Samsung opens two appliance plants in Bangladesh

[wiseone2]

You are the one who is denying the elephant in the room.

I don't mean to demean Indonesia either, but I doubt you have ever worked at a manufacturing company or much less owned one, no offense. Otherwise you wouldn't even come back with the rather weak logic you presented.

In the business of making low cost products, labor cost is everything. Please let that soak in for a couple of minutes.....

Buyers move orders from one country to another for 4 cents a shirt.

Now go back, look at the labor cost in each country (including yours), then come present me something believable.

None of the five countries I mentioned can compete with the likes of middle or higher labor cost producers like Korea, Taiwan, Eastern Europe or now, China.

Indonesia is not the Netherlands. In fact HDI indicators in Indonesia is worse than in Bangladesh.

Minimum wage per month in Bangladesh is Tk.5300 or 65.732 US Dollar.

Minimum wage per month in Indonesia is IDR.3,355,750.00 or 252.141659 US Dollar or roughly four times the wage rate of Bangladesh.

http://www.wageindicator.org/main/salary/minimum-wage/indonesia

Let me know how this adds up.

And about the 'Quality of manpower' story you put up about workers in other countries being smarter or more skilled than in Bangladesh, that is really racist and offensive.

Bangladeshi girls can make anything Indonesian girls can.....Bangladesh is the second largest garments exporter and fourth largest denim exporter in the world.



You are defending an inveterate flamer of all Bangladeshi threads, irrespective of merit. If you support him just because he happens to claim that he's Indian (or worse, because he flames us), I have nothing to say. He has been banned multiple times for his disrespectful behavior, and people like that have very little respect in my book, for that reason alone. If you come in here and argue with respect, I will return it in kind. His behavior, not so much. He has a lot of hard lessons to learn in life....

On topic, the qualitative difference between low cost labor in Bangladesh and India may not be that pronounced. However our labor cost is still HALF of yours. That alone speaks volumes about where Chinese (as well as Taiwanese and Korean) sunset industry low wage jobs have headed for the last two decades and will be heading. However other than low wage manufacturing, we don't have a lot common with India in manufacturing scenario. India has a lot of higher value addition manufacturing such as automobiles that we don't want to get into yet. We need to give enough jobs to the millions of lower class people, whom we actually care about.

Propaganda in consulting firms aside, Chinese low wage jobs will be going to places like Bangladesh first, given that buyers and Walmart customers obviously care about the cost of the final product. Low wage and low value addition jobs will remain Bangladesh' Forte for the time being, which suits us just dandy, Thank You.

Of course we have middle-class IT and pharmaceutical knowledge jobs too, which are growing faster than a lot of other countries in Asia.

And re: automation, I'm well read on this and can tell you that automation cannot replace people in low wage jobs like making, shoes, apparel, toys, kitchen items, home appliances and electronics as well as small electrics like fans, irons, blenders, toasters, coffee makers etc.

I do not read everyone of Nilgiri's posts. His previous post was factual and polite.

What products are exactly low cost ? Textiles ?? Did you have something else in mind ?

I work making automated systems for a living. You are in for a rude shock if you think automation will not impact Bangladesh.

 

[Bilal9]

I do not read everyone of Nilgiri's posts. His previous post was factual and polite.

What products are exactly low cost ? Textiles ?? Did you have something else in mind ?

I work making automated systems for a living. You are in for a rude shock if you think automation will not impact Bangladesh.

Shoes, apparel, toys, kitchenware like nonstick and pressure cookers, home appliances e.g. fridge, tv, other electronics as well as small electrics like fans, irons, blenders, toasters, coffee makers are all low wage, low value addition industries.

I wouldn't completely forsake automation in the electric and electronics appliance sectors, some appliance companies in Bangladesh are using automation well in the metal sheet forming and smd component pick and place steps, as seen in the video below.

But most of the low wage jobs moving to Bangladesh are of the assembly variety, so use of automation will be rather sparse.

Local export oriented garments sector uses low levels of automation except in some factories where they use CAD/CAM to cut fabric or where buttons are sewn into fabric. Footwear manufacturing uses automatic lasting machines.

Other than that, most of the steps in these factories are heavily manual processes. Which is why buyers place their orders here.

 

[wiseone2]

Shoes, apparel, toys, kitchenware like nonstick and pressure cookers, home appliances e.g. fridge, tv, other electronics as well as small electrics like fans, irons, blenders, toasters, coffee makers are all low wage, low value addition industries.

I wouldn't completely forsake automation in the electric and electronics appliance sectors, some companies in Bangladesh are using automation well, as seen in the video below.

But most of the low wage jobs moving to Bangladesh are of the assembly variety, so use of automation will be rather sparse.

Local export oriented garments sector uses low levels of automation except in some factories where they use CAD/CAM to cut fabric or where buttons are sewn into fabric. Footwear manufacturing uses automatic lasting machines.

Other than that, most of the steps in these factories are heavily manual processes. Which is why buyers place their orders here.

You need leather and cotton for shoes and textiles industries. Countries like India will compete in those sectors.

home appliances are very sophisticated products. Unless Bangladesh moves up the value chain I do not see it being manufactured. A lot of popular toys are electronic

 

[Bilal9]

You need leather and cotton for shoes and textiles industries. Countries like India will compete in those sectors.

home appliances are very sophisticated products. Unless Bangladesh moves up the value chain I do not see it being manufactured. A lot of popular toys are electronic

Bangladesh is the world's second largest garments producer and fourth largest denim producer already. We are self sufficient in leather, not cotton. We import cotton from many sources, including some from India.

And Bangladesh local brands are now self sufficient in producing refrigerators and led TV sets and exports have already been established in middle eastern and regional markets. Last year we produced and sold almost as many if not more TVs and refrigerators per capita than in India. Not comparing, but those are facts. Maybe you are not aware of this.

As of 2014 Bangladesh was capable of manufacturing 23 lakh refrigerators against the annual demand of 11 lakh. Which means in comparison to the present demand, the country’s production capacity is more than double. Since 2014, there were more manufacturers and exporters entering the market. This is why Samsung entered Bangladesh market to assemble locally, but they will not be able to capture the market because of lower value addition, high cost and lack of parts and service support.

Bangladesh is also one of the few countries in the world where compressors are now made.

 

[wiseone2]

Bangladesh is the world's second largest garments producer and fourth largest denim producer already. We are self sufficient in leather, not cotton. We import cotton from many sources, including some from India.

And Bangladesh local brands are now self sufficient in producing refrigerators and led TV sets and exports have already been established in middle eastern and regional markets. Last year we produced and sold almost as many if not more TVs and refrigerators per capita than in India. Not comparing, but those are facts. Maybe you are not aware of this.

The import of cotton will limit Bangladesh's ability to increase market share in textiles

 

[Bilal9]

The import of cotton will limit Bangladesh's ability to increase market share in textiles

I... don't believe so. Maybe you can explain why we already are the second largest exporter of garments in spite of not being a major cotton producer. Cotton is a commodity that is priced competitively. If we can't get Indian cotton (quite unlikely), we will go to Pakistan, China, Egypt or Central Asian countries. It will really be India's loss then.

The capital machineries used in our textile sector are all reputed German marques such as Trutzschler spinning and carding machines. Very few items were bought from India, except boilers, so we are not dependent on Indian manufactured items either.

You see - decades of dealing with Indian companies have made local companies wary of trusting Indian companies when choosing India as a source or supplier, it will take time to rebuild that trust.....

In any case, I don't want to engage you in any further OT conversation, please open a separate thread if you want to discuss these topics you raised.

 

[Nike]

You are the one who is denying the elephant in the room.

I don't mean to demean Indonesia either, but I doubt you have ever worked at a manufacturing company or much less owned one, no offense. Otherwise you wouldn't even come back with the rather weak logic you presented.

In the business of making low cost products, labor cost is everything. Please let that soak in for a couple of minutes.....

Buyers move orders from one country to another for 4 cents a shirt.

Now go back, look at the labor cost in each country (including yours), then come present me something believable.

None of the five countries I mentioned can compete with the likes of middle or higher labor cost producers like Korea, Taiwan, Eastern Europe or now, China.

Indonesia is not the Netherlands. In fact HDI indicators in Indonesia is worse than in Bangladesh.

Minimum wage per month in Bangladesh is Tk.5300 or 65.732 US Dollar.

Minimum wage per month in Indonesia is IDR.3,355,750.00 or 252.141659 US Dollar or roughly four times the wage rate of Bangladesh.

http://www.wageindicator.org/main/salary/minimum-wage/indonesia

Let me know how this adds up.

And about the 'Quality of manpower' story you put up about workers in other countries being smarter or more skilled than in Bangladesh, that is really racist and offensive.

Bangladeshi girls can make anything Indonesian girls can.....Bangladesh is the second largest garments exporter and fourth largest denim exporter in the world.



You are defending an inveterate flamer of all Bangladeshi threads, irrespective of merit. If you support him just because he happens to claim that he's Indian (or worse, because he flames us), I have nothing to say. He has been banned multiple times for his disrespectful behavior, and people like that have very little respect in my book, for that reason alone. If you come in here and argue with respect, I will return it in kind. His behavior, not so much. He has a lot of hard lessons to learn in life....

On topic, the qualitative difference between low cost labor in Bangladesh and India may not be that pronounced. However our labor cost is still HALF of yours. That alone speaks volumes about where Chinese (as well as Taiwanese and Korean) sunset industry low wage jobs have headed for the last two decades and will be heading. However other than low wage manufacturing, we don't have a lot common with India in manufacturing scenario. India has a lot of higher value addition manufacturing such as automobiles that we don't want to get into yet. We need to give enough jobs to the millions of lower class people, whom we actually care about.

Propaganda in consulting firms aside, Chinese low wage jobs will be going to places like Bangladesh first, given that buyers and Walmart customers obviously care about the cost of the final product. Low wage and low value addition jobs will remain Bangladesh' Forte for the time being, which suits us just dandy, Thank You.

Of course we have middle-class IT and pharmaceutical knowledge jobs too, which are growing faster than a lot of other countries in Asia.

And re: automation, I'm well read on this and can tell you that automation cannot replace people in low wage jobs like making, shoes, apparel, toys, kitchen items, home appliances and electronics as well as small electrics like fans, irons, blenders, toasters, coffee makers etc.

since when Indonesian ranks worse than Bd in HDI index, talks with data not bullshit assumption



http://hdr.undp.org/en/composite/HDI

low cost wage doesnt mean all the necessary ingredient to attract more investment in low cost products. If other factor contribute, the actuality of higher cost production of making goods in Bd is much likely than making the same goods in Vietnam or Indonesia. Apart from apparel and shoes in which Bd had preferential treatment by European Union and US because of LDC status what else Bangladesh industry had been exported in large number? automotive? how much BD can produce a car in year? motorcycle? how much Bd can build motorcycle in year? home appliances? how much the value of home appliances had been produced in Bd a year?

there is much thing Industry in Indonesia Bangladesh cant do till today. First, Aerospace industry, second microtechnology industry, third nuclear industry (Indonesia had built their own micro reactor for education and research purpose), meh even Bd recently starting to importing coach for their fledging railway services, meanwhile Indonesia just starting to built their own highspeed locomotive in cooperation with China there is still much gap between what Indonesia had achieved and Bangladesh fledging industry.

your assumption on how low cost production is Bd forte to attract more investment in low cost product industry is much less desired in actual world. Just let say it with actual data, in the whole year of 2016 Bd attract 2 billion US Dollar worth FDI

https://tradingeconomics.com/bangladesh/foreign-direct-investment

and there is tendencies of decrease in RMG sector of investment as BB had reported. In communication and other manufacturing sector there is decrease in number of realization of FDI in BD.

https://www.bb.org.bd/pub/halfyearly/fdisurvey/fdisurveyjanjun2015.pdf

https://www.bb.org.bd/pub/halfyearly/fdisurvey/fdisurveyjanjun2016.pdf

let compared it with Indonesia, in which you said clearly Indonesia is less attractive for investor who engage in low cost product industries. i dont bring much bullshit without supported by actual data like what you have done. Indonesia attract more than 29 billion US Dollar worth of FDI in 2016 alone, much larger than combined FDI Bd had received in at least two decades.

https://en.portal.santandertrade.com/establish-overseas/indonesia/foreign-investment

https://www.dbs.com/aics/templateda...conomics_positives_in_indonesias_FDI_data.xml

much of investment is engaged in base metal, machinery, electronics sector and pharmaceuticals the ones need massive low wage workers.

http://www.thejakartapost.com/amp/n...a-reaches-24-4-of-2017-investment-target.html

so till now i dont see or get the catch were your confidence on how BD will attract more investment in sunset, sunrise or whatever industries you want besides of RMG sector (in which itself had been decreasing in number of value by each passing year because of several factors) coming from?

I would say, Bd will surely accepted with warm and opening arms if any automotive player industries even if its being Indian ones

 

[Bilal9]

since when Indonesian ranks worse than Bd in HDI index, talks with data not bullshit assumption



http://hdr.undp.org/en/composite/HDI

low cost wage doesnt mean all the necessary ingredient to attract more investment in low cost products. If other factor contribute, the actuality of higher cost production of making goods in Bd is much likely than making the same goods in Vietnam or Indonesia. Apart from apparel and shoes in which Bd had preferential treatment by European Union and US because of LDC status what else Bangladesh industry had been exported in large number? automotive? how much BD can produce a car in year? motorcycle? how much Bd can build motorcycle in year? home appliances? how much the value of home appliances had been produced in Bd a year?

there is much thing Industry in Indonesia Bangladesh cant do till today. First, Aerospace industry, second microtechnology industry, third nuclear industry (Indonesia had built their own micro reactor for education and research purpose), meh even Bd recently starting to importing coach for their fledging railway services, meanwhile Indonesia just starting to built their own highspeed locomotive in cooperation with China there is still much gap between what Indonesia had achieved and Bangladesh fledging industry.

your assumption on how low cost production is Bd forte to attract more investment in low cost product industry is much less desired in actual world. Just let say it with actual data, in the whole year of 2016 Bd attract 2 billion US Dollar worth FDI

https://tradingeconomics.com/bangladesh/foreign-direct-investment

and there is tendencies of decrease in RMG sector of investment as BB had reported. In communication and other manufacturing sector there is decrease in number of realization of FDI in BD.

https://www.bb.org.bd/pub/halfyearly/fdisurvey/fdisurveyjanjun2015.pdf

https://www.bb.org.bd/pub/halfyearly/fdisurvey/fdisurveyjanjun2016.pdf

let compared it with Indonesia, in which you said clearly Indonesia is less attractive for investor who engage in low cost product industries. i dont bring much bullshit without supported by actual data like what you have done. Indonesia attract more than 29 billion US Dollar worth of FDI in 2016 alone, much larger than combined FDI Bd had received in at least two decades.

https://en.portal.santandertrade.com/establish-overseas/indonesia/foreign-investment

https://www.dbs.com/aics/templateda...conomics_positives_in_indonesias_FDI_data.xml

much of investment is engaged in base metal, machinery, electronics sector and pharmaceuticals the ones need massive low wage workers.

View attachment 406689

http://www.thejakartapost.com/amp/n...a-reaches-24-4-of-2017-investment-target.html

so till now i dont see or get the catch were your confidence on how BD will attract more investment in sunset, sunrise or whatever industries you want besides of RMG sector (in which itself had been decreasing in number of value by each passing year because of several factors) coming from?

I would say, Bd will surely accepted with warm and opening arms if any automotive player industries even if its being Indian ones

Please translate your post to English.....

 

[Nabil365]

That copy-paste woman is back again.
According to "her" there is no metro railway being built in Bangladesh.
Despite having smaller economy than Indonesia BD is building nuclear power ahead of them.

 

[Nike]

That copy-paste woman is back again.
According to "her" there is no metro railway being built in Bangladesh.
Despite having smaller economy than Indonesia BD is building nuclear power ahead of them.

which one?

Please translate your post to English.....

oh you dont understand human language then

@Nilgiri @Aung Zaya

the moment he cant fight back with factual data and comprehensive number. The quality of this subforum is a let down for this supposed great forum

 

[Nilgiri]

which one?



oh you dont understand human language then

@Nilgiri @Aung Zaya

the moment he cant fight back with factual data and comprehensive number. The quality of this subforum is a let down for this supposed great forum

He's a dullard that is mad last few mod wailing attempts resulted in naught (and that the trend will continue).

I dont even read his page long rants now. He lost all credibility when he projected (2 - 3 years back) Walton to be some superpower company by now (2017, 2018)....and we are still waiting for one basic, recent and quality revenue release and wiki page update....you know... SOMETHING! ANYTHING! (export performance can come later). But looks like it was high on words, low on delivery as usual.

Till then he is free to cherry pick whatever he wants and present it however he wants (as sum total entirety) to make this an echo chamber like his own country. Its after all how they doctor and release faulty "statistics" so they dont come off as a total failure....because next to no one actually goes there to check the reality (and when they do/directly enquire with local people ...you get things like the liveability index for Dhaka, cato freedom index, corruption perception index and multitudes of other reality checks etc.)

I remember back when you supported a lot of what these fellows here had to say about BD development/history/society (even I did starting out)....but it seems they tend to turn those that are not in unfettered love with their country against them (because they got beaten up/bullied badly etc...we can only have sympathy and unending compassion and patience and extending of benefit of doubt etc). They don't handle questions, challenges, criticisms (even for just the sake of argument) well at all.

It's something about them....a deep complex that I am not going to waste time digging up anymore. The actual BD people in my life matter way more....not those that are clearly rotted/atrophied into dullards and/or have a big unsurmountable chip on shoulder over here. I just thump those when I feel like its needed (the need has decreased substantially given no new conversation/subjects...so its like the twilight zone in here).

@LA se Karachi @django @Aung Zaya

 

[UKBengali]

He's a dullard that is mad last few mod wailing attempts resulted in naught (and that the trend will continue).

I dont even read his page long rants now. He lost all credibility when he projected (2 - 3 years back) Walton to be some superpower company by now (2017, 2018)....and we are still waiting for one basic, recent and quality revenue release and wiki page update....you know... SOMETHING! ANYTHING! (export performance can come later). But looks like it was high on words, low on delivery as usual.

Till then he is free to cherry pick whatever he wants and present it however he wants (as sum total entirety) to make this an echo chamber like his own country. Its after all how they doctor and release faulty "statistics" so they dont come off as a total failure....because next to no one actually goes there to check the reality (and when they do/directly enquire with local people ...you get things like the liveability index for Dhaka, cato freedom index, corruption perception index and multitudes of other reality checks etc.)

I remember back when you supported a lot of what these fellows here had to say about BD development/history/society (even I did starting out)....but it seems they tend to turn those that are not in unfettered love with their country against them (because they got beaten up/bullied badly etc...we can only have sympathy and unending compassion and patience and extending of benefit of doubt etc). They don't handle questions, challenges, criticisms (even for just the sake of argument) well at all.

It's something about them....a deep complex that I am not going to waste time digging up anymore. The actual BD people in my life matter way more....not those that are clearly rotted/atrophied into dullards and/or have a big unsurmountable chip on shoulder over here. I just thump those when I feel like its needed (the need has decreased substantially given no new conversation/subjects...so its like the twilight zone in here).

@LA se Karachi @django @Aung Zaya

In 2014, Walton had turnover of just under 500 million US dollars. With the huge growth that it has experienced since then it has revenues of more than a billion US dollars now.

http://www.thedailystar.net/business/walton-made-bangladesh-150850


Edit - http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/2017/03/01/63092/Walton-eyes-1.7m-fridge-sales-in-2017

1.7 million fridges this year after 1.4 million sold last year - which is a growth of 44% from 2015.

Let us assume an average price of 500 US dollars per fridge and you have nearly 1 billion dollars just from fridges.
With the revenues from other products such as TVs, I would say that Walton will rake in 2 billion US dollars this year. It TOTALLY dominates the BD home market.

Walton is no Samsung but it is very good by S Asian standards.

 

[Nilgiri]

With the huge growth that it has experienced since then it has revenues of more than a billion US dollars now.

Need to see a official release by them (Walton)....preferably on their website. 2015 came and went, and its been crickets since.

I really don't see why a claimed billion+ dollar revenue company has this much trouble releasing something so simple....at say a scheduled time each year.

Even the 1 -2 billion dollar projection you are making BTW, is WAY under what was "projected" by Mr. Bilal and his sources back then....esp the massive export projections (probably using 80s south korea and 90s China ramp curves on a 1:1 basis).

Walton is no Samsung but it is very good by S Asian standards.

If its not consumed in any other country, no way to really compare.

 

[Bilal9]

In 2014, Walton had turnover of just under 500 million US dollars. With the huge growth that it has experienced since then it has revenues of more than a billion US dollars now.

http://www.thedailystar.net/business/walton-made-bangladesh-150850


Edit - http://www.thefinancialexpress-bd.com/2017/03/01/63092/Walton-eyes-1.7m-fridge-sales-in-2017

1.7 million fridges this year after 1.4 million sold last year - which is a growth of 44% from 2015.

Let us assume an average price of 500 US dollars per fridge and you have nearly 1 billion dollars just from fridges.
With the revenues from other products such as TVs, I would say that Walton will rake in 2 billion US dollars this year. It TOTALLY dominates the BD home market.

Walton is no Samsung but it is very good by S Asian standards.

Bhai that is an understatement. Their level of backward integration is unmatched by most South Asian electronics companies. Their r&d investment budget alone is bigger than a lot of the total investments of some South Asian "brands".

 

[Aung Zaya]

The quality of this subforum is a let down for this supposed great

why do u expect ''quality'' in this sub forum.? sis.
it is too much. lol

Bhai that is an understatement. Their level of backward integration is unmatched by most South Asian electronics companies. Their r&d investment budget alone is bigger than a lot of the total investments of some South Asian "brands".

so how much they used for R&D per year. ?