What's new

Reuters: Germany to buy 60 Chinook helicopters

Get Ya Wig Split

SENIOR MEMBER
Joined
Feb 22, 2017
Messages
2,585
Reaction score
-2
Country
United States
Location
United States

Germany Picks Chinook Over King Stallion For New Heavy-Lift Helicopter

Choosing Chinook aligns Germany’s heavy lift capabilities with eight other NATO nations.​

1654114721241.png


he German government will buy Boeing’s CH-47 Chinook to satisfy the need for a modern heavy-lift helicopter, passing on the Sikorsky CH-53K for the “Schwerer Transporthubschrauber,” or Heavy Transport Helicopter program.

Germany plans to purchase 60 F-model Chinooks in the Block II standard configuration with air-to-air refueling capability, Defense Minister Christine Lambrecht announced on June 1 "after careful consideration of all factors." Block II includes a toughened airframe, improved drivetrain and avionics upgrades to the CH-47F Block I. As the incumbent heavy-lift helicopter builder for Germany, the competition was Sikorsy's to lose, as the German armed forces have flown the CH-53G Super Stallions since the 1960s.


"We thoroughly weighed up the pros and cons, as well as the risks — and then came to a unanimous decision in favor of this model.," Lambrecht said. "The Chinook is modern and proven. With this model, we are strengthening our cooperation capability in Europe. In addition, we get a larger fleet here and gain flexibility."

There is no official letter of agreement yet, according to a Boeing spokesperson. Germany’s parliament must still approve the decision to enter a U.S. Foreign Military Sales (FMS) program to replace its current fleet of Sikorsky CH-53G helicopters.


Sikorsky, now owned by Lockheed Martin, said it was “disappointed” by the decision and was awaiting a debrief from the German Ministry of Defense. As builder of the in-service CH-53G, the company said it is committed to the “long-standing relationships supporting the German Armed Forces.”

“We remain confident the Sikorsky CH-53K King Stallion is the safest, most modern, capable, and reliable heavy-lift helicopter available today,” a Lockheed spokesperson said in an email to The War Zone. “The CH-53K can provide significantly more advanced operational capabilities, aerial refueling, extended range for humanitarian missions, and unmatched heavy lift capabilities with far fewer aircraft, logistical support, maintenance, training, and operating cost than any heavy-lift aircraft flying today.”

Chinook and the King Stallion have gone head-to-head for the German STH program for several years. Though both are heavy lifters and have radically different designs, Germany wasn’t the first time the CH-47 and CH-53K fought for the same program. In another one-on-one competition to replace Israel’s CH-53 helicopters, the CH-53K triumphed. With a per-unit cost of $32 million, the CH-47F Block II is also far more affordable in terms of initial acquisition compared to the CH-53K, which has a flyaway cost of $91.6 million per aircraft.

1654114909347.png


he tandem-rotor CH-47 Chinook has been in service with the U.S. Army and allied militaries for decades. In the current F-model configuration, the CH-47 can take off at a gross weight of 46,280 pounds at 4,000 feet on a 95-degree Fahrenheit day. Boeing and the Army are also developing a Block II configuration that features a more robust airframe, souped-up drivetrain, and improved avionics. With new advanced rotor blades, the configuration was meant to boost a Chinook’s takeoff weight to 48,000 lb. in the same conditions. However, the Army has decided not to purchase advanced rotor blades.
F-model Chinooks can carry 36 troops, have an external sling-load capacity of 26,000 pounds using the center hook, and are powered by twin Lycoming T55-GA714A engines, each with 4,733 shaft horsepower. Boeing, in cooperation with the Army, has also flown the CH-47F with more-powerful General Electric T408 engines, the same ones installed on the CH-53K.

The CH-53K is an evolutionary derivative of Germany’s current CH-53G fleet. It is designed for use aboard ships in harsh maritime and coastal environments. The single-main-rotor helicopter only recently entered service with the U.S. Marine Corps after a tumultuous development process filled with growing pains. It will replace the CH-53E in performing heavy ship-to-shore transport of cargo and troops.

Each King Stallion is powered by three 7,500-shaft-horsepower General Electric GE38-1B engines that give the helicopter massive lifting power for a maximum takeoff gross weight of 88,000 pounds. The CH-53K has lifted loads up to 36,000 lb. on an external center hook and can carry 37 troops aside from pilots and crew.

In choosing Chinook, Germany gave up some lifting capacity. Still, it aligned itself with eight other NATO countries — the Netherlands, Italy, Greece, Spain, Turkey, the U.K., Canada, and the United States — that operate some variant of the CH-47.

Initially planned as a direct commercial sale to Germany, Berlin reversed course midway through the original selection process and submitted a request to purchase an STH aircraft through the FMS process, which Lockheed protested last year and lost.

In September 2020, Germany rejected both offers claiming they were too expensive, effectively canceling the program. At the time, the Ministry of Defense acknowledged the need for a new heavy-lift rotorcraft and committed itself to replace the CH-53G in a “timely manner” if a more affordable option became available.

Germany seems to have overcome the budget considerations that caused that cancellation. The STH saga also comes to a close in a very different security environment than what existed in Europe before Russia invaded Ukraine. That conflict has pushed NATO member states to modernize and expand their militaries more aggressively. Though Germany has been slow to provide arms directly to Ukraine in its fight against Russia, moving forward on the STH program broadcasts a desire to bolster Germany’s military and NATO’s collective security. The heavy-lift capabilities these helicopters will provide are a critical component of doing so.


 
. . . . .
HCII_Chinook_Helicopter_Lift_3_Master.jpg



Maybe China can provide something similar...

ignore the troll, MI-26 is a hanger queen and is unusable in battle. It is quite handy for peacetime heavy lift, when it works that is...
 
. .
That bird is not built to be used in combat, it's practically an invitation to lob a couple of RPGs at it.
"支奴干有一个致命的缺陷,诚然双旋翼的设计让其稳定性更高,不过与此同时它的机动性就差了很多。随着各国先进武器装备的不断更新,“支奴干”未来在战场上的存活率将会越来越低。"
Google translation:
The Chinook has a fatal flaw. It is true that the dual rotor design makes it more stable, but at the same time it is much less maneuverable. With the continuous updating of advanced weapons and equipment in various countries, the survival rate of "Chinooks" on the battlefield will become lower and lower in the future.
 
.
"支奴干有一个致命的缺陷,诚然双旋翼的设计让其稳定性更高,不过与此同时它的机动性就差了很多。随着各国先进武器装备的不断更新,“支奴干”未来在战场上的存活率将会越来越低。"
Google translation:
The Chinook has a fatal flaw. It is true that the dual rotor design makes it more stable, but at the same time it is much less maneuverable. With the continuous updating of advanced weapons and equipment in various countries, the survival rate of "Chinooks" on the battlefield will become lower and lower in the future.

Exactly, MANPADS are an emerging threat for troop transport helicopters.
 
. .
"支奴干有一个致命的缺陷,诚然双旋翼的设计让其稳定性更高,不过与此同时它的机动性就差了很多。随着各国先进武器装备的不断更新,“支奴干”未来在战场上的存活率将会越来越低。"
Google translation:
The Chinook has a fatal flaw. It is true that the dual rotor design makes it more stable, but at the same time it is much less maneuverable. With the continuous updating of advanced weapons and equipment in various countries, the survival rate of "Chinooks" on the battlefield will become lower and lower in the future.

much less maneuverable? says who? do you even know the meaning of the word maneuverable?
 
.
Exactly, MANPADS are an emerging threat for troop transport helicopters.

always was, it's never stopped the Chinook from landing at a hot LZ.
The latest Chinook are equipped with Nemesis IR counter measures and tested against 24 different types of handheld and portable anti-air missiles.

Of course unguided RPGs are still the greatest threat (Somalia and Afghanistan) because the only counter measure to unguided munitions is to make sure all enemy heads are forced down before approaching a hot LZ. Some places its easier such as flat terrain others especially urban it's difficult.
 
.
"支奴干有一个致命的缺陷,诚然双旋翼的设计让其稳定性更高,不过与此同时它的机动性就差了很多。随着各国先进武器装备的不断更新,“支奴干”未来在战场上的存活率将会越来越低。"
Google translation:
The Chinook has a fatal flaw. It is true that the dual rotor design makes it more stable, but at the same time it is much less maneuverable. With the continuous updating of advanced weapons and equipment in various countries, the survival rate of "Chinooks" on the battlefield will become lower and lower in the future.
And the OP wants it to perform like a fighter jet :dance3: should have seen the title when the thread was created "Germany to buy chinooks, russia in shambles":rofl::dance3:
 
.
Designed and manufactured half a century ago when anti chopper weapons were minimal and backward, fast forward 50 years to present, this kind of legacy weapons can no longer find a suitable place in today's warfare.
Then why is China, Europe, Russia and India manufacturing all of those choppers?
The battlefield is hazardous for Choppers but at the same time they are an invaluable contributor to the battlefield.

What they require is speed and maneuverability along with countermeasures.
 
.
"支奴干有一个致命的缺陷,诚然双旋翼的设计让其稳定性更高,不过与此同时它的机动性就差了很多。随着各国先进武器装备的不断更新,“支奴干”未来在战场上的存活率将会越来越低。"
Google translation:
The Chinook has a fatal flaw. It is true that the dual rotor design makes it more stable, but at the same time it is much less maneuverable. With the continuous updating of advanced weapons and equipment in various countries, the survival rate of "Chinooks" on the battlefield will become lower and lower in the future.
You expecting Chinese helicopters to fly like some fighter jet? What helicopter can do what the Chinook can't do?
 
.

Pakistan Affairs Latest Posts

Country Latest Posts

Back
Top Bottom