Pakistan's Political Will "wavering" In Pakistan

[Anwar2]

Our friend S-2 has a great sense of humor!. He expects the “bad guys” to mount a white steed on a hill top, and charge an F-15E flying at 30,000 ft with his shining saber, and get his ticket punched to the Heavens!.

The US forces in Afghanistan are virtual prisoners, cannot even address the call of nature in a valley without a 40 kg protective suit. Rag tag Taleban have done them in, like it or not!.

Of late the US has been trying to fight the war on the cheap, pushing Pak Army to do their dirty job for peanuts. Economy in free fall back home has not helped things one bit. Without a massive injection of fresh money into Pakistan the prospects are definitely bleak.

 

[786/92.]

We as nation can not stand with independent nation as long these feudel lord mafia is present in pakistan
They are just like war lord of afghanistan.

Talaban type of movement is required to kicked these feudel lords out of this country .

Yes, Taliban WILL be able to do it surely. They have the reputation to do all things with force. If they could just build a Kala Bagh dam.

Liaqat Ali Khan...the 1st. Prime Minister of Pakistan was assassinated for his land reforms intentions according to his son. Anyway, if they do it... this'll be remarkable achievement for Pakistan and after that

They will not burn girls schools.

They'll not blow up cd shops and net cafes.

They'll not ban the television.

They'll allow men to wear pants-shirts.

They'll allow equal job opportunities for the women.

They'll celebrate 14th. August Independence Day of Pakistan.​

BTW these stiff minded people can never be the progeny of David. Those 'Ten Lost Tribes' are lost for good.thanx

 

[S-2]

Thanks for your appreciation of my sense of humor but since when is a helmet, butt pack and kevlar vest 40 kgs? Our boys hump up and down the Korengal all day long and do just fine.

I LAUGH when I read how tough everybody supposedly is but us. BIG giggles. It only shows how little you know about America and it's military. Most of these battles take place BELOW 9,000 ft. No biggie for any American who's elk-hunted in Oregon or anywhere else in our west.

"He expects the “bad guys” to mount a white steed on a hill top, and charge an F-15E flying at 30,000 ft with his shining saber, and get his ticket punched to the Heavens!."

Makes for a good jihadi poster, stud, but all I expect them to do, actually, is DIE- and I don't care much exactly how except for their last moments here to be slow, painful and with an eighteen year old American face the last thing they see before pissing on eternal hellfires.

That pleases me greatly. Hope you feel the same...

 

[batmannow]

"spy", eh?

Sure she was. How brave!

she was a great aid worker, good soul!
i am very, very sad about, her cool blooded murder.
But there is a question, which comes in my mind, why US keep sending its women soldiers in the places like afghanistan, where a real combat is going on, because it, makes non combitant-women aid workers as a target too?

 

[S-2]

"why US keep sending its women soldiers in the places like afghanistan, where a real combat is going on, because it, makes non combitant-women aid workers as a target too?"

batmannow,

If killing women is how a irhabi talibunny gets his kicks and American women are uniformed soldiers, why kill a civilian South African woman? Why not a female American soldier?

"[Ashley]Pullen, who joined the Guard at age 17 to help pay for college, didn't want a desk job. She chose the military police, feeling it better suited someone who "likes to be to be in the middle of everything." In Iraq, she found herself in the thick of explosions, gunfire and mortar attacks.

The ambush that turned her into a hero started on a steamy March morning just outside Baghdad. Here's how Pullen remembers it:

She was driving one of three Humvees providing security behind a 30-vehicle convoy when the crackle of gunshots and the boom of rocket-propelled grenades suddenly filled the air.

Pullen's unit moved ahead to counterattack, flanking the insurgents so they couldn't escape.

Pullen got out of her Humvee and braced herself against the back of it. She and other soldiers unleashed a torrent of gunfire and grenades on 40 to 50 insurgents attacking from a nearby orchard.

She could see the enemy clearly, armed with dozens of AK-47s, machine guns and grenades. Pullen blasted away with her M-4 rifle, emptying a 30-round magazine, then reloaded and opened fire again.

"You don't have time to be scared," she says. "You just have time to react. ... The fear doesn't set in until later when you say, 'Oh my God, what happened?' ... When the bullets start flying, you're saying OK, 'I want to live through this' and you do everything you can to survive."

Answering a radio call — "Everybody's down! I need help" — Pullen backed up her Humvee part way, then ran about 300 feet to a gravely wounded sergeant, who was screaming and rocking in agony. (Pullen says she didn't pull her truck next to him, fearing that would create a bigger target for the insurgents.)

Dodging bullets, she dropped to her knees to help her comrade. "It hurts! It hurts!" he yelled. She got him out of his bloody vest, lifted his shirt and saw a single slug had pierced his stomach through his back, leaving a hole the size of a quarter.

Pullen tried to bandage and calm him.

"Think of green grass and trees and home," she said. "Think about your little boy. Think about ANYTHING but here." Pullen was herself thinking of the first blush of spring at her Kentucky home. "I don't know if that comforted him, but it worked for me."

As she was tending to the sergeant, a medic from her company fired a shoulder-held rocket launcher at a sniper's nest. "Back blast clear!" he shouted, a warning to stay far away. But Pullen was close enough to touch his leg.

She blanketed her body — all 5-foot-2 — over the wounded sergeant to protect him. The blast knocked her on her backside.

When it was over, at least 26 insurgents were dead and six were wounded. Three civilians in the convoy also were killed. The three wounded members of Pullen's company all survived.

The insurgents' arsenal, according to a military report, included 35 AK-47s and machine guns, 16 rocket-propelled grenades, 39 hand grenades, 175 full or empty AK-47 magazines, 2,500 loose rounds — and a video camera with footage of the ambush.

Pullen was awarded a Bronze Star with the V device for valor. (Several other soldiers in the unit also were honored, including Sgt. Leigh Ann Hester, who was given the Silver Star — the first woman to receive that award since World War II — for her bravery. She killed at least three insurgents.)

In a recommendation for Pullen's medal, her company commander wrote: "Tremendous dedication and focus. Credited with saving the life of a team leader that day. Incredible courage."

Pullen served seven more months in Iraq, learning to cope in a world where the threat of death was a daily fact of life."

Maybe it's because our girls shoot back.

 

[batmannow]

Every one in this war, has to be blame!

1.the talibans, who made innocent pakistani peopl's and pakistan, as thier target, what they got? they lost the support , in thier strong holds like NWFP?

2. USA and its allies, who made the situation worse, by attacking ,innocent pakistani civilians, in fata, & thier uncommonsense, about pakistani politics, and thier selfish attitude altogather?

3. PAKISTANI croupt and self centered, politicians ! who kept using this war in thier selfish intersts, but kept thier eyes closed to the real problums?

4. PAKISTANI militry leader ship, which became power hungry & selffish of thier own personal intersts, and even backstabbed thier own peopl's, for the sake of power, who never completed any mission fully against millitants, who gave , time to talibans for regroupings, & who let the allies kill innocent pakistani civillians?

5. PAKISTANI peopl's who never learnt from thier past mistakes?


IN the end every body can, argue effectivly against thier roles in this war but, history will writting its own course?

A very sad reality, is that only innocent peopl,s were the targets of this unhuman war, even they were from pakistan, from afghanistan, or even innocent westrners, all are the victms of the WAR OF VENGENCE?

 

[batmannow]

"why US keep sending its women soldiers in the places like afghanistan, where a real combat is going on, because it, makes non combitant-women aid workers as a target too?"

batmannow,

If killing women is how a irhabi talibunny gets his kicks and American women are uniformed soldiers, why kill a civilian South African woman? Why not a female American soldier?

"[Ashley]Pullen, who joined the Guard at age 17 to help pay for college, didn't want a desk job. She chose the military police, feeling it better suited someone who "likes to be to be in the middle of everything." In Iraq, she found herself in the thick of explosions, gunfire and mortar attacks.

The ambush that turned her into a hero started on a steamy March morning just outside Baghdad. Here's how Pullen remembers it:

She was driving one of three Humvees providing security behind a 30-vehicle convoy when the crackle of gunshots and the boom of rocket-propelled grenades suddenly filled the air.

Pullen's unit moved ahead to counterattack, flanking the insurgents so they couldn't escape.

Pullen got out of her Humvee and braced herself against the back of it. She and other soldiers unleashed a torrent of gunfire and grenades on 40 to 50 insurgents attacking from a nearby orchard.

She could see the enemy clearly, armed with dozens of AK-47s, machine guns and grenades. Pullen blasted away with her M-4 rifle, emptying a 30-round magazine, then reloaded and opened fire again.

"You don't have time to be scared," she says. "You just have time to react. ... The fear doesn't set in until later when you say, 'Oh my God, what happened?' ... When the bullets start flying, you're saying OK, 'I want to live through this' and you do everything you can to survive."

Answering a radio call — "Everybody's down! I need help" — Pullen backed up her Humvee part way, then ran about 300 feet to a gravely wounded sergeant, who was screaming and rocking in agony. (Pullen says she didn't pull her truck next to him, fearing that would create a bigger target for the insurgents.)

Dodging bullets, she dropped to her knees to help her comrade. "It hurts! It hurts!" he yelled. She got him out of his bloody vest, lifted his shirt and saw a single slug had pierced his stomach through his back, leaving a hole the size of a quarter.

Pullen tried to bandage and calm him.

"Think of green grass and trees and home," she said. "Think about your little boy. Think about ANYTHING but here." Pullen was herself thinking of the first blush of spring at her Kentucky home. "I don't know if that comforted him, but it worked for me."

As she was tending to the sergeant, a medic from her company fired a shoulder-held rocket launcher at a sniper's nest. "Back blast clear!" he shouted, a warning to stay far away. But Pullen was close enough to touch his leg.

She blanketed her body — all 5-foot-2 — over the wounded sergeant to protect him. The blast knocked her on her backside.

When it was over, at least 26 insurgents were dead and six were wounded. Three civilians in the convoy also were killed. The three wounded members of Pullen's company all survived.

The insurgents' arsenal, according to a military report, included 35 AK-47s and machine guns, 16 rocket-propelled grenades, 39 hand grenades, 175 full or empty AK-47 magazines, 2,500 loose rounds — and a video camera with footage of the ambush.

Pullen was awarded a Bronze Star with the V device for valor. (Several other soldiers in the unit also were honored, including Sgt. Leigh Ann Hester, who was given the Silver Star — the first woman to receive that award since World War II — for her bravery. She killed at least three insurgents.)

In a recommendation for Pullen's medal, her company commander wrote: "Tremendous dedication and focus. Credited with saving the life of a team leader that day. Incredible courage."

Pullen served seven more months in Iraq, learning to cope in a world where the threat of death was a daily fact of life."

Maybe it's because our girls shoot back.

I will never, back up these crazy talibans, but i want to know, i never , ever seen , anybody showin g any sampthy to the womens , who were killed in any air raid by, nato, usaf, or allies.
never had seen any words of sampathy, by westrn newspapers?
plz,keep it in mind ,its a war if you want to blame only 1 , faction ,it would not be real justice!
we have to , make it understand, that loss of life, is same for every 1, & we should make our humman rights , more clear.
therefore, you should write , some sampthy to the peopl's killed by usaf, nato, in air raids.
we have to , think for evry body, in equal state?

by the way, plz becarefull, talib women, never likes to shot back, but always like's to blow the hell out.
also , plz study the case of a pakistani/US women citezen's , DR AAFIA.

 

[Neo]

I think even if sharia supporters gain a majority in parliament, its implementation should never be allowed. It would be folly and a mistake to impose sharia on a country like Pakistan. And I am saying this as a self-professes fundamentalist.

Unless a population in a country whole heartidly accepts an ideological, political, judicial shift in the direction of sharia, its implementation can never be successful. Sharia is not just a judicial system, it is about the attitudes of the people who it is supposed to govern.

And a country like Pakistan can never accept it, as to accept something you must have knowledge of it. Pakistanis do not know the first thing about sharia, except that is supposed to be the islamic way of governing, and that it has certain proscribed punishments. The essence and spirit of the sharia, people are unaware of.

If teh sharia was imposed in Pakistan, you would see a rebellion among the people, and may in fact be detrimental to islamic values. It can only be implemented if there is a natural societal and cultural shift, which doesn not look like its going to happen any time soon.

Religious parties never won more than 11% of total votes, majority of them coming from two western provinces and rural area's. This indicates the power and will of the moderates. Therefor Sharia Law can not and will not be implemented in Punjab or Sindh, specially in metropoles like Karachi or Lahore.

 

[haviZsultan]

Religious parties never won more than 11% of total votes, majority of them coming from two western provinces and rural area's. This indicates the power and will of the moderates. Therefor Sharia Law can not and will not be implemented in Punjab or Sindh, specially in metropoles like Karachi or Lahore.

Well said. And now people are even less willing to deal with these anarchistic mullahs anymore. Punjab and Sindh are especially intolerant towards them and Pakhtunkhwa also has increasing hatred for them. The problem with these mullahs is they are unable to put national interest in front and misinterpret Islam using only what they find useful. I have never seen Fazl-Ur-Rehman condemn the taliban directly or in strong words. Instead he goes on about America and how insurgency will end if army operation of pakistan army ends.

The taliban is an anti islamic ideology. Murder and suicide both being haram but being widely practiced on innocent Pakistanis by the cultists. So why these maulvis are only concerned about American interference and bullying of smaller nations and not looking into our own backyard and preaching to the poor uneducated people that these talibani idiots are not fighing f4 Islam but against it! Why they have so much problem giving fatwa against suicide bombing even though it is Haram? Why they ignore some aspects of Islam while on the other hand promote some and try to impose them on others?

The current state of Pakistan and Pakistanis in general is such that we feel like a prostitute sandwiched between american ignorance, interference, stupidity and lack of understanding of the situation and then ofcourse talibani intolerance, idiocy and brutality in the forms of murder, torture (many tortured bodies of soldiers and civilians have been found), genocide of Shite muslims and kicking them out of their own areas (in tribal warfare), beheadings of innocent people, suicide bombing and constant murder of civilians.

Problem remains Jamat E Islami rhetoric and American airstrikes and raids are amplifying the situation in the tribal areas. They are both making the situation worse.

Question is why we are not dealing with Jamaat E Islami and MMA who we can deal with? I honestly believe they should be banned as a terrorist organization because they have nothing beneficial to give Pakistan and only providing moral support for any talibani cultist with their inability to insult them. If we cannot ban these idiots then they should be rebuked or atleast warned because they infuriate and create anti Pakistani sentiment with their idiotic speeches. Even the suicide bombing according to their leaders is from Pakistani intelligence agencies. Is this what a member of a Pakistani political party is expected to say? Some realtime actions needs to be taken against these moral supporters of the taliban.

 

[haviZsultan]

Unfortunatly ,the present government is following the foot steps of Gen Mushraf regime.
I dont know that it was part of deal between Baznazir/Zardari and Musharaf or not.May be that is reason Zardari is not restoring the supereme court CJ.
Second reason they are expecting aid still in pipe line from US .
These shameless leaders are ready to sell every thing of nation.You can expect any thing from them.
What they did with Dr AFIA is best example to expose them.
War on terror is taking a new turn by recent talks of US supported afghan government and talaban in saudi arabia
I think unrest in pakistan will be resolved after any settlement between these main two war factions in FATA and SWAT.
Pakistani leadership has no important role in this war ,US has used them as tissue paper and they ready to do any thing to get favour and aid from US.

This is not phenomenon is continued ,from independence of pakistan these feudal lords cum politician hijacked this country soon after Quaid e Azam death.They are using Army as their tool.
We as nation can not stand with independent nation as long these feudel lord mafia is present in pakistan
They are just like war lord of afghanistan.

Talaban type of movement is required to kicked these feudel lords out of this country .

Look this is the mindset that is dangerous to Pakistan.

Bastard Feudal lords may be a major threat to the nation with their corruption and criminalistic attitudes and with all their gansters and thugs but really the Taliban must be shown no mercy at all. Immense slaughter upon them has become a must and I will not accept anything other than pure retribution and vengeance for every innocent Pakistani I have lost to talibani madness. Taliban have only killed and murdered and that is the only thing they have done for Pakistan. Only thing they do is do it under the cloak of religion and use Islam to justify it even thought they go against Islam however people like you are easily fooled by them.

Why dont you understand that Taliban is not only enemy of Pakistan but enemy of entire Religion of Islam? Why do people need to remind muslims how much they have ruined you?

Suicide and Murder are Haram in Islam.
The prophet said whoever kills himself will be tortured with the same thing on the day of judgement. About murder he said whoever kills an innocent person it is as if he has killed all of humanity. Why are you ignoring this and supporting same idiots who practice these things.

Marriot blasts killed over 60 of our people all in the name of Islam? Is this Islam???? Brother leave your mercy for the Taliban behind. Hunt them down and destroy them completely because they have done more damage to your religion than the Americans Israelis and Indians put together. Really the damage runs in billions and not to forget the 4000 innocents who were murdered by them and the 1300 soldiers who have drained their blood only and only for your security and safety.

Many top level military circles in Pakistan are very confident that a foreign hand is supporting the taliban. Even though it has been suggested this foreign hand is India it still could be anyone. Do not support the taliban. No matter what. These idiotic terroristic groupings are very dangerous to Pakistan.

I agree there is vast discomfort and bitterness about American murder of civilians and brutality in Afghanistan and are seen as an occupying force and even I am annoyed at American interference but do not forget it was the same American CIA that formed and funded the taliban and then left them there after soviet-pakistan war.

Also check out Zaid Hamid. You might understand who might be supporting the taliban.

 

[S-2]

"...it was the same American CIA that formed and funded the taliban and then left them there after soviet-pakistan war."

Interesting. When was this war between the Soviet Union and Pakistan fought? I'm aware of a Soviet-AFGHAN war. Is that to what you actually refer?

If so, could you provide the documentation, names of involved C.I.A. agents, investigations, bills of lading, etc. which would corroborate your assertion that the taliban are a creation of the CIA? Last I heard, they were a spontaneous uprising of "simple students" in Kandahar in 1994 as a rejection of the warring militias throughout the nation, to include the Pashtu militias of Haqqani and Hekmatyar.

Their success, first in Kandahar, and later throughout the nation attracted the attention of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan who not only supported their efforts but bequeathed official recognition of their government and an exchange of ambassadors.

I don't recall anything from the U.S. Government except an initially noncommittal stance that raised no immediate objections- a "wait and see" perspectivie, if you will. This was rather quickly abandoned altogether.

I'll look forward to your serious evidence though, I hope, you don't simply resort to heaping further unsubstantiated allegations upon me. Most importantly, the names of those C.I.A. officers involved in this effort should be easy to find as I know the names of MANY whom were involved supporting the mujahideen earlier.

They are, of course, easy to confuse for a western novice and merging the myth of the mujahideen with the taliban has been a source of informational subterfuge from those embracing the anti-American narrative for some time. To date, however, these "facts" remain nothing more than the usual conspiracy fodder that provides such topical entertainment in South Asia.

I hope that you'll show otherwise but, like the opium charade paraded about as a mantra of taliban purity, I suspect that there's nothing, nada, zero, zilch to these assertions. Please PROVE me wrong.

 

[waraich66]

I agreed that talaban were not supported by US.

But what american did after defeat of Russia is also history.

Talaban developed to fill the vacum of law lessness generated just after war.

Americans and western power looking wounded nation just as spectators.No one was intrested to help them to build their basic infrastructure.

Western were shown their anger when mullah omer destroyed 2000 years idols.But no body was intrested to feed their hungry childrens. dieing of hunger.

After 9/11 american realised that some thing going wrong in afghanistan.

You can not destroy the talabans even you use A bomb as you used in japan.

What american did with Dr AFIA is really shame full.Talaban never did this type of treatment with any american women

 

[Keysersoze]

Our friend S-2 has a great sense of humor!. He expects the “bad guys” to mount a white steed on a hill top, and charge an F-15E flying at 30,000 ft with his shining saber, and get his ticket punched to the Heavens!.

The US forces in Afghanistan are virtual prisoners, cannot even address the call of nature in a valley without a 40 kg protective suit. Rag tag Taleban have done them in, like it or not!.

Of late the US has been trying to fight the war on the cheap, pushing Pak Army to do their dirty job for peanuts. Economy in free fall back home has not helped things one bit. Without a massive injection of fresh money into Pakistan the prospects are definitely bleak.

Lol I love clueless posts like the above. It shows a basic lack of understanding of military tactics. They are having to fall back upon suicide bombings and roadside bombs because they get their arses handed to them everytime they would come out and try to go toe to toe with any NATO forces. There is plenty of evidence in video format of this.

And the "40kg suit" means that even if a Taliban or affiliated retard gets lucky enough to hit his target that chances are that the target will survive. (And probably kill a few more idiots)

 

[batmannow]

"...it was the same American CIA that formed and funded the taliban and then left them there after soviet-pakistan war."

Interesting. When was this war between the Soviet Union and Pakistan fought? I'm aware of a Soviet-AFGHAN war. Is that to what you actually refer?

If so, could you provide the documentation, names of involved C.I.A. agents, investigations, bills of lading, etc. which would corroborate your assertion that the taliban are a creation of the CIA? Last I heard, they were a spontaneous uprising of "simple students" in Kandahar in 1994 as a rejection of the warring militias throughout the nation, to include the Pashtu militias of Haqqani and Hekmatyar.

Their success, first in Kandahar, and later throughout the nation attracted the attention of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan who not only supported their efforts but bequeathed official recognition of their government and an exchange of ambassadors.

I don't recall anything from the U.S. Government except an initially noncommittal stance that raised no immediate objections- a "wait and see" perspectivie, if you will. This was rather quickly abandoned altogether.

I'll look forward to your serious evidence though, I hope, you don't simply resort to heaping further unsubstantiated allegations upon me. Most importantly, the names of those C.I.A. officers involved in this effort should be easy to find as I know the names of MANY whom were involved supporting the mujahideen earlier.

They are, of course, easy to confuse for a western novice and merging the myth of the mujahideen with the taliban has been a source of informational subterfuge from those embracing the anti-American narrative for some time. To date, however, these "facts" remain nothing more than the usual conspiracy fodder that provides such topical entertainment in South Asia.

I hope that you'll show otherwise but, like the opium charade paraded about as a mantra of taliban purity, I suspect that there's nothing, nada, zero, zilch to these assertions. Please PROVE me wrong.

Dear S-2; sir
my dear friend, plz stop looking from US prespective, i guss it will be good for both of nations, if your purpose here to argue, the establishment of coopreation to fight terrorism thn its very nice , but if you want to blame pakistan any way, thn you are on the wrong side my friend.....
pakistan and pakitanis were facing this terror long before 9\11, afghan war was a war, between soviet russia and pakistan, afghan people were a part of this long battle, but pakistanis were standing with them ,& fighting side by side occupation of afghanistan.

its a long history , i think you need the study of that subject. but plz stop blaming pakistan & pakistanis, & plz start accepting that US is occupying afghanistan, thus people's of afghanistan are resisting US OCCOUPATION!

 

[fatman17]

^^^i think i will stay out of this one! - I'll go to the best english movies post!