SAC - FC-31 Grey Falcon Stealth aircraft for PAF : Updates & Debate

[Clutch]

If Pakistan gets FC-31 then USA will sell f35 to India imo.

With that logic... It means pakistan should always under equip itself?... I thought the best strategy is to have the qualitative edge over the enemy???

 

[Akh1112]

With that logic... It means pakistan should always under equip itself?... I thought the best strategy is to have the qualitative edge over the enemy???

Yes, it is, now tell me how you intend to gain a qualitative edge over the F-35?

 

[python-000]

PAF must join this project with China & need to induct them in a large number in its orignal form...

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

So is BLOCK 3 we just saw 1 prototype everything else is pure speculation

This is confirmed scheduled production of Block-3 by the Air Chief:

2020: Block-3 x2
2021: Block-3 x12
2022: Block-3 x12
2023: Block-3 x12
2024: Block-3 x12

It is August 2020. So far, so good.
Which Air Chief has confirmed anything about J-31?

Pakistan has officially launched Project Azm and announced completion of its conceptual design so far along with a 10-year journey that began from July 2017.

What has Pakistan said anything about J-31? Nothing.

 

[Pakistan Space Agency]

If Pakistan gets FC-31 then USA will sell f35 to India imo.

The US will not sell F-35 to India simply because of deep Indian military integration with Russian defence industry.

 

[GriffinsRule]

There should be no FC-31 purchase by Pakistan, no matter what people here have been recommending, until PLAAF and/or PLAN have already purchased a few hundred of these already and they have been in service with the Chinese for a decade. Why should PAF be the sole or the first customer of a jet that it had no stake in, not to mention might not even meet the Chinese standards much less the PAF ones.
Add on the high cost due to non-existent supply chain set up and no economies of scale, we need to stay away from it as if it has STDs and Covid 19
For all intents and purposes, this is still a technology demonstrator and not an actual operational aircraft with only two airframes flying for a number of years already.

 

[KaiserX]

Pakistan will most likely place an initial order for 40-50. Who cares if India goes for F-35... will prob take them a decade to sign the contract then another decade to receive them we will have 200+ 5th generation jets by then.

 

[crankthatskunk]

My concerns exactly. Pakistan should be cautious of this.

This is extremely negative and cowardly approach.
There are chances that USA would give F 35 to India in any case.
Where would Pakistan stand then!!

Things are going to change because of China factor too.
For USA , Pakistan is not that important , but China certainly is.

As we all know, USA sees India as cows (Lambs not suitable for India. lolz ) to the slaughter.
USA will beef up India , to send them to the slaughter by the Chinese.

 

[Clutch]

Yes, it is, now tell me how you intend to gain a qualitative edge over the F-35?

It will be tough. Would require innovative counter measures. On the other hand, India can pursue the F-35 without Pakistan acquiring any new platform either.

Lets say India does another failed Balakot attack 2.0 .. And the Rafael doesn't live up to its promised dominance.... They will go for F-35.

Taking a reactive approach will not provide Pakistan with the security and defense it seeks.

 

[GriffinsRule]

It will be tough. Would require innovative counter measures. On the other hand, India can pursue the F-35 without Pakistan acquiring any new platform either.

Lets say India does another failed Balakot attack 2.0 .. And the Rafael doesn't live up to its promised dominance.... They will go for F-35.

Taking a reactive approach will not provide Pakistan with the security and defense it seeks.

So another 4-5 years for them to operationalize the Rafales, try another Balakot, fail. Then start an F-35 tender that would take them another ten years to decide upon, and another five on top of that to take delivery. Seems like we have a lot of time in between now and then.

 

[Akh1112]

It will be tough. Would require innovative counter measures. On the other hand, India can pursue the F-35 without Pakistan acquiring any new platform either.

Lets say India does another failed Balakot attack 2.0 .. And the Rafael doesn't live up to its promised dominance.... They will go for F-35.

Taking a reactive approach will not provide Pakistan with the security and defense it seeks.

They cant realistically, they have tried, what did they get? The F-21 in return.

 

[Clutch]

They cant realistically, they have tried, what did they get? The F-21 in return.

I think it depends how embedded India becomes in the growing Western Anti-China camp. Why should the West give away it's carrots without a commitment first?

India historically vhas maintained a balance between the Western alliance and Russian camp. It's main focus and preparedness has been Pakistan centric. Now India is at a crossroads... As new boundaries are formed.

If India aligns itself fully with the Western agenda... It will be given the F-35 and more. Just like the UAE. It cannot remain neutral and expect all the carrots... It has to make a choice in a growing polarized world.

India can play a double game... Commit fully to the Anti-China Western campaign... But then still focus the newly acquired military wealth (F-35 and beyond) against Pakistan while only paying lip service to Chinese threats...

 

[Figaro]

My concerns exactly. Pakistan should be cautious of this.

Thanks to the Indian purchase of the S-400, this is impossible. India can only opt for the Su-57 at this point.

 

[Clutch]

So another 4-5 years for them to operationalize the Rafales, try another Balakot, fail. Then start an F-35 tender that would take them another ten years to decide upon, and another five on top of that to take delivery. Seems like we have a lot of time in between now and then.

True... Valid points. However, due to complexities with modern aircraft from acquisition, adoption, then deployment will also force pakistan to start making its counter plans... I.e. they cannot wait for India to formally announce their interest in 5th gen F-35 or similar and then PAF responds...

 

[Akh1112]

I think it depends how embedded India becomes in the growing Western Anti-China camp. Why should the West give away it's carrots without a commitment first?

India historically vhas maintained a balance between the Western alliance and Russian camp. It's main focus and preparedness has been Pakistan centric. Now India is at a crossroads... As new boundaries are formed.

If India aligns itself fully with the Western agenda... It will be given the F-35 and more. Just like the UAE. It cannot remain neutral and expect all the carrots... It has to make a choice in a growing polarized world.

India can play a double game... Commit fully to the Anti-China Western campaign... But then still focus the newly acquired military wealth (F-35 and beyond) against Pakistan while only paying lip service to Chinese threats...

Problem is, India will have its own ambitions as it grows, also, India is heavily invested in domestic NGFA programs, they are chugging away slowly, if we were to suddenly narrow that capabilities gap and tilt the balance of power, it gives the US valid reasoning to enable the IAF to procure the F-35, heck, potentially to the point where the IAF would consider ditching the S-400 for the sake of re balancing power in the region. The US would also be worried about surveillance or whatever from the Chinese, the PLA has HQ-9 stationed not too far from IoK, any forward deployments of the F-35 could enable the PLA to gather whatever data they please from what they have, just like how the US is worried the S-400 can be used to gather intel against the F-35.