Quaid E Azam Liberal or Secular ? | Dr Amir Liaquat | 25 Dec 2016

[SarthakGanguly]

after seeing actions of Hindus and specially there leaders.

Nothing like that. Don't blame it on Hindus. Iqbal became radicalized in England away from Hindus. Same with Jinnah.

 

[Zarvan]

Nothing like that. Don't blame it on Hindus. Iqbal became radicalized in England away from Hindus. Same with Jinnah.

No they didn't your actions specially under Congress rule and even before that make both Iqbal and Jinah realize that both can't go together. Neither Iqbal nor Jinah were radicalized by any one and any where your actions opened there eyes and made the realize that solution was seperate homeland.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

No they didn't your actions specially under Congress rule and even before that make both Iqbal and Jinah realize that both can't go together. Neither Iqbal nor Jinah were radicalized by any one and any where your actions opened there eyes and made the realize that solution was seperate homeland.

Iqbal did not even ask for separate homeland. Neither did Jinnah till 1946.

Give SPECIFIC EXAMPLES of Congress Hindu laws that you talk about.

Btw, why did the Muslims feel so insecure under Hindu majority? Did they do anything wrong to expect any mistreatment?

 

[Zarvan]

Iqbal did not even ask for separate homeland. Neither did Jinnah till 1946.

Give SPECIFIC EXAMPLES of Congress Hindu laws that you talk about.

Btw, why did the Muslims feel so insecure under Hindu majority? Did they do anything wrong to expect any mistreatment?

You did so much during congress rule that when you got off from the power even the person like Jinah told Muslims to celebrate as Youm e Nijat. The day of getting rid of brutal rule. And your Modi right now is the biggest example and decisions taken by your Supreme Court is another decision why we opted for Pakistan.

 

[Tipu7]

Jinah was a Muslim and proud of being a Muslim. Even before entering politics his actions proved of him being the proud Muslim. He initially just like Iqbal also thought that Hindus and Muslims can live together but they were disappointed after seeing actions of Hindus and specially there leaders. So there focus shifted towards getting separate state for Muslims where laws of Quran and Sunnah can be implemented. Jinah speeches from 1940 till his death not a single mention of secularism or Pakistani laws being secular but several mentions on Pakistani laws being based on Islam and Islamic principals and Quran and Sunnah even word shariat was used few times by Jinah.

@Tipu7

Exactly. Our focus should be on What He wanted instead What He was. He was given a goal and he full filled his part.
Rest is up to our Generation how to full fill what is yet to be full filled.

 

[Lucky Breeze]

Here we go again.

I'm going to end this debate before it starts. If you are a Muslim, Allahs input in the Quran and the Prophets input in the hadiths should be what you use to decide how to govern Pakistan.

Jazzak Allah

 

[SW187]

Quaid E Azam Liberal or Secular ? | Dr Amir Liaquat | 25 Dec 2016

The video link doesn't work.... I really wanted to watch it!

 

[ghazi52]

The video link doesn't work.... I really wanted to watch it!

 

[SW187]

Thanks. Much appreciated

 

[SarthakGanguly]

You did so much during congress rule that when you got off from the power even the person like Jinah told Muslims to celebrate as Youm e Nijat. The day of getting rid of brutal rule. And your Modi right now is the biggest example and decisions taken by your Supreme Court is another decision why we opted for Pakistan.

EXAMPLES.

Concrete examples. I understand Muslims have a problem with being ruled by any non Muslim. I will accept that. But you say there were reasons. Give exact examples.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

EXAMPLES.

Concrete examples. I understand Muslims have a problem with being ruled by any non Muslim. I will accept that. But you say there were reasons. Give exact examples.

We don't want to end up being treated like the Kashmiris in IOK. We wanted our own homeland to preserve our own unique beautiful race, heritage, unique culture and way of life. And the freedom to practice it without oppression, interference or fear from those ugly external sources which seek to destroy us. We achieved that. All else is mumbo jumbo.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

And I am still waiting for examples of Congressi evil Hindu rule prior to 1947 over Mooslems that forced stalwarts like Iqbal and Jinnah to leave their hopes of Hindu Muslim bonhomie and made them Islamist separatists.

I will accept the justification that Muslims find it offensive and humiliating to be ruled by non Muslims - that is something I will understand and accept.

We wanted our own homeland to preserve our own unique beautiful race, heritage, unique culture and way of life.

What is the race? How is the Punjabi race different in Panjab and Punjab? How is the race different between Sindhi Hindus and Muslims? Or Balouch Hindus and Muslims or Pashtun Sikhs and Muslims?

What heritage? Give examples.

Unique culture? Give examples of uniqueness. How it is followed only in the region and NOWHERE else (defn. of unique).

Way of life? Give examples of uniqueness again.

Then discuss with your compatriots and provide me with exact laws passed by the Congress ruled Indians prior to 1947 that made poor secular Jinnah and Iqbal into Islamic separatists.

Again, I repeat - accept that it was established to protect Islam (as claimed by Rehmet Ali himself in 33) and I will understand and respect that. Being ruled by non Muslims, especially the the Muslim elite used to treating Hindus as ONLY slaves was humiliating. That I understand. But since you people want to pin the blame on Hindus I ask you to give concrete events that forced Jinnah and Iqbal to turn.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

And I am still waiting for examples of Congressi evil Hindu rule prior to 1947 over Mooslems that forced stalwarts like Iqbal and Jinnah to leave their hopes of Hindu Muslim bonhomie and made them Islamist separatists.

I will accept the justification that Muslims find it offensive and humiliating to be ruled by non Muslims - that is something I will understand and accept.


What is the race? How is the Punjabi race different in Panjab and Punjab? How is the race different between Sindhi Hindus and Muslims? Or Balouch Hindus and Muslims or Pashtun Sikhs and Muslims?

What heritage? Give examples.

Unique culture? Give examples of uniqueness. How it is followed only in the region and NOWHERE else (defn. of unique).

Way of life? Give examples of uniqueness again.

Then discuss with your compatriots and provide me with exact laws passed by the Congress ruled Indians prior to 1947 that made poor secular Jinnah and Iqbal into Islamic separatists.

Again, I repeat - accept that it was established to protect Islam (as claimed by Rehmet Ali himself in 33) and I will understand and respect that. Being ruled by non Muslims, especially the the Muslim elite used to treating Hindus as ONLY slaves was humiliating. That I understand. But since you people want to pin the blame on Hindus I ask you to give concrete events that forced Jinnah and Iqbal to turn.

Who cares about conjecture? Pakistan was created and is not going anywhere EVER. We are not going to be ruled by indians EVER. And that's all that matters. All else is irrelevant gibberish. It's like saying what would have happened to the red indians had America not been discovered by the Europeans. It CAN NEVER be undone. No point of discussing far-fetched hypothetical scenarios.

 

[SarthakGanguly]

Here we go again.

I'm going to end this debate before it starts. If you are a Muslim, Allahs input in the Quran and the Prophets input in the hadiths should be what you use to decide how to govern Pakistan.

Agreed.

And honestly, Pakistan has not done justice to his creation. The Anglo Saxon law is still largely the law of the land and the Institutions are not entirely Shariah based either. It does not make sense. If secularism or non theocratic society was the way to go, just an autonomy within the Union of India would have been sufficient. Even Zia did not complete Jinnah's vision. In spite of all this, Zia is hated by many Pakistanis. I absolutely don't understand why.

Who cares about conjecture? Pakistan was created and is not going anywhere EVER. We are not going to be ruled by indians EVER. And that's all that matters. All else is irrelevant gibberish. It's like saying what would have happened to the red indians had America not been discovered by the Europeans. It CAN NEVER be undone. No point of discussing far-fetched hypothetical scenarios.

I understand you have no answers. I will wait for other members to answer.

 

[H!TchHiker]

Thank you Jinnah....Being called as an Indian is the biggest torture we could have faced... No one can force us now to sing Vande Mataram as they did in Past. We don't bow to anyone except the one true GOD