Question for Indian Seculars: ... how are you going to tackle this Hindu Extremist madness?

[veg]

Muslims need to quit identity politics. Muslims need to decide what makes their identity - in my opinion eating beef, wearing a skull cap, having a beard, wearing a veil does not make you a Muslim. Some of those things might have to go.

The religious Muslims do try their best for identity politics. But in the best interests of India, the Moderate Muslims should be able to join the national parties.

Eating beef may be an identity, but not "identity politics".
Similarly wearing cap, beard, veil may be identity issues, but not "identity politics".

Forming Political Parties like Awaisi is identity politics. Otherwise Maulan Azad with his beard and cap worked perfectly with Hindus in 1947 and there was no issue.

Secularism must have the depth and power to sustain the cultural shocks.

Either it is Muslim cap/beard/veil or the Hindu Yellow dressing with Tikka on forehead, etc. which are also seen as political identity. Actually yellow dressing has been used as Political Identity and much more than Muslim beard/cap/veil which are more a traditional thing.

In my view eating Beef was not so much political, but the ban on beef has been made political by Hindu Political parties.

Blaming the BJP for communal politics is not going to take you anywhere. The BJP had 2 members in the Lower House in the 1984 elections. This is 37 years after independence. If there was communal politics it was played by others too. Indian Muslims are not innocent bystanders in the whole spectacle. They voted en mass for the Muslim League in 1946.

Even if BJP not present in parliament in 1984, but still the BJP was present on the ground and Shiv Sena and other communal parties too who were campaigning for communal politics. They didn't have the majority therefore problem were less as compared to today.

Today communal parties are holding the power. Therefore they may avoid Babari Masjid type issues, while it were they themselves who used these issue while they were in the opposition.

The Muslim party of Awaisi was also not present till 2000 and still Muslims were using political identity.

So, the presence in parliament is not necessary, but issue is the presence of this mindset, which has always been there.

Only secular mindset is free of this communal issues and never make Babari Masjid type issues a national crises or spread hatred among the communities and only Secular mindset has the depth to unite all of them in Indian colour.

With BJP, the colours will always be communal and never the Indian.

 

[wiseone2]

The religious Muslims do try their best for identity politics. But in the best interests of India, the Moderate Muslims should be able to join the national parties.

Eating beef may be an identity, but not "identity politics".
Similarly wearing cap, beard, veil may be identity issues, but not "identity politics".

Forming Political Parties like Awaisi is identity politics. Otherwise Maulan Azad with his beard and cap worked perfectly with Hindus in 1947 and there was no issue.

Secularism must have the depth and power to sustain the cultural shocks.

Either it is Muslim cap/beard/veil or the Hindu Yellow dressing with Tikka on forehead, etc. which are also seen as political identity. Actually yellow dressing has been used as Political Identity and much more than Muslim beard/cap/veil which are more a traditional thing.

In my view eating Beef was not so much political, but the ban on beef has been made political by Hindu Political parties.

Even if BJP not present in parliament in 1984, but still the BJP was present on the ground and Shiv Sena and other communal parties too who were campaigning for communal politics. They didn't have the majority therefore problem were less as compared to today.

Today communal parties are holding the power. Therefore they may avoid Babari Masjid type issues, while it were they themselves who used these issue while they were in the opposition.

The Muslim party of Awaisi was also not present till 2000 and still Muslims were using political identity.

So, the presence in parliament is not necessary, but issue is the presence of this mindset, which has always been there.

Only secular mindset is free of this communal issues and never make Babari Masjid type issues a national crises or spread hatred among the communities and only Secular mindset has the depth to unite all of them in Indian colour.

With BJP, the colours will always be communal and never the Indian.

Muslims do no have a choice but to join national political parties. Indian political system is winner take all system for each legislative seat. Unless Muslims are in a majority they have to make alliances to win seats. I believe less than 15 seats have a Muslim majority.

Fighting the mindset is more important. In that sense eating beef, beard, skull cap, veil make a difference. Blend in with the majority. No one can identify who a Muslim is. That is the only solution.

Expect every fight for scarce resource to be magnified into group or communal fight as time goes on and population increases

 

[Jackdaws]

In Pakistan, we (the Seculars) have already lost the battle and there is no chance that Pakistani system is ever going to change from Religious to Secular one. But:

1) Secular Forces in India are much more stronger than Pakistan.

2) Educational System in India is also powerful, and I am sure the numbers of people leaving Religion (i.e. becoming Atheists) should also be very high. And at the end, these Atheists will also join the secular forces instead of right wing religious parties.

3) India has a very big minorities population. 18% schedule caste, 14% Muslims and then Christians and Shikhs and others.
All these minorities are on the LEFT side standing with you instead of the Right Religious Parties.

How come that still the Secular Forces lost (and lost so badly) in India at the hands of Religious Parties?

What are the main factors of defeat?

What could be done in order to tackle this problem?

It's really saddens me to see the situation in India. If Hindu extremism increases in India, then it only brings more Muslim extremism in Pakistan. I wished India would have been a role model in this region for Secularism.

It is a legitimate question. But I recall the same question being asked in the time of Vajpayee when Gujarat riots and instances like Graham Staines episode happened. It is cyclical. Modi is not Mugabe. He will eventually lose - they all do. He was elected on the back of economic reform and corruption. So far in 3 years, his record has been stellar when it comes to corruption and average in terms of economics. But I see better governance in my state for sure. Lots of clamping down on corruption. So I don't think Modi will be dislodged in 2019. 2024 if the opposition finally gets its act together.