Featured Project Azm: Pakistan's Ambitious Quest to Develop 5th Generation Military Technologies.

[zulu]

In the 49th meeting of Standing Committee on Defence Production, it was told that it will take 11 years.

Project AZM is not about designing a fighter jet. This projects is much more than just a Jet it has many other major thing to cover. Designing a fighter jet is one of the tasks of Project AZM. People have wrong perception about AZM.



Brother there are many things this project has to do. It has to pave the path for an entire industry. Fighter jet is one thing and yes they will give the jet much earlier but the name Project AZM is not a name of a fighter jet. If you want I can provide you all info I have on accepts this project will cover.

Sir kindly do so

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

ACM told us 5 years

If it is 11 years then PAF is skipping 5th gen and going for 6th gen directly like uk.

 

[Cookie Monster]

If it is 11 years then PAF is skipping 5th gen and going for 6th gen directly like uk.

IMO there will be a blurry line between 5th and 6th gen. Since both will have stealth airframes, composites, RAM, and supercruise(talking broadly here and not just about AZM NGF)...the main difference will therefore come down to the internal electronics. With increasing modularity...it would probably become possible to upgrade a 5th gen fighter into a 6th gen.

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

IMO there will be a blurry line between 5th and 6th gen. Since both will have stealth airframes, composites, RAM, and supercruise(talking broadly here and not just about AZM NGF)...the main difference will therefore come down to the internal electronics. With increasing modularity...it would probably become possible to upgrade a 5th gen fighter into a 6th gen.

A true 6th gen wont need a human flying inside it.

 

[Cookie Monster]

A true 6th gen wont need a human flying inside it.

That's not yet a definite requirement for it to be considered 6th gen. Many countries want to have their 6th gen fighters as "optionally piloted". Meaning a pilot could fly it or it could be remotely piloted...both options. The main thing I'm interested in is 6th gen fighter's ability to work with and command drones. Boeing recently unveiled a concept of loyal wingman. Imagine what a boost it would be if one of ur drones flying beside u acts as an AWAC, another carries long range(meteor type) and short range air to air missiles in its internal bays, one is laced with ECM and EW equipment, while another is built for ground attack. All of that would be like a full package...being able to see further, being able to defend urself against enemy interceptors, and being able to carry out ground strikes...all in one.

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

That's not yet a definite requirement for it to be considered 6th gen. Many countries want to have their 6th gen fighters as "optionally piloted". Meaning a pilot could fly it or it could be remotely piloted...both options. The main thing I'm interested in is 6th gen fighter's ability to work with and command drones. Boeing recently unveiled a concept of loyal wingman. Imagine what a boost it would be if one of ur drones flying beside u acts as an AWAC, another carries long range(meteor type) and short range air to air missiles in its internal bays, one is laced with ECM and EW equipment, while another is built for ground attack. All of that would be like a full package...being able to see further, being able to defend urself against enemy interceptors, and being able to carry out ground strikes...all in one.

According to that concept there can be one mothership manner aircraft in flying in the middle of a drone swarm. Mother ship unarmed with ability to command armed or kamakazi drones.

Something out of a jaoanese fiction. I reckon chinese, Japanese or israeliz would be the first to impliment it.

 

[Cookie Monster]

According to that concept there can be one mothership manner aircraft in flying in the middle of a drone swarm. Mother ship unarmed with ability to command armed or kamakazi drones.

Something out of a jaoanese fiction. I reckon chinese, Japanese or israeliz would be the first to impliment it.

U r thinking more along the lines of drone swarms and not a 6th gen fighter. Drone swarms might be more useful in things like taking out a SAM system.
I sort of talked about that thing here
[URL="https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/china-launches-record-breaking-uav-swarm.503463/#post-9603953"]China launches record-breaking UAV swarm[/URL]

A 6th gen fighter leading a formation of drones(pilotless aircrafts) would be a more specific mission with some purpose, where a human might be necessary rather than trusting it to AI. Both of these things are similar yet different...a drone swarm can be just for utter area destruction while a human leading specialized drones would be rather for a more specific objective...kind of like the difference between a machine gunner and a sniper.

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

U r thinking more along the lines of drone swarms and not a 6th gen fighter. Drone swarms might be more useful in things like taking out a SAM system.
I sort of talked about that thing here
China launches record-breaking UAV swarm

A 6th gen fighter leading a formation of drones(pilotless aircrafts) would be a more specific mission with some purpose, where a human might be necessary rather than trusting it to AI. Both of these things are similar yet different...a drone swarm can be just for utter area destruction while a human leading specialized drones would be rather for a more specific objective...kind of like the difference between a machine gunner and a sniper.

U said ability to control drones. What good is that ability if you cant form swarms with it . armed drines forming swarms . stuff of not so distsnt future. I hope i live to see that day along with you and others reading this. Cuz that would be amazing

 

[Cookie Monster]

U said ability to control drones. What good is that ability if you cant form swarms with it . armed drines forming swarms . stuff of not so distsnt future. I hope i live to see that day along with you and others reading this. Cuz that would be amazing

The difference is that a swarm of kamikaze drones(in numbers) raining down on targets can cause damage like if civilians are around for example. So if that approach is used for destroying enemy tank formations advancing through the deserts of Rajasthan...that's fine. A mothership(AI) can deploy hundreds of Kamikaze drones and rain hell...but this approach is useless(or rather risking collateral damage) if carrying out a strike at a target in a populated area. In that case in the current times u would send in a formation of fighter jets(a mix of ground role and air superiority to defend against enemy interceptors). The equivalent of this formation in the future would be a human piloting a 6th gen fighter with a few high end drones each tailored for a specific purpose...one to carry weapons, another to serve like an AWAC, etc. These will not be the low end(relatively speaking) Kamikaze drones...but more like futuristic analogues of current piloted aircrafts specialized for certain tasks/roles.

 

[Foxtrot Delta]

The difference is a swarm of kamikaze drones in numbers raining down on targets can cause damage like if civilians are around for example. So if that approach is used for destroying enemy tank formations advancing through the deserts of Rajasthan...that's fine. A mothership(AI) can deploy hundreds of Kamikaze drones and rain hell...but this approach is useless(or rather risking collateral damage) if carrying out a strike at a target in a populated area. In that case in the current times u would send in a formation of fighter jets(a mix of ground role and air superiority to defend against enemy interceptors). The equivalent of this formation in the future would be a human piloting a 6th gen fighter with a few high end drones each tailored for a specific purpose...one to carry weapons, another to serve like an AWAC, etc. These will not be the low end(relatively speaking) Kamikaze drones...but more like futuristic analogues of current piloted aircrafts specialized for certain tasks/roles.

I guess time will tell. Keep a close eye on AVIC in china. They are out best bet.

 

[Ahmet Pasha]

One naive question.
Does miles per gallon factor in when designing a ngf jet???
As we are not a super rich country???

 

[PakAlp]

All eyes should be on China. If Chinese military announces to invest and produce the J31 fighter then Pakistan will have that as a Pakistan Spec 5th generation fighter or if China military announces a brand new plane and 5th generation program then that will be the fighter for us. It's already 2019 so it will by 2030 we will get our first 5th generation.

Unless China flies the 3rd prototype of J31. Then by 2025 we will be ordering 36+ planes.

 

[KhiCity]

looks like the J20


TFX

Its a mixture of couple of platforms, nozzle is of F22 and the wing tail front is a mixture of Sukhoi30 I guess looks good though but PAF will be opting for single engine fighter I guess.

 

[maverick1977]

Project “AZM” will be completed / matured within time period of 11 years.

At that rate, pakiatan will be in deep shit, I am expecting India to close F35 deal in next 4 years and procurement in 6 to 8 years ..

 

[BHarwana]

At that rate, pakiatan will be in deep shit, I am expecting India to close F35 deal in next 4 years and procurement in 6 to 8 years ..

Project AZM and F-35 are not related. AZM is about establishing industrial capacity of producing a 5th gen fighter air crafts. AZM is not the name of a fifth gen fighter air crafts.