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SAC - FC-31 Grey Falcon Stealth aircraft for PAF : Updates & Debate

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I would continue to take some of the hi end technology incorporated in both the j10 programmes and the j20/j31 programmes. Ie radars weapons avionics ew suites etc and utilise in a new version of thunder in mk3.

The PAF people surely second you in these wishes. The requirement is to keep developing JF17 in future blocks. We all talk about Blk III but with 2020 timeline for a new platform (FC-31) we may even see a Block IV. So what needs to be done is keep building and developing JF17, the airframe have the potential of all the avionics and radar up gradations, the open structure design gives loads of room for further enhancements. Try to get hands on some hi end tech from J10b and FC-31 (since we are going to buy it eventually so why not get some goodies now approach) and fit JF17 future block with that. This will not only take JF17 to a next level but will also help PAF to evaluate some of the technology they will be getting in FC-31 like in no other way possible and thus we can get the required modifications and improvements. With a decent number of JF17 in service and the old air planes retired, we can go FC-31 and eventually replace the remaining older aircraft (the ones we say wont be replaced by JF17 now like F7PG and Mirage ROSE III) and ending up using two (JF17 and FC-310 or three (JF17, FC-31 and a few F-16/heavier twin engine planes for long range duties like at sea) different platforms in our air force.

And guys, can we get back to discussing air planes rather then economics :))
we do have a complete section for that.
 
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Pakistan has a huge black economy (undocumented economy), which is the reason why economic figures dont give an accurate estimate for Pakistan and that even despite low economic stats Pakistan manages to boast such a well equipped military and a complex nuclear program.

IMF and other agencies are aware of this, attended a World Bank lecture once and the person giving the lecture acknowledged this. Actual GDP and other stats are much different, its deliberately kept undocumented so that the elite can get away with tax evasion plus a black budget covers for the nuclear program.

Making a economic comparison argument seems irrelevant, the fact is if Pakistan's leadership feels they need something on priority they can procure it. Its about priorities. At the moment Pakistan's priorities are fighting a war with the militants so it is hesitant from committing resources on conventional weapons since war on the eastern front is unlikely and it will avoid one no matter what the provocation. Soon as the internal and western threat is neutralized and focus is again on eastern threat, expect a flux of modernization projects. The decision makers in Pakistan are very competent and know its better to hold out for better weapon systems for which they likely have received advance knowledge. The J-31 over taking the FC-20/J-10B being one example. Same reason for delaying the Cobra and frigate replacements. Despite delaying decisions for better options, if you analyze current platforms, operational capabilities are not being sacrificed and meeting all current actual threat assessments.

Black economy does not benefit state/army in terms of budget. We should only look at overall state budget and revenues.
 
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Tigerking

Re your enquiry re paf buying typhoon..as response to rafale and the migs of iaf.

Simple answer we will never ve able to grant you the massive financial concessions that the chinease Wil give you for any of their fighters and the Americans gave you grant aid to buy your falcons recently.

At over 100 million the tyohoon Wil be more expensive than any grant aided falcon and probably even the loan aided j31.
kind of agree with you .... PAF needs a decent 4.5 gen fighter too
 
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Pakistan has a huge black economy (undocumented economy), which is the reason why economic figures dont give an accurate estimate for Pakistan and that even despite low economic stats Pakistan manages to boast such a well equipped military and a complex nuclear program.

IMF and other agencies are aware of this, attended a World Bank lecture once and the person giving the lecture acknowledged this. Actual GDP and other stats are much different, its deliberately kept undocumented so that the elite can get away with tax evasion plus a black budget covers for the nuclear program.

Making a economic comparison argument seems irrelevant, the fact is if Pakistan's leadership feels they need something on priority they can procure it. Its about priorities. At the moment Pakistan's priorities are fighting a war with the militants so it is hesitant from committing resources on conventional weapons since war on the eastern front is unlikely and it will avoid one no matter what the provocation. Soon as the internal and western threat is neutralized and focus is again on eastern threat, expect a flux of modernization projects. The decision makers in Pakistan are very competent and know its better to hold out for better weapon systems for which they likely have received advance knowledge. The J-31 over taking the FC-20/J-10B being one example. Same reason for delaying the Cobra and frigate replacements. Despite delaying decisions for better options, if you analyze current platforms, operational capabilities are not being sacrificed and meeting all current actual threat assessments.
How your government access this black economy for spending?? Do your govt secretly collects black money?? Or whether they recover black money?? Or is it state running the black economy??
Black economy is that which is illegal with no taxing.. So no revenue getting from this economy.. Sometimes regarded as a secret streangth, that is if recovered it increases revenue considerably.. India also got a huge black economy.. But of no use until it is counted legally..
 
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How your government access this black economy for spending?? Do your govt secretly collects black money?? Or whether they recover black money?? Or is it state running the black economy??

Through GST .
 
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Financially those talking budgets let me suggest that no way is Pakistan in a position to buy a any plus sixty million fighter. That can be block 60.falcons euro canards or j31.

The reason you Wil achieve this is is thru aid alone from either USA or soft loans from china.

Paf current air force budget leaves virtually no money for new fighters. It's operating s very large fleet of fighters eating huge resources in man power maintenance and fuel.

Paf combat fleet is as larger than most of the wealthy nations of Europe ie France or raf and germany.

Without aid buying fighters is non starter. This is why you cancelled the j10 purchase for 30.fighters..

USA has 18 block 52s waiting for guys in s second batch you guys have not acquired them despite being outnumbered three to one in 4,th generation fighters by India.
 
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Financially those talking budgets let me suggest that no way is Pakistan in a position to buy a any plus sixty million fighter. That can be block 60.falcons euro canards or j31.

The reason you Wil achieve this is is thru aid alone from either USA or soft loans from china.

Paf current air force budget leaves virtually no money for new fighters. It's operating s very large fleet of fighters eating huge resources in man power

The PRC and the US will continue to equip and train with the Pak Armed Forces.
 
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How your government access this black economy for spending?? Do your govt secretly collects black money?? Or whether they recover black money?? Or is it state running the black economy??
Black economy is that which is illegal with no taxing.. So no revenue getting from this economy.. Sometimes regarded as a secret streangth, that is if recovered it increases revenue considerably.. India also got a huge black economy.. But of no use until it is counted legally..

We have indirect taxing several other things as well. But economy is not the topic here.
 
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Do you think PAF will retire 52+s in 25?? You are sadly mistaken ..... As for FC-31 they will probably be arriving after 2018...

when did i say 52+?
We only have 18 52+, the rest are old, they may have been upgraded, but they were originally made in 80s and 90s.
In a decade or so they will become what F-7 and mirage has become for PAF. Flying cofins. They will start to drop from the sky
 
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Can anyone tell me what fighters and interceptors PAF currently has and how many? Sorry for being a noob, I'm just curious
 
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Can anyone tell me what fighters and interceptors PAF currently has and how many? Sorry for being a noob, I'm just curious
 
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