Panama Case - Post Verdict Discussion and Updates

[Farah Sohail]

Who has tied their hands that they cannot approach the monitoring judge through a petition sighting blatant malpractice of accountability court judge or even a constitutional petition highlighting the serious transgression of authority as pointed out by an ex CJP Ch Iftikhar.

100% agreed.. PTI is also to be blamed.. Why are they not approaching monitoringbjudge through a petition? Like every other day.. Hussain Nawaz used to file an application against JIT in SC..why doesnt PTI approach the monitoring judgr here? Press conferences ya media interviews se kia hoga?

Also PTI hasnt challenged election bill in SC yet...

 

[Shane]

Like every other day.. Hussain Nawaz used to file an application against JIT in SC..why doesnt PTI approach the monitoring judgr here?

This is exactly my point of concern since the one week time line to reopen Hudaibya case lapsed long ago and then was taken up by SRA after more than a months wait...PTI has demonstrated lack of judicial follow-up or keeping the judicial system vigilant if not weary of close scrutiny, as you correctly pointed out the example of Hassan Nawaz.

Most of the time, except IK apartment case, all we see from PTI is lethargy and lame excuses of waiting and seeing as if it is about post movie critique rather than a matter of National or political interest.

No wonder PMLN is having a ball due to the liberties being allowed unchecked despite dire legal implications otherwise.

 

[Rank]

IK / PTI did historical blunder after NS disqualification. SC provided massive ground and space to NS, No jail nor even order anything against Maryam, Hassan and Hussain on forge docs and blunt lies in the proccedings as well as with the public, in and outside the parliament. In review petition, Justice Khosa said to Khawaja Haris (NS lawyer) that we were expecting review from the petitioner because of “Halka haath” on NS. As Aitezaaz Ahsan said many times “Supreme Court nay NS ko bohat mokay diye hain aur bohat halka haath rakha hay” even SC officially admitted.

If you did corruptin, having illegal propertise, submitted forge docs in the Apex Court and blunt lies with the public, floor of the house and in and outside the parliment, 3 times PM not only fire by the apex court but in some countries life time imprisonment and some where death sentence. IK did blunder not to put pressure on SC ye kiya khali Na-ahel kiya hay aap nay—review petition must be from PTI not from the PMLN (As Judge said).

 

[PakSword]

liberties being allowed unchecked

Why?

IK / PTI did historical blunder after NS disqualification. SC provided massive ground and space to NS, No jail nor even order anything against Maryam, Hassan and Hussain on forge docs and blunt lies in the proccedings as well as with the public, in and outside the parliament. In review petition, Justice Khosa said to Khawaja Haris (NS lawyer) that we were expecting review from the petitioner because of “Halka haath” on NS. As Aitezaaz Ahsan said many times “Supreme Court nay NS ko bohat mokay diye hain aur bohat halka haath rakha hay” even SC officially admitted.

If you did corruptin, having illegal propertise, submitted forge docs in the Apex Court and blunt lies with the public, floor of the house and in and outside the parliment, 3 times PM not only fire by the apex court but in some countries life time imprisonment and some where death sentence. IK did blunder not to put pressure on SC ye kiya khali Na-ahel kiya hay aap nay—review petition must be from PTI not from the PMLN (As Judge said).

This.... I have been crying here since week 1 after Panama verdict

 

[Realistic Change]

OK.. so first of all, my info only comes through calls I occasionally make to people to discuss something else, but we end up discussing some bits and pieces of this Panama drama. Of course, people don't open up too much over the phone for obvious reasons so all I write here are those bits and pieces and dots to connect.

What I said is that there is no assurance given. I said I would call it a NRO, if a full assurance is given to Nawaz and family that he will be acquitted of all the charges.. This is not there.. So in my opinion, there is no NRO.. Till here, I think we both agree.

I also said (in my earlier posts as well) that establishment and judiciary both are on board to give Nawaz a chance to leave Pakistan while the cases are run here as usual. This is to prevent him from coming back. Now how and when and where this has happened, I have no information. But why this is happening? Because as you have mentioned, Nawaz is too strong when it comes to bureaucracy support. Add to this the public support for him in Punjab and what you get is a monster which no one wants to have around. There is close to ZERO percent chance that he will be punished for his crimes ever because as per some quarters, it will add more public support and he may create chaos as well which our country can't handle.

Those quarters want that the Panama cases result in a situation that prevent NS from coming back for a considerable time that is enough to weaken his control over party and other institutions.

1. Who are you referring to here? Who has told this to Nawaz?

No one.. as I said in my email.

2. Who is that someone? Who has given this assurance as per your info ?

No assurance.. he is only being given enough chances to leave.

3. And lastly, what are you referring as acquitted in above?

a) he will be cleaned and allowed to be in his previous position?

No, and I think never..

b) not charged fully, but let go to say UK and live there?

c) any other type of acquittal .......please let us know.

Grey area.. but something like he may leave Pakistan while the result of the cases is such that he is prevented from coming back.. Maybe, he will be charged and to avoid his jail term, he just leaves and no one initiates inter-pol process to bring him back.

My advance apologies for not understanding your post.

Bro, my information could be wrong.. because my info is mixed with analysis. Till now things are moving in the direction which I am suspecting. It doesn't mean that things will remain same. We may see a change in mood of the SC and establishment. Till now, they are keeping their eyes closed.



Sir, I am not.. I had few good sources till last year who were retired. Now I have some friends who are in bureaucracy. A couple of friends have already left institutions to settle abroad.. the rest are also trying to leave..

Aur waisay bhi, main pehlay hi aap ki shagirdi ke liey apply karchuka hun.. My info is sometimes wrong.. I have never ever seen your information incorrect.. time tells that you give accurate info and we get the taste of it in next few months.. you are months ahead..

Sir aap ustaad hain.. plzzz sharminda na karain..

I only share what I hear over the phone... in bits and pieces..

Thanks a bunch @PakSword - much appreciated.

Few more clarifications re confusion as we generally use words and terms:

I totally understand Judiciary, but when you say "Establishment", who are you referring to; is it PA that you are referring to or do you define it somewhat differently than just pure Pakistan Army?

Secondly, there is no doubt that there had to be give and take; even BB made deals when everyone that you can name; nationally or internationally were against her, Nawaz's current situation is way better than BB's position for negotiation. I'll share more when I have more time; as without reference to the context my post will look jumbled or at most a shot in the dark; and when we go into reference then it becomes.......long and boring post

But yes, please let me know what you consider as establishment, as I always get the impression that most of our fellow members use the word Establishment whenever they have to refer Pakistan Army.

Why?



This.... I have been crying here since week 1 after Panama verdict

Kuch cheezien pardey mein rehney dein...will discuss it in pvt even if we do not do that, you'll understand yourself why PTI did not move when cases were being heard - I'll try to explain the actual politics factor but not on open forum.

 

[El Sidd]

Thanks a bunch @PakSword - much appreciated.

Few more clarifications re confusion as we generally use words and terms:

I totally understand Judiciary, but when you say "Establishment", who are you referring to; is it PA that you are referring to or do you define it somewhat differently than just pure Pakistan Army?

Secondly, there is no doubt that there had to be give and take; even BB made deals when everyone that you can name; nationally or internationally were against her, Nawaz's current situation is way better than BB's position for negotiation. I'll share more when I have more time; as without reference to the context my post will look jumbled or at most a shot in the dark; and when we go into reference then it becomes.......long and boring post

But yes, please let me know what you consider as establishment, as I always get the impression that most of our fellow members use the word Establishment whenever they have to refer Pakistan Army.

That would clear lot of his posts to me as well.

No country in the world.
No language in the world has ever explained what they mean when they say establishment in Pakistan.

That is our country's best kept secret. Lol

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Has anyone heard the "inside story" behind Gen. Rizwan Akhtar "relinquishing" his position

 

[El Sidd]

Has anyone heard the "inside story" behind Gen. Rizwan Akhtar "relinquishing" his position

Qanoonan do saal intezar karen. Baqi sab misinformation hai

 

[Dil Pakistan]

Qanoonan do saal intezar karen. Baqi sab misinformation hai

 

[Realistic Change]

Qanoonan do saal intezar karen. Baqi sab misinformation hai

Hahahaha - everyone knows why he "retired". Good one (your post) for pulling leg though

 

[Shane]

Why?

Mind boggling to say the least. Just a few examples are:

use of PML"N" party name and Election symbol despite DQ of Nawaz...PTI was fast asleep on this point ( i actually thought that they will do it when NA120 Symbols were at stake to render PMLN in a fix over "Sher" but nothing done on time),

no review,

waiting for weeks after weeks despite no Hudaibya reopening,

contempt of court by Nawaz and Maryam,

contempt by PM - Speaker NA and other goons,

open use of state resources by dq PM,

Names not put on ECL,

Continuous Contempt of Judges and even their intentions,

No arrest by NAB to further investigate the accused.

PMLN goons claiming that they will amend laws to re-elect Nawaz as party head to render the DQ verdict toothless against becoming party head and then actually passing the law was also grounds for contempt,

still no challenge by PTI against the recently passed law.

I'm not saying go after every thing above but at least go after some of the above grounds, PMLN leaves no stone unturned if it gets even a whiff of political point scoring op.

Even if SC had rejected the petitions then let it be so doing openly instead of just letting the opportunities pass by without any test claiming that we are waiting and watching.

 

[Farah Sohail]

Lagta hai ke sab ke sab milay huay hian..iss topi drama main., Ijaz ul Ahsan se le kar ..neechay tak.... kitni achi opinion hua karti thee.. J Ijaz ul Ahsan ke baaray main... Ab tu woh openly illegal kaam hotay huay dekh rahay hain..accountability court judgebki taraf se..uss par bhi kuch nahi karrahay.. Ke accountability court ke judgr ne bail de di..jo ke uski jurisdiction hi nahi ... Aur ab absentia main agar indictment hogayi tu yeh bhi illegal...is se bhi accused ko faida hoga.,

Ijaz ul Ahsan..ye cheezein tu atleast check karsaktay hain..aur kuch na karein tu NAB se supplementary references beshak file na karayein.. Lekin ye openly jo illegal cheezein horahi hai..inhein tu check karein pata nahi..woh kiya hua..jo suna tha ke he will be brutally fierce in monitoring ya he will do the right thing? Ye tu poori tarah soo rahay hain

 

[Dastaan]

 

[Shane]

Lagta hai ke sab ke sab milay huay hian..iss topi drama main., Ijaz ul Ahsan se le kar ..neechay tak....

Sab k sab nahee milay huay but part and parcel of a stagnant system under the influence of status quo. Nobody is in any hurry to waste time swimming against the tide but then there are also a few of those who stand their ground on principle.

ye openly jo illegal cheezein horahi hai..inhein tu check karein pata nahi..woh kiya hua..jo suna tha ke he will be brutally fierce in monitoring ya he will do the right thing? Ye tu poori tarah soo rahay hain

What we call soona is probably just aankhain khuli rakhna at this time, may be it is not time yet for monitoring judge to interfere until a few more hearings and proceedings on indictments become clear.

PTI or SRA or JI should probe the SC regarding the Bail acceptance debacle to find out what's going on in terms of monitoring.

 

[PakSword]

I totally understand Judiciary, but when you say "Establishment", who are you referring to; is it PA that you are referring to or do you define it somewhat differently than just pure Pakistan Army?

Military establishment... the other establishment (bureaucracy) is already in Shareefs control. I don't usually refer to that establishment..

So, establishment is keeping its eyes closed.. allowing Shareefs to roam around freely. Why is it so? As per kachhi pakki information, NS can create a lot of chaos if put in jail. A country that is already facing several challenges on the external front will not be able to handle internal chaos at the same time. Most of us disagree with this approach, but this is what it is.. Apparently, judiciary is on board in support of this narrative.

Nawaz Shareef (alongwith his immediate family) is also seen as a security threat.. It is very very difficult (if not impossible) for NS's family to reach to the PM house again.. SS may reach there, but the chances of NS or Maryam are very low.

The best way (in the eyes of establishment) is that NS's family realizes this bitter truth and leaves Pakistan forever without any push from their side. But if NS remains here and despite strong cases against him, tries to create any chaos in the country, we may see some strict actions from SC judge (NAB is Shreef's court so no need to expect any good from accountability court).

Halaat tezi se uss taraf jaa rahay hain, jahan red line already cross hochuki hai, ya honay wali hai.. kyun ke agar itni azadi ke bawajud Shareefs do not avail this opportunity, phir unn ka Allah hi hafiz hai..

Again saying, this is all my analysis based on the bits and pieces I have collected from different sources so far... This may prove to be wrong in future..