Prime Minister Modi Fumbles on Pakistan

[Indrani]

which again are small fraction
The tippers to police or army are also kashmiri's

As I said the Kashmiri Shias are with India as of the moment because they are facing the heat from the Sunnis themselves. So the tippers could be from them.

who has been taken terms dictated ?
the 4 point formula was even back by BJP
The four-point formula General Musharraf prescribed is: [1] Kashmir should have the same borders but people be allowed to move freely across the region;[2] The region should have self-governance or autonomy but not independence; [3] Troops should be withdrawn from the region in a phased manner; and [4] a joint mechanism comprising representatives from India, Pakistan and Kashmir be set up to supervise the implementation of such a roadmap for Kashmir.

Let us say BJP was in doldrums if it backed such a plan. BJP Delhi unit was not all that different from Congress all that long ago.
That four-point formula essentially cuts off Kashmir from India giving Pakistani Kashmir more rights over it than Indians from other parts of India. Not done. Not done at all. Shame on Indians to even consider such a plan.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

As I said the Kashmiri Shias are with India as of the moment because they are facing the heat from the Sunnis themselves. So the tippers could be from them.

So are Kashmiri Pashtoons

Let us say BJP was in doldrums if it backed such a plan. BJP Delhi unit was not all that different from Congress all that long ago.
That four-point formula essentially cuts off Kashmir from India giving Pakistani Kashmir more rights over it than Indians from other parts of India. Not done. Not done at all. Shame on Indians to even consider such a plan.

its right to movement not settlement
indians would be allowed to enter indian kashmir too
we are not rolling out the border, it will be controlled entry exit point

 

[Echo_419]

which again are small fraction
The tippers to police or army are also kashmiri's




who has been taken terms dictated ?
the 4 point formula was even back by BJP

The four-point formula General Musharraf prescribed is: [1] Kashmir should have the same borders but people be allowed to move freely across the region;[2] The region should have self-governance or autonomy but not independence; [3] Troops should be withdrawn from the region in a phased manner; and [4] a joint mechanism comprising representatives from India, Pakistan and Kashmir be set up to supervise the implementation of such a roadmap for Kashmir.

News behind the News

Pak trashes Musharraf's 4-point Kashmir formula

Pak trashes Musharraf's 4-point Kashmir formula - The Times of India

Good thing this formula was not implemented,why should we negotiate when we are in a stronger position & the gap will only widen in coming years

 

[Indrani]

So are Kashmiri Pashtoons




its right to movement not settlement
indians would be allowed to enter indian kashmir too
we are not rolling out the border, it will be controlled entry exit point

Oh please. What is right to movement if not settlement. What will they do after traveling without a visa or a date of return? You mean to say they will come in the morning and go by night? This is the kind of muddled thinking we can do without.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Oh please. What is right to movement if not settlement. What will they do after traveling without a visa or a date of return? You mean to say they will come in the morning and go by night? This is the kind of muddled thinking we can do without.

they can't buy house
they can't stay put for more than 2 months
There will be system to monitor avain thodi aane jaane denge

 

[Indrani]

they can't buy house
they can't stay put for more than 2 months
There will be system to monitor avain thodi aane jaane denge

LOL. They can live in rented houses or pay their relatives to build extra living quarters for them in their own houses. What do you mean they cannot stay put for more than 2 months? Is it 2 months in a year or 2 months and then take a day off and come back for another 2 months? How is that different from a Visa system?

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

LOL. They can live in rented houses or pay their relatives to build extra living quarters for them in their own houses. What do you mean they cannot stay put for more than 2 months? Is it 2 months in a year or 2 months and then take a day off and come back for another 2 months? How is that different from a Visa system?

No, every person entering Indian side will have to visit nearest police station every week
2 months at once, before such borders are opened every kashmiri citizens would be given national identity card back by digital acknowledgement
Every neighborhood has a police station and they know the people who live there, any such movements would be flagged and when they are caught they will be bared from entering the indian side

This is how things work in EU, you don't need a visa but you get a stamp saying you are allowed to stay for a max 2-3 months

 

[Contrarian]

I'd say the Ops and other efforts against the Taliban were attempt to remedy the same problem.

You know the problem is entirely different dont you. PA is only targeting the terrorists who target Pakistan and a free pass is given to those who target India.

This fact has not been unnoticed in India.

 

[Indrani]

No, every person entering Indian side will have to visit nearest police station every week
2 months at once, before such borders are opened every kashmiri citizens would be given national identity card back by digital acknowledgement
Every neighborhood has a police station and they know the people who live there, any such movements would be flagged and when they are caught they will be bared from entering the indian side

This is how things work in EU, you don't need a visa but you get a stamp saying you are allowed to stay for a max 2-3 months

Bad idea. Kashmir is no EU and the people we are talking of are not irreligious EU citizens.

 

[vsdave2302]

Where is flumbling?

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Bad idea. Kashmir is no EU and the people we are talking of are not irreligious EU citizens.

taking a chance ... if things backfire we can close the borders, if things go well we are opening a new horizon

 

[Indrani]

taking a chance ... if things backfire we can close the borders, if things go well we are opening a new horizon

Sorry, you do not take a chance with the country's future or the border. We are not opening any new horizon. Hindus and Muslims lived in the same subcontinent as Hindustanis for 1000 years, even then hostility did not end and we ended up with 3 countries in the subcontinent. India has existed as a modern secular state with a favorable bias towards Islam for the last 68 years and now we have 1.8 million radicalized wahhabis in India at this moment. While living in India in a secular free state we have not opened a new horizon to them and you are talking of a new horizon in Kashmir.

There is a limit to the amount one should live in a dream world.

 

[Mr.S.Singh]

Sorry, you do not take a chance with the country's future or the border. We are not opening any new horizon. Hindus and Muslims lived in the same subcontinent as Hindustanis for 1000 years, even then hostility did not end and we ended up with 3 countries in the subcontinent. India has existed as a modern secular state with a favorable bias towards Islam for the last 68 years and now we have 1.8 million radicalized wahhabis in India at this moment. While living in India in a secular free state we have not opened a new horizon to them and you are talking of a new horizon in Kashmir.

There is a limit to the amount one should live in a dream world.

i am optimist and opportunist, maybe we deffer on this issue
crack down on radicalism but promote people to people contact too, i like to play on two fronts

 

[Indrani]

i am optimist and opportunist, maybe we deffer on this issue
crack down on radicalism but promote people to people contact too, i like to play on two fronts

I am an optimist too, so I keep hoping that India wont repeat the same mistakes it did again and again in trusting Pakistan or Pakistanis. There is nothing Indians can learn from Pakistan. Yes Pakistanis do learn a lot from India though. From movies to fashion to culture, they take their cue from us. Not that that makes them realize how much in debt to us they are, no but just continue to believe that it is their natural right and somehow it is India which took stuff from them.

There is something missing in Pakistan and Pakistanis, a sense of gratitude and humility. This cannot be taught and they have no equipment in their society which will teach them this. So no amount of people to people contact will ever mend things between India and Pakistan.

 

[possumlot]

i am optimist and opportunist, maybe we deffer on this issue
crack down on radicalism but promote people to people contact too, i like to play on two fronts

I seriously suggest you stop thinking with your heart.

An "opportunity" is also an opportunity for terrorist to walk in and do a recon. Its also an opportunity to spread hate, and opportunity to set up sleeper cells, an opportunity to smuggle dugs and fake currency. An opportunity to weaken the social, cultural, political fabric of India.

For every good you can think of, there is an evil waiting to piggy back on your 'good intentions'.

Radicalism is an integral part of islam and you cannot crack down on radicalism without cracking down on islam and starting a civilizational war.

People to people contact is good but first let the people mature and evolve beyond the narrow confines of their religious identities. ...... and that will take time. A LOT of time.

Let us play on more than two fronts, buy only when the time is right and when we stand to gain more than what we stand to loose.