Proof of India's role in Balochistan at 'suitable time': Gilani

[arihant]

I have changed my view. I am now able to see role of India in Baluchistan. Well common will not think in this way but this is must for India to divert the attention of army (Pak army) from giving training to terrorist to fight in Baluchistan. Although I hardly think India is doing anything wrong when pakistan can support terrorist activities in India. Although the concept is very small compared to what Pakistani Civilian thinks and its very big compared to what Indian Civilian think about role of India in Baluch.

My view got changed after reading how raw has worked in Bangladesh for 24 Years to divide Pakistan although, Pakistan himself was the responsible for that. Raw was taking care of adding fuel to the fire.

As far as suitable time is consider, I don't think they are having enough evidence right now. After seeing dosage from India on 26/11, they are trying to prepare similar dosage which will take more time then expected. May be 2 years from now. I don't think Indians are providing gun, they just offer money to them. So, only Money and Mind are been used to encourage sardars to fight against govt. and liberate it.

Also, I agree with the point of India's role of Afghanistan is directly linked with Baluchistan because that is the only place from where they can easily cross the border.

ISI and RAW both trying to destruct each other. One thing last I want to admit that ISI is supporting terrorism by Guns while RAW is playing MIND game. The biggest reason for all this is Kashmir Can we stop fighting ?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

US still doesn't trust Pak because your ISI or whoever is still training those terrorists =0.

This report would indicate differently:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/pakistans-war/39093-cia-says-gets-its-moneys-worth-isi.html

As for the drones, I believe the technology and processes that made the drone program such a success in Iraq have not been shared with close allies like the UK either.

Bob Woodward wrote an excellent series of articles on the classified drone project, after being briefed on it, comparing it to the "Manhattan Project". If his characterization is correct, then it is easy to see why the US might be reluctant to allow Pakistan to operate the project.

 

[jeet]

My dear. Right time never comes by itself. You should bring it....
Even if they provide the evidence, I wonder how many countries will belive it after seeing their previous track record.............

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

My dear. Right time never comes by itself. You should bring it....
Even if they provide the evidence, I wonder how many countries will belive it after seeing their previous track record.............

You mean the track record of India in supporting terrorists in East Pakistan and Sri Lanka ala the LTTE?

 

[arihant]

My dear. Right time never comes by itself. You should bring it....
Even if they provide the evidence, I wonder how many countries will belive it after seeing their previous track record.............

Even one believe there is nothing one can do. India is doing what Pakistan is doing in India.

 

[arihant]

You mean the track record of India in supporting terrorists in East Pakistan and Sri Lanka ala the LTTE?

You mean Bangladeshi as Terrorist ? I Thought genocide by Pak Army was terrorism.

About LTTE, everyone is aware what has happen. India supported them in early 90's then on revert got gift of suicide and then things got reverted. Although South Indian Politics continue to support for political reason. But that was not RAW because RAW is under PM.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

You mean Bangladeshi as Terrorist ? I Thought genocide by Pak Army was terrorism.

There is no evidence of genocide, however India does proudly proclaim support for recruiting, arming and infiltrating terrorists into the sovereign undisputed territory of East Pakistan to destabilize it.

About LTTE, everyone is aware what has happen. India supported them in early 90's then on revert got gift of suicide and then things got reverted. Although South Indian Politics continue to support for political reason. But that was not RAW because RAW is under PM.

Point being that India supported terrorist organizations on multiple occasions, and retired Indian bureaucrats, intelligence officials, analysts etc. have openly argued for an Indian policy that seeks to keep Pakistan destabilized by supporting terrorism within it, while not quite collapsing it.

Here is an example of the type of comments I am referring to, posted by a gent named Ali on another forum:

However, there's a significant amount of testimony outside Pakistan backing the claim about Indian involvement.

Arun Shourie, the Indian parlimentarian, had this to say in his speech to the Lok Sabha after 26/11 (http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?239206):

"Eleven, the time when large armies could be sent across the borders -- [it is said a lot that we should attack Pakistan]-- that time has gone. The time when large bodies of armies could be sent across the borders has gone. There are no training camps to bomb. But Pakistan gives us the clue what we should be doing to make them register a cause, that is, look at the violence in Kashmir in the last year-and-a-half that has gone down because Pakistan has been preoccupied in its own problems. So, keep it preoccupied in its own problems in Baluchistan, in Gilgit Baltistan, in ***."

Vikram Sood, the former R&AW chief, had much the same to say (http://soodvikram.blogspot.com/2009_01_05_archive.htm)

As did B Raman (http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?239124):

A divided Pakistan, a bleeding Pakistan, a Pakistan ever on the verge of collapse without actually collapsing--that should be our objective till it stops using terrorism against India.

The opinion expressed by these Indians is basically that the conventional projection of force is denied by Pakistan's nukes, so unconventional force should be used.

 

[RobbieS]

There is no evidence of genocide, however India does proudly proclaim support for recruiting, arming and infiltrating terrorists into the sovereign undisputed territory of East Pakistan to destabilize it.


Point being that India supported terrorist organizations on multiple occasions, and retired Indian bureaucrats, intelligence officials, analysts etc. have openly argued for an Indian policy that seeks to keep Pakistan destabilized by supporting terrorism within it, while not quite collapsing it.

Here is an example of the type of comments I am referring to, posted by a gent named Ali on another forum:

I for one, dont see any fault in helping the Baloch rebels. If this is what keeps Kashmir from boiling and Delhi and Mumbai safe from terrorist bomb attacks, I am game to pay higher taxes to incur the expense of funding these rebels. After all what price is safety and security?

And I believe RAW doesn't need to do a lot in Waziristan and Balochistan. These guys have been well trained by both CIA and ISI for ages and are battle hardy. Plus they have the huge domestic illegal arms industry for supplies. We just have to splurge the cash.

For Pakistan and ISI, this is and would continue to be their worst nightmare. Their owned trained and fed, turning their guns on them and blowing their cities and markets. The blowing up of the ISI HQ in Peshawar must have been like a dagger through the heart of these ISI terrorist handlers. Its payback time!

 

[PlanetWarrior]

If a man has evidence that his wife is sleeping with his neighbor would he say to his family and neighbors "I will produce the evidence when the time is right" or would he immediately say "here are the photographs and evidence which supports my claim"?

I guess in this case the man is suspicious but is now closely watching his wife and his neighbor hoping that his hunch is correct and that he can gather some evidence. For now though all he is doing is venting his suspicion

 

[courageneverdies]

I think some of these evidences were shown to Manmohan G in Sharm-ul-Shaikh by Pakistan and after which the PM of India did confirm at first that they have some role to play in Balochistan.

This is not the right time for Pakistan to open a new front. We are already in a war-like condition and things will take sometime to get streamlined. By not presenting the evidences now is called politics on international level.

Secondly, PM of Pakistan claims that evidences will be brought to air simply means that there are some, for if there have not been he would have never put him in trouble in front of the media. He could simply say, "Negotiations are in progress." A direct attack does mean that something is been in their hands.

TIme is what we need, to straighten the things, to summon ourselves together and to fight one at a time.

KIT Over n Out

 

[UchihaCG]

This report would indicate differently:

http://www.defence.pk/forums/strate...39093-cia-says-gets-its-moneys-worth-isi.html

As for the drones, I believe the technology and processes that made the drone program such a success in Iraq have not been shared with close allies like the UK either.

Bob Woodward wrote an excellent series of articles on the classified drone project, after being briefed on it, comparing it to the "Manhattan Project". If his characterization is correct, then it is easy to see why the US might be reluctant to allow Pakistan to operate the project.

So then why this news contradicting that pretty much?
Centre for Research on Globalisation (CRG)
BBC NEWS | South Asia | Spy agency confusion in Pakistan
BBC NEWS | South Asia | Pakistan spy agency accused by US
ISI-Sponsored Attack On Indian Embassy In Kabul Boomerangs International Terrorism Monitor: Paper No.440

ISI Sponsored attacks.......................



also, that article DOES make sense, i'd like to point to you:

The payments have triggered intense debate within the U.S. government, officials said, because of long-standing suspicions that the ISI continues to help Taliban extremists who undermine U.S. efforts in Afghanistan and provide sanctuary to al-Qaida in Pakistan.

But U.S. officials have repeatedly opted to continue the funding because the ISI's assistance is considered critical: Almost every major terrorist plot this decade has originated in Pakistan's tribal belt, where ISI informant networks are a primary source of intelligence.

ONLY THEY ARE FUNDING FOR THAT REASON! To "try" and manipulate. Like they're trying to do with your government.

=)

I think some of these evidences were shown to Manmohan G in Sharm-ul-Shaikh by Pakistan and after which the PM of India did confirm at first that they have some role to play in Balochistan.

Oh, who else were they shown to? and why do you think Manmohan Singh has been DENYING that? We can invite Gilani to India and "tell" the world, we showed him proof that Pakistan is the reason for ALL attacks in India. =0 you Pakistanis would then argue right?

Secondly, PM of Pakistan claims that evidences will be brought to air simply means thatthere are some, for if there have not been he would have never put him in trouble in front of the media.

That proved it, he ONLY means that there "might be some evidence" not there IS strong, solid evidence.

He could simply say, "Negotiations are in progress." A direct attack does mean that something is been in their hands.

Oh ya, then why do you think OUR government rats out Pakistan on EVERY matter? Mumbai attacks? you get pointed to first...... Parliament Blasts? So only your government's hiding it to be the good guys?

TIme is what we need, to straighten the things, to summon ourselves together and to fight one at a time.

KIT Over n Out

Wrong
Time is what you need, to make up evidence, spread Anti-Indian propaganda, and try to destroy India.

 

[deathfromabove]

In another recent report from Foreign Affairs magazine, by Christine Fair of RAND Corporation gives us the inside:
“Having visited the Indian mission in Zahedan, Iran, I can assure you they are not issuing visas as the main activity! Moreover, India has run operations from its mission in Mazar, Afghanistan (through which it supported the Northern Alliance) and is likely doing so from the other consulates it has reopened in Jalalabad and Qandahar along the border. Indian officials have told me privately that they are pumping money into Baluchistan. Kabul has encouraged India to engage in provocative activities such as using the Border Roads Organization to build sensitive parts of the Ring Road and use the Indo-Tibetan police force for security. It is also building schools on a sensitive part of the border in Kunar–across from Bajaur (Pakistan’s Tribal Area where Pakistan Army had to carry out a major operation to eliminate TTP militants).

What's the Problem With Pakistan? | Foreign Affairs

 

[UchihaCG]

In another recent report from Foreign Affairs magazine, by Christine Fair of RAND Corporation gives us the inside:
“Having visited the Indian mission in Zahedan, Iran, I can assure you they are not issuing visas as the main activity! Moreover, India has run operations from its mission in Mazar, Afghanistan (through which it supported the Northern Alliance) and is likely doing so from the other consulates it has reopened in Jalalabad and Qandahar along the border. Indian officials have told me privately that they are pumping money into Baluchistan. Kabul has encouraged India to engage in provocative activities such as using the Border Roads Organization to build sensitive parts of the Ring Road and use the Indo-Tibetan police force for security. It is also building schools on a sensitive part of the border in Kunar–across from Bajaur (Pakistan’s Tribal Area where Pakistan Army had to carry out a major operation to eliminate TTP militants).

What's the Problem With Pakistan? | Foreign Affairs

Have you seen what THAT LINK says about Pakistan? Army? and how much control the govt has =) Ofcourse you'd only point to me that part of it right.

Well, why don't you check out the links i posted from BBC.

 

[deathfromabove]

Have you seen what THAT LINK says about Pakistan? Army? and how much control the govt has =) Ofcourse you'd only point to me that part of it right.

Well, why don't you check out the links i posted from BBC.

Believe me this isn't something new. US accused Turkey back in 2003 when Turkey refused to support US in Iraq War.

Soldiers' Arrest is 'Biggest Crisis of Confidence Between Turkish, US Forces,' says Turkey's Army Chief - 2003-07-07

And Egypt in the past has been accused again and again using similar tactics although they are the biggest recipient of US aid after Israel.

We are the victim of our passive / non-existent Foreign Policy.

 

[UchihaCG]

Believe me this isn't something new. US accused Turkey back in 2003 when Turkey refused to support US in Iraq War.

Soldiers' Arrest is 'Biggest Crisis of Confidence Between Turkish, US Forces,' says Turkey's Army Chief - 2003-07-07

And Egypt has in the past been accused again and again of similar although they are the biggest recipient of US aid after Israel.

We are the victim of our passive / non-existent Foreign Policy.

Again, you are contradicting yourself in a blind manner sir. What that proves is that, the ISI/Pak is NOT innocent like you're saying. The reason the US is giving money to Pak is BECAUSE they want things DONE.

Pakistan is no victim. You only see the US trying to use you. You don't see the 7$$$$$ aid coming to your ECONOMY. 10+$$$$$ from the entire world. All because of AMERICA.

Your economy is crap. Imagine that dump without this 10 Billion. And don't give me bluff out of pride that Pakistan is better off without the economic help of the US. Cuz it's not. If it IS, then your government shoulda said BYE BYE to US ........ 30 years ago.