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S-400 Debacle – A Close Look at Turkey’s F-35 Industrial Participation

There is no way to fly F-35s without ongoing support from Lockheed Martin.
Yeh, what I was wondering. Only way is if LM agree which they never will. So case is pretty much closed for Turkey and F-35s.

They might be planning to buy Su-57s instead and take over India's role in the project. Who knows...
 
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Yeh, what I was wondering. Only way is if LM agree which they never will. So case is pretty much closed for Turkey and F-35s.

They might be planning to buy Su-57s instead and take over India's role in the project. Who knows...

SU-57 is not an alternative... but Eurofighter and Saab Gripen are.
 
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-US can replace Turkish companies in a heart beat . It cost money and some delay on deliveries . That's about it .
-The issue is not about S400 - F35 combination . Our interests and priorities are in conflict with US . Today f35- s400 , tomorrow Cypress , East Mediterranean , Russian pipeline ... its a long list .
-We will never have full control on s400 , F35s or any other foreign systems ,They are rental systems.
-if they push down CAATSA on us then we should start thinking about NATO radar systems necessity in Turkey or if flying with Boeing is a good thing or air pollution at Incirlik base .
- No F35 then get FC31 bodies from China put Turkish avionics , AESA radar and missiles on it like What Israelis do to their F16s and call it a day .
- As one of our president said . A new world gets established and Turkey finds its place there
- If they put CAATSA on us Europeans cant sell a shit to Turkey .Wake up Saab , Euro fighter ,Dassault lovers
 
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I hope Turkey stays in the project and continues delivering the parts, the economical benefits are good.
 
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I hope Turkey stays in the project and continues delivering the parts.

The economical benefits are good, and we can use the money for other projects and requirements.

It's already a done deal.
 
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It's already a done deal.

Even though we don't get them, Turkish companies should continue delivering the parts.
Turkish industrial participation is worth ~$13 billion USD.
 
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S-400 Debacle – A Close Look at Turkey’s F-35 Industrial Participation
March 5, 2019 - by Forecast International


by J. Kasper Oestergaard, European Correspondent, Forecast International.

F-35-1.jpg

Turkey took delivery of its first two F-35s at a ceremony in Ft. Worth, Texas, on June 21, 2018. Due to a ban that prohibits in-country delivery of F-35s to Turkey, the nation’s future as a partner nation is in jeopardy. Source: The official F-35 site, F35.com
Background Information: Turkey is a member of NATO and a critical geopolitical partner, and has been an F-35 partner nation since the project’s official inception in 1999. The country is slated to acquire 100 F-35A CTOL models, with the first batch of 14 already contracted, making it the fourth largest F-35 buyer after the United States, Japan and the United Kingdom. Turkey is increasingly becoming a leader in aerospace manufacturing, and Turkish companies are expected to contribute about $12 billion worth of parts for the F-35. On June 18, 2018, the U.S. Senate passed a bill that blocks the transfer of F-35 fighter jets to Turkey due to Turkey’s decision to purchase Russian S-400 air defense missile systems. A few days later, on June 21, Turkey took delivery of its first two aircraft at a ceremony held in Fort Worth, Texas. For now, the aircraft are stationed at Luke Air Force Base for pilot training. On February 19, 2019, President Donald Trump signed into law the suspension of F-35 deliveries to Turkey.

With Turkey firmly standing its ground on its decision to procure Russian-made S-400 surface-to-air missile systems, the nation’s future role as a partner nation on the F-35 program is in question. Therefore, it is becoming increasingly relevant to take a close look at the role Turkey’s defense industrial base is playing in regards to the F-35 program. If Turkey is kicked off the program, the nation’s statement of work (SOW) will be up for grabs, so it should come as no surprise that rival F-35 suppliers are following the situation closely. While Turkey’s SOW can certainly be absorbed by the existing supply chain, the nation’s involvement in the program is massive and all the work cannot simply be moved overnight without causing major program delays. In practice, it will be a gradual step-by-step process where some work packages will be easier to move than others. In a letter sent to the House Armed Services Committee (HASC) chairman in July 2018, then-Secretary of Defense James Mattis said that removing all Turkish suppliers from the program could delay delivery of 50-75 aircraft for up to 18-24 months.

The largest Turkish F-35 supplier is Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI), which has been supporting the F-35 program since 2008. TAI’s most complex work package is the manufacture and assembly of center fuselages as a second-source supplier. Northrop Grumman in El Segundo, California, is the main center fuselage producer and TAI is supposed to deliver 400 F-35 center fuselages. TAI also produces weapon bay doors and center fuselage composite skins and panels. Furthermore, the company manufactures the aircraft’s composite air inlet ducts. Some years ago, these were built by Orbital ATK (now Northrop Grumman) and are produced with automated fiber placement (AFP) equipment. TAI also builds 45 percent of all the F-35’s air-to-ground pylons (a precision-machined high-tolerance aluminum structure), with Terma Aerostructures in Denmark (45%) and Marvin Engineering in Inglewood, California (10%), making the rest of the pylons. The air-to-ground pylons carry ordnance and external stores and are part of the aircraft’s Alternate Mission Equipment (AME) package.

TAI-F-35.jpg


Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI) is the largest Turkish F-35 supplier. The company’s most complex work package is the production and assembly of center fuselages as a second source supplier to Northrop Grumman. Source: Turkish Aerospace Industries

Other Turkish Suppliers

  • Alp Aviation: On the program since 2004, Alp manufactures metal airframe structures and assemblies, landing gear components, and over 100 F135 engine parts.
  • Ayesas: Sole source supplier of two key F-35 components – the missile remote interface unit and the panoramic cockpit display.
  • Fokker Elmo Turkey (GKN): Manufactures 40 percent of the F-35 Electrical Wiring and Interconnection System (EWIS) and also supports TAI in the production of all center fuselage wiring systems. Fokker Elmo has also developed the EWIS for the F135 engine, of which a major share is produced by the company at its facility in Izmir.
  • Havelsan: Has been supporting the F-35’s training systems since 2005. Additionally, the company has been instrumental as the Turkish lead in developing the construct of the future Turkish F-35 Integrated Pilot and Maintenance Training Center (ITC) and associated training systems in Turkey.
  • Kale Aerospace: F-35 supplier since 2005. In conjunction with TAI, it manufactures and produces F-35 airframe structures and assemblies. Kale also supports Heroux Devtek as the sole-source supplier of landing gear up-lock assemblies. Additionally, Kale has established a joint venture in Izmir with Pratt & Whitney and is manufacturing production hardware for the F135 engine.
  • Roketsan and TÜBİTAK SAGE: Has partnered with Lockheed Martin to develop, integrate, and produce the precision-guided standoff missile (SOM-J) that will be carried in the F-35’s weapon bays. SOM-J is designed for use against heavily defended, high-value anti-surface warfare (ASuW) and land targets.


References:

There is already a thread going on for this subject and in fact this very article is already posted there.

S-400 Debacle – A Close Look at Turkey’s F-35 Industrial Participation
March 5, 2019 - by Forecast International


by J. Kasper Oestergaard, European Correspondent, Forecast International.

F-35-1.jpg

Turkey took delivery of its first two F-35s at a ceremony in Ft. Worth, Texas, on June 21, 2018. Due to a ban that prohibits in-country delivery of F-35s to Turkey, the nation’s future as a partner nation is in jeopardy. Source: The official F-35 site, F35.com
Background Information: Turkey is a member of NATO and a critical geopolitical partner, and has been an F-35 partner nation since the project’s official inception in 1999. The country is slated to acquire 100 F-35A CTOL models, with the first batch of 14 already contracted, making it the fourth largest F-35 buyer after the United States, Japan and the United Kingdom. Turkey is increasingly becoming a leader in aerospace manufacturing, and Turkish companies are expected to contribute about $12 billion worth of parts for the F-35. On June 18, 2018, the U.S. Senate passed a bill that blocks the transfer of F-35 fighter jets to Turkey due to Turkey’s decision to purchase Russian S-400 air defense missile systems. A few days later, on June 21, Turkey took delivery of its first two aircraft at a ceremony held in Fort Worth, Texas. For now, the aircraft are stationed at Luke Air Force Base for pilot training. On February 19, 2019, President Donald Trump signed into law the suspension of F-35 deliveries to Turkey.

With Turkey firmly standing its ground on its decision to procure Russian-made S-400 surface-to-air missile systems, the nation’s future role as a partner nation on the F-35 program is in question. Therefore, it is becoming increasingly relevant to take a close look at the role Turkey’s defense industrial base is playing in regards to the F-35 program. If Turkey is kicked off the program, the nation’s statement of work (SOW) will be up for grabs, so it should come as no surprise that rival F-35 suppliers are following the situation closely. While Turkey’s SOW can certainly be absorbed by the existing supply chain, the nation’s involvement in the program is massive and all the work cannot simply be moved overnight without causing major program delays. In practice, it will be a gradual step-by-step process where some work packages will be easier to move than others. In a letter sent to the House Armed Services Committee (HASC) chairman in July 2018, then-Secretary of Defense James Mattis said that removing all Turkish suppliers from the program could delay delivery of 50-75 aircraft for up to 18-24 months.

The largest Turkish F-35 supplier is Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI), which has been supporting the F-35 program since 2008. TAI’s most complex work package is the manufacture and assembly of center fuselages as a second-source supplier. Northrop Grumman in El Segundo, California, is the main center fuselage producer and TAI is supposed to deliver 400 F-35 center fuselages. TAI also produces weapon bay doors and center fuselage composite skins and panels. Furthermore, the company manufactures the aircraft’s composite air inlet ducts. Some years ago, these were built by Orbital ATK (now Northrop Grumman) and are produced with automated fiber placement (AFP) equipment. TAI also builds 45 percent of all the F-35’s air-to-ground pylons (a precision-machined high-tolerance aluminum structure), with Terma Aerostructures in Denmark (45%) and Marvin Engineering in Inglewood, California (10%), making the rest of the pylons. The air-to-ground pylons carry ordnance and external stores and are part of the aircraft’s Alternate Mission Equipment (AME) package.

TAI-F-35.jpg


Turkish Aerospace Industries (TAI) is the largest Turkish F-35 supplier. The company’s most complex work package is the production and assembly of center fuselages as a second source supplier to Northrop Grumman. Source: Turkish Aerospace Industries

Other Turkish Suppliers

  • Alp Aviation: On the program since 2004, Alp manufactures metal airframe structures and assemblies, landing gear components, and over 100 F135 engine parts.
  • Ayesas: Sole source supplier of two key F-35 components – the missile remote interface unit and the panoramic cockpit display.
  • Fokker Elmo Turkey (GKN): Manufactures 40 percent of the F-35 Electrical Wiring and Interconnection System (EWIS) and also supports TAI in the production of all center fuselage wiring systems. Fokker Elmo has also developed the EWIS for the F135 engine, of which a major share is produced by the company at its facility in Izmir.
  • Havelsan: Has been supporting the F-35’s training systems since 2005. Additionally, the company has been instrumental as the Turkish lead in developing the construct of the future Turkish F-35 Integrated Pilot and Maintenance Training Center (ITC) and associated training systems in Turkey.
  • Kale Aerospace: F-35 supplier since 2005. In conjunction with TAI, it manufactures and produces F-35 airframe structures and assemblies. Kale also supports Heroux Devtek as the sole-source supplier of landing gear up-lock assemblies. Additionally, Kale has established a joint venture in Izmir with Pratt & Whitney and is manufacturing production hardware for the F135 engine.
  • Roketsan and TÜBİTAK SAGE: Has partnered with Lockheed Martin to develop, integrate, and produce the precision-guided standoff missile (SOM-J) that will be carried in the F-35’s weapon bays. SOM-J is designed for use against heavily defended, high-value anti-surface warfare (ASuW) and land targets.
 
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Turkish stream with Russian gas and Akkuyu nuclear power plant will the next demand of americans, that is why i say by by F35. It is not the end of the world if we don't have F35.
Even Russians don't have F35 :D and they are surviving.
So yes, not a big deal. Russia has a lot to offer.
 
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The moment we drop CAATSA on your head, your fragile economy will collapse and you won’t have funds to procure fc31 from China nor Chinese industry will be willing to come under sanctions for dealing with you.
We imposed bs sanctions on your minister of interior and added couple of companies on a shit list and your lira devalued threefold
Russians single handedly ruined your tourism and agricultural sector and Erdogan couldn’t stop writing love letters to Putin.
So stop blowing your cheeks and puffing your chest you need to face the reality, your country is not an economic powerhouse never was and never will be. And they way you were handled in Syria you lost your status of regional hegemon. (a.russians are bombing Idlib smack behind your observation posts and it’s been 3 month since Erdogan screamed that attack on Minbij is imminent)


You can’t afford to walk away from F35 project not only because your companies make good profit but also because a. Repercussions will be severe in terms of possible sanctions. b.reputational risk

What about the national debt which U.S never can pay back? What if the world decide to trade in other currency? Your economy is the biggest bullshit on this planet.
 
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Daily reminder : don't feed the troll. Especially now that we've seen how trolls manifest into terrorists in NZ.
 
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after 31 march election in Turkey , everybody will see what will happen in Syria

sooner or later Turkish Armed Forces will clean Manbij,Ayn Al Arab,Telabyad,Rasulayn from the US backed ugly smelly Pkk/Ypg terrorists .... and bye bye zionist Israeli dream

keep dreaming with useless CAATSA
Turkey never will allow the US and Israel to create terrorist Pkk/Ypg state in N.Syria


Americans should care about Boeing ,,, Boeing lost $29 billion of market value since 737 Max crash and Boeing lost a potential Asian order

Turkey buys 98 Boeing 737 Max $10 billion ( 2018-2021 ) and 40 Boeing 787-900 Dreamliner $11 billion ( 2019-2023 )

so TRUMP is not stupid to lose around $40 billion from Turkey

-- 100 F-35A $10 billion
-- 32 F-35B $5 billion
-- 98 Boeing 737 Max $10 billion
-- 40 Boeing 787-900 Dreamliner $11 billion

also maybe PATRIOT Air Defense System for $3,5 billion



Slaves CIA , PENTAGON and BUSH,OBAMA,TRUMP spent trillion dollars for Israeli interests in the Middle East

on the other hand there are over 50 million extreme poor population in the US
and the US have no money to modernize Airports, high ways , railways , infrastructure and superstructure projects

so shut up and come to Iraq and Syria and die for Israeli interests ,, you pathetic slave christian Americans


the US attacks Turkish Economy since 2017
on the other hand Natural disasters cost the US economy a record $307 billion in 2017 and $91 billion in 2018

Poetic justice
 
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