed by your photoshop army of crappy cars that are exported to Taliban and Shia militias in Iraq.

Go ride on your donkey and then eat the donkey brain that you people love to eat.

@WebMaster @Horus @Manticore @Emmie @Irfan Baloch @Jungibaaz @Jango @waz

The same two Farsi trolls polluting another informative thread. Please deal with them.

 

[IR-TR]

Not claiming anything, just sharing my opinion, there are so many secrets when it comes to nuclear weapons, do we really know which countries are already capable of building the bomb? Even Libya was working on it before giving it up, who says Japan and South Korea arent capable of? And the most shocking is what most people dont know is Switzerland was working on nuclear bomb in 40s-80s, now you are surprised arent you?


But when doing something like this then surely not the Iranian way with opean threatenings.

Oh, Japan and Korea are heavily monitored, especially the former. The US doesn't completely trust them, as they have a very militaristic history. Though the 'Chinese threat' may allow Japan to 'slip one through'. Friend, I also have relatives in Soloturn (not the Neuchatel ones) that gave me a 'nice' view of those cooling towers. I asked them about it and they told me also about what you said during those decades. Quite independed minded, those Swiss Gotta love them. Iran's case is quite different. Open threats never really were made until the West sanctioned them into smithereens. When the war of words heats up, most things can be said. If you look at evidence though, the only difference between Netherlands' nuclear program and that of Iran is location, being muslim, and not being in line with US interests. That's it. Nothing 'bomby' about it.

God damn it I get depressed from this section of the forum. I'm going back to the East/South Asia section, where there is growth and advancement. Let the dice fall as they may.

 

[OTTOMAN]

Oppsss... a bad bad day for Arab hater brigade of defence.pk
My sympathies are with you.

Well-done KSA, unlike the self proclaimed Islamic republic, you didn't opt. to steal it from Pakistan.

For those who are further interested in detailed account of Pakistan's nuclear development and details of its unfortunate theft, can read book 'eating grass' by Feroz Khan.
Eating Grass: The Making of the Pakistani Bomb: Feroz Khan: 9780804776011: Amazon.com: Books

review of the book can be read here:
Eating grass - Dr Maleeha Lodhi

However, after the unfortunate backstabbing by the evil nexus, Pakistan have plugged the gaps in security with strict controls, but the damaged inflicted by traitor tribe, will remain irrecoverable.
At the same time, hopes are that soon Pakistan will be part of NSG regime and can deal officially with honest states.

 

[xenon54 out]

Oh, Japan and Korea are heavily monitored, especially the former. The US doesn't completely trust them, as they have a very militaristic history. Though the 'Chinese threat' may allow Japan to 'slip one through'. Friend, I also have relatives in Soloturn (not the Neuchatel ones) that gave me a 'nice' view of those cooling towers. I asked them about it and they told me also about what you said during those decades. Quite independed minded, those Swiss Gotta love them. Iran's case is quite different. Open threats never really were made until the West sanctioned them into smithereens. When the war of words heats up, most things can be said. If you look at evidence though, the only difference between Netherlands' nuclear program and that of Iran is location, being muslim, and not being in line with US interests. That's it. Nothing 'bomby' about it.

Here is an quite detailed wiki article about Swiss nuclear weapon program but only in German, though it shouldnt be very hard for you to understand it.

Schweizer Kernwaffenprogramm – Wikipedia


Yeah, those Swiss, neutral but armed to teeth, it might even be a nuclear power today if it wasnt the only real democracy in the world.

BTW: i have visited a Nuclear plant here, i was even in one of those cooling towers, very interesting.

 

[OTTOMAN]

What drugs are you on kid? Or Are you another saud slave?

Today, you have right to mourn

 

[The Last of us]

Today, you have right to mourn

I have to moan because the Russian may in the next 20 years have completed a civilian power plant for the sauds Yeah dude, Iran declared today as nation mourning day.

The greatest achievement of these sauds is paying some Russian or the west to build them some facility, building, oil facility etc. This is whilst Iran has attained almost all aspects of nuclear cycle.